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  1. #21
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Wow, you are overreacting.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  2. #22

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    ISFJs feel empathy. I mean, I do.

    Not all ISFJ's are alike however, just like not all people of other types are alike.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    I think you are mega sensitive.



    Quote Originally Posted by KLessard View Post
    She is oblivious, as you say. Because if you point it out to her, she doesn't understand what you're talking about. So I don't insist, and I'm too crushed to insist.
    She's not 100% J, she has some P (30-40%), but her mental structure is SJ, mainly.

    She doesn't feel empathy. I told her my father had died (we hadn't seen each other in around 9 years) and she had known him. I saw her trying to fake a serious facial expression that would fit, and then proceeded to the I'm sorry thing, with no real appropriate emotion to it. After I explained the whole thing to her, she said: "I can't imagine how I would feel if that happened to my parents."
    1- Tell your friend how you feel .. She isn't a mindreader.
    2 - She doesn't feel empathy because she didn't act appropriately when telling her your father passed away .. Or maybe she felt very awkward and even slightly shocked as she had known him.
    3 - Stop speculating.
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  4. #24
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    I think you are mega sensitive.

    That's very NF, by the way. We feel things soulfully, and care very deeply. I can't help it. It's all right, I understand what's happening inside her, and I'm ok about it, but I could't help feeling very sad at the moment it happened. (I had made a very long trip Qubec - Nova Scotia to see her and she didn't cooperate much to make it worthwhile.)

  5. #25
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Wow, you are overreacting.
    Probably. I know she wouldn't hurt me on purpose. I'm just frustrated at myself for trying to reach out to her in an N way for many years (my efforts would have created a very meaningful friendship with another N - I've seen it happen), but for this S, it's a language she doesn't understand. I'm trying to spell it out in a way she will understand with that letter (I hope she will).

  6. #26
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
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    All I can think of is becareful of inadvertedly harming your relationships due to MBTI understanding. Otherwise I can sympathise or empathise with her on the issue of not knowing how to react to someone telling you that a loved one has passed away. Unless a person has specifically felt a similar situation in their lives, empathy is more likely to be projection than the real thing itself. I don't bother trying to understand my friend when she talks about someone close to her that commits suicide, because any speculation I can come up with will not be sufficient to match the pain that the other person experiences.

  7. #27
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kai View Post
    All I can think of is becareful of inadvertedly harming your relationships due to MBTI understanding.

    I'm aware of that, thank you.

    Also, I don't resent her at all for not empathizing about my father's death. I just feel it illustrated her difficulty with empathy.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Lambchop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KLessard View Post
    Yes, I would like to befriend her in a deeper way. I've tried my best at it, but since I'm not on her list of priorities (family, close friends and her community) - and since we live in different provinces, I'm just rarely within reach of her S. For N types, this is not a problem, but for Sensitives, it is.
    She is NOT T at all, she is really ISFJ. She's very kind and sweet, but in this very polite way. It's not deep and honest in the NF way. She is sympathetic, not empathetic. Big difference.
    I don't understand, kind and sweet is only deep and honest in the NF way? I just don't find that to be true. I'm an ISFJ and I'm a very deep and honest person. Maybe she's just overwhelmed or overloaded (as we frequently are) and right now doesn't have the emotional energy or ability to be there for you in the way you want/need her to be?

  9. #29
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KLessard View Post
    Probably. I know she wouldn't hurt me on purpose. I'm just frustrated at myself for trying to reach out to her in an N way for many years (my efforts would have created a very meaningful friendship with another N - I've seen it happen), but for this S, it's a language she doesn't understand. I'm trying to spell it out in a way she will understand with that letter (I hope she will).
    This sounds like a friend zone scenario. Have you ever heard of the friend zone? It's common. I'm pretty sure there are N's who put other N's in the friend zone all the time. It's not just something S's do. And I'm pretty sure there are S's who get friend zoned too.

  10. #30
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lambchop View Post
    I don't understand, kind and sweet is only deep and honest in the NF way?
    I'm talking about this person in particular. I keep getting this impression that her kindness is superficial and that she has two faces, because when I'm in front of her, she's sweet and kind, but when she has her back turned, she forgets her word and acts in a way that seems very contrary to the kindness she was showing me when she was talking to me. Hence the impression that it's not honest.
    But NFs and SJs have very different motivations, and I once read in Keirsey's work that NFs will often perceive SJs as superficial. You know... the idea of saving appearances and being polite. For NFs, being polite can mean that you're hiding your real emotions and thoughts.
    For me, being frank is only being respectful to the person I'm speaking to.

    I find all of your comments here very defensive, as if I was being really mean and all. I'm not mad at her anymore and doing my best to understand her and cooperate. I am not sending out a single accusation in the letter I wrote to her.

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