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  1. #1

    Default ISTJ's will you answer this please?

    I have a question that I am looking to see if I can find an answer to. (thank you in advance)

    Here is my question, and instead of giving details (which I happily would if asked) I thought I would make it a general question.

    It seems most of ISTJ behavior is very purposeful...words and actions match.

    In saying that, if an ISTJ makes a very radical change in behavior...does that reflect what is going on in their mind?

    For instance.....if an ISTJ is committed to an idea/direction/commitment/ and they are on track to fullfill that direction and suddenly their behavior reflects completely the opposite of that idea/direction/commitment they have been pursuing: does that mean they have changed their mind and therefore it is reflected in their actions?

    Also, very importantly....whatever your answer is...does it apply to both logical and emotional situations?

    **one other add, would they announce this change (if it is indeed a change) or just change directions?

  2. #2
    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
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    I'm an ISTJ, and in my case I would say that yes, my words pretty much match my actions. I'm pretty straightforward and sincere with others. I would rather take a distance from someone than play along in a way that isn't authentic for me.

    As for the rest of your question, I find it difficult to answer without more details. I can only say how it would apply to me as an ISTJ myself. I have made two major life changing decisions in my life. Turnarounds of 180 degrees. One was a career change. From a young age I was super dedicated to becoming a classical musician. I cannot express how much I wanted this and how hard I worked. And then, when I was in my early twenties, for reasons I won't go into here, I dropped music completely. Changed degrees and don't play music at all now. It's not that I'm complexed about it or anything, I just radically changed as a person, realised new things and my priorities and aims changed too and playing music is just not something that has any interest for me any more. The other big change was when I finally became clear about what I believe existentially and ideologically. As a result of this change, my lifestyle is completely different now. If you met me now, you wouldn't ever imagine how I used to be. This has also involved leaving relationships behind that couldn't accept the new me.

    Also, once I decided to make these changes, it was relatively easy to make a sharp, quick cut from the past and past attachments. So for me, in both cases I had a period of serious reflection and thinking/research, I changed my mind and then changed my actions accordingly.

    > Also, very importantly....whatever your answer is...does it apply to both logical and emotional situations? <
    For me, yes, it was both. The changes involved situations that had both logical and emotional aspects.

    > Would they announce this change (if it is indeed a change) or just change directions? <
    I made the changes purely for myself without much need for outside approval but I made announcements to the people I thought needed to know.

    Do let us know more if it would help you. I don't know your particular situation or why you want to have the answers you're looking for so I don't know if what I've said is applicable or any help.

  3. #3
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    In saying that, if an ISTJ makes a very radical change in behavior...does that reflect what is going on in their mind?

    For instance.....if an ISTJ is committed to an idea/direction/commitment/ and they are on track to fullfill that direction and suddenly their behavior reflects completely the opposite of that idea/direction/commitment they have been pursuing: does that mean they have changed their mind and therefore it is reflected in their actions?

    Also, very importantly....whatever your answer is...does it apply to both logical and emotional situations?
    I would say yes. If my mind changed, then my action would change. It's pretty hard to consciously watch our action constantly anyway.

    Yes for logical. Not sure for emotional.
    **one other add, would they announce this change (if it is indeed a change) or just change directions?
    I find that during the days after I changed my mind about something, I would tell the first couple of close friends i meet + a small special selection of friends. After I internalized the decision, there would no further announcement.

  4. #4
    Carerra Lu IZthe411's Avatar
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    Yes, if my mind changed, my actions would change. I wouldn't continue with the previous actions if they weren't leading me to where I need to be, and I would not do it to keep up some image.

    It would affect emotions as well.

    Like someone mentioned, no one is 100% consistent in thoughts and actions. ISTJs are probably the best at it, but not absolute.

    Depending on the nature of the change I'd tell others. If it's relationship based, I'd probably tell them 'it's over' instead of changing my actions toward them. It would be too hard and a waste of energy to lead them along.

  5. #5
    Perfect Gentleman! =D d@v3's Avatar
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    Yes, and they probably won't announce the change... you will have to ask them bluntly why they changed.
    Freedom Isn't Free. [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  6. #6
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cornflakegirl View Post
    In saying that, if an ISTJ makes a very radical change in behavior...does that reflect what is going on in their mind?

    For instance.....if an ISTJ is committed to an idea/direction/commitment/ and they are on track to fullfill that direction and suddenly their behavior reflects completely the opposite of that idea/direction/commitment they have been pursuing: does that mean they have changed their mind and therefore it is reflected in their actions?

    Also, very importantly....whatever your answer is...does it apply to both logical and emotional situations?

    **one other add, would they announce this change (if it is indeed a change) or just change directions?
    Yes, if my mind changed, my actions would probably change too. It could potentially apply to both logical and emotional situations. I would probably not announce the change, just... change.

  7. #7
    Senior Member AutumnReverie's Avatar
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    I'd have to agree with what's been said so far: If my mind changed, then my actions would change as well to match -- definitely for logical situations, possibly for emotional situations.

    I wouldn't announce the change but if someone asked me about it, I would tell them.

  8. #8

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    I appreciate all of your insight. Thank you very much for taking the time to answer this for me.

    I also thought I might go into some detail about the situation.

    I am asking for advice before I give advice to my best friend. She is very much in love with this man. I do believe that he genuinely is also in love with her. There is a twist however that was unexpected and has changed the natural course of their relationship.

    He is in his late 30's, very career oriented and has not been successful in a prior marriage. He was dating an (ESFJ?) prior to dating my friend. That relationship ended very badly as she was very manipulative and threatening. I was told they dated for a couple of years and it was a rollercoaster ride. As it was ending he met my friend.
    My friend is very similar to him. She is an INTP. She is career oriented, a good mother and had been married previously.

    They seemed a perfect match. They both felt they found their soulmate in life. Not rushing into anything...though marriage was brought up in future plans.

    The twist- his ex calls to tell him she is pregnant.

    Long story short. Painstakingly he returned to the ex to do the right thing by his child.
    My friend was heartbroken, though she supported his decision. They have remained in touch though for the first year she pulled away to give him time to focus and see if that was what he truly wanted.

    FAST FORWARD TO TODAY:

    They have been in touch now again for about 6 months.

    When he left my friend to return to the ex, he had drawn a very deep line in the sand. That all they could ever be is friends and he was 'in love' with the mother of his child.
    Not only was his action so brisk and his words so cutting and just truly unbelievable, she was left wounded and befuddled. Though, to my friends credit she was so classy and told him that even if she didnt understand how his feelings could change so quickly that she admired and understood his commitment to his child and told him that her feelings went beyond the situation and though she walked away at the time (he has always been open to 'friendship' during this) she couldnt imagine her life without him in it.
    BTW, they have not seen each other during all of this, all contact has been via email.

    So, here is where we enter with the questions I first came to you regarding. The reason being that although she has attempted to move on, she is still very much in love with this man. She dates etc, though her mind is trying to move past him her heart will not let her. This is a very healthy individual and she is handling it very well. The problem is now their contact has changed and I see her struggling and regressing from where she had healed some.

    From when she first had contact with him again it was again restated by him, almost defensively that although they had what they had reality had changed. He made sure to redefine that boundary. She agreed, as she is also a very correct person with conviction to God knowing that this relationship was a very fine line and that in loving him she had to respect his marriage. Also in respecting herself not becoming his emotional pacificer.

    For several months their contact was all discussing mutual friends/news/politics etc. They share a lot of interests...so having enjoyed a lot of their relationship in doing those things it seems that is the course they took.
    She has shown me the correspondence, I saw where there was a sudden change in him about two months ago.

    It went from a very non-emotional (though there were times they touched on some personal issues and both telling each other how important the others happiness is to them etc) to a complete stop for a month. He had a family emergency come up and took leave from work to address it. He told her it involved his wife's parent passing away.
    Upon return from that month it was like an entirely different person was on the other end of those emails.

    This is where I am so afraid to tell her anything without being very sure of what I may think is going on. He has already hurt her so much, and honestly now I am looking at the situation and thinking he is very hurt also. At one time I was very, very angry with him. Now I am putting the entire picture together and thinking something completely different may have transpired.

    Since his return, his email contact is more brief. No more politics/news and chit chat. It is very revealing. In these ways.

    *He is referencing past emotional situations between the two of them.
    *He is bringing up (though in a round about manner) intimate things that transpired
    between them.
    *He is referring to things as 'we'. For example; when we do this or that.....with future tense.
    *He is asking her to do things on his behalf within the group they used to hang around with. Such as...tell so and so I said this.
    *Suddenly he was challenging her and trying to play with her like the used to do (they played a lot) and he was pushing her to move in that direction.
    *Telling her places he could be found, where he is at any given time and things he was doing (which all of that had been COMPLETELY shut off)

    So, it all boils down to this. If he was with her, and open to her in the beginning and then the sudden change with the pregnancy shutting all of it down. I can't help but think something has had to change on his end to being opening in up again the way he is.

    What I am so afraid of is giving her my opinion on this and being wrong. I do not want to encourge her opening herself back up to him. At this point she is very skeptical and still staying in the 'friend' mode with him.

    I am to the point I think he did solely return to the ex out of duty to the situation and his accountablity to it. I think my friend is the love of his life. I just dont think he knew how to handle it. He reacted the way he thought was correctly.

    So, that is the story. That is why I am asking for help. I do not want to hurt my friend. I do not want to encourage her to do anything that will damage her.

    I am asking your advice and opinions. Thank you all again.

  9. #9
    Let's make this showy! raz's Avatar
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    Holy block of text, batman. I was going to reply but I'll read that later.


  10. #10
    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
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    Default Let him come to her

    Thanks for the additional info. Here's my two cents for what it's worth: I'm generally not a fan of going back to being “friends” after a relationship has broken up. It can lead to confusing situations such as this one. I am also not a big fan of the woman second guessing what the guy's hints and suggestions might mean. Call me old-fashioned, but some advice my dad once gave me has proved to be very true for me in my experience and from what I have seen in the relationships of my friends: “If he wants you, he will come.” Don't go see him, don't think about him too much, if he wants you, he will come to you, no matter how far he has to go, to the moon, etc. – or something to that effect, I don't remember the precise words any more. And this is nothing to with being ISTJ or whatever. When push came to shove, he chose his child over her. This child is still in the picture, no matter what's happening with the wife. And he is still married. His problems with his wife are his own business and not something your friend should be worrying about. In my opinion, your friend shouldn't get her hopes up and should draw a very strong mental line between her and him that puts him in the “just friends” category if she wants to maintain the contact. Otherwise, if I were her, I would take a big distance or cut it off so she can make the space for someone who has the space in his life for her. Best of luck to your friend.

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