[MBTI General] How to tell the difference between ISTJ and INTJ.

[Uytuun]

This is one the harder ones to know right off. Some of my favorite ISTJs have a really strong tertairy Ne, so the feel much more open and more abstract than you would expect.

I sometimes have to know them for a bit to tell.

How can you tell them apart young-my todd is an IXTJ and I would love to know how S and N would differ here.

What do little INTJs do for fun?

Weird shit. Engaging the imagination. Reading. Muttering to themselves.

The difference in vibe is noticeable to me - I would say that ISTJs are better at and consider facts to be more important. They are also more able to relate to people. Ask them how they feel about family and what their goals are, chances are INTJs want a good job (interesting, challenging, prestigious) and ISTJs consider it natural that certain limitations will be put into place such as staying somewhat close to family, job security...They can have a rad sense of humour (due to Ne?), but there's no Ni in there, they have little patience with the unconscious and sometimes fuzzy intuitive notions that drive the INTJ...they are not surrealistically absurd. They are more empirical than the INTJ and get more stuff done than the INTJ whose Ni/Fi can sweep them off track. Si-Te seems like a more natural combo than Ni-Te.

My ISTJ friend finds a lot of things that I don't consider established at all to be very self-evident.

 

[Eagle]

It's infinitely debatable. However, there was a study some time ago that showed that the average INTJ IQ is higher than the average ISTJ IQ. Is this to say they're smarter? Is this to say that any given INTJ is going to be "smarter" than any given ISTJ? On both counts, the answer is no. But, instead of going into a long-winded post, I put the idea in politically incorrect layman's terms.

Better.
However, seeing as typically IQ tests favor people with N over S it's technically biased results anyways.

Make it more purdy and say

"INTJs will probably excel at traditionally 'intellectual' pursuits like computers or math whereas ISTJs..."

Forget it, I missed the boat.

Still not quite it. Planning might be a good one. Things like strategy and such are considered normal for NT's to be better at. Another difference is a preference for the theoretical over say, the physical.

 

[EJCC]

Many INTJs I know act more like INFJs than like ISTJs. I read somewhere that many INTJs can get to be amazingly good at reading people, like INFJs, only it's more of an analytical process for them. Whereas, ISTJs aren't quite as good at that.

 

[raz]

If you're trying to do something, both an ISTJ and INTJ will critique you, but they'll do it in different ways.

The INTJ will look at what you're doing and will tell you ways that you can do what you're doing more efficiently or talk about different things what you're doing might be capable of.

The ISTJ will look at what you're doing and instead of seeing the possibility in what you're doing, they will look at the work you're doing and compare it to the way that it should be done. They'll make note of errors you made and tell you which rules you didn't follow for doing the task.

 

[Take Five]

If you're trying to do something, both an ISTJ and INTJ will critique you, but they'll do it in different ways.

The INTJ will look at what you're doing and will tell you ways that you can do what you're doing more efficiently or talk about different things what you're doing might be capable of.

The ISTJ will look at what you're doing and instead of seeing the possibility in what you're doing, they will look at the work you're doing and compare it to the way that it should be done. They'll make note of errors you made and tell you which rules you didn't follow for doing the task.

I tell a mature woman who consistently cannot find her car keys that this behavior is silly and she should establish a place that she puts the keys when not using them as to never lose them. Couldn't this kind of fit both categories?

 

[Eiddy]

I wouldn't mind getting on the bad side of an INTJ, they would probably wander off muttering to themselves how stupid people can be.

On the other hand an ISTJ, would probably be in your face about it and won't leave until the situation is resolved.

It can be a good thing on both sides, one decides it's not worth it to argue, the other will accomplish something from it.

 

[NewEra]

I wouldn't mind getting on the bad side of an INTJ, they would probably wander off muttering to themselves how stupid people can be.

On the other hand an ISTJ, would probably be in your face about it and won't leave until the situation is resolved.

It can be a good thing on both sides, one decides it's not worth it to argue, the other will accomplish something from it.

Eh... I wouldn't be so sure. I'd rather be on the bad side of a fellow ISTJ than an INTJ. The INTJs seem more like heartless strategists than the ISTJ who can find more practical things to do than plan for revenge.

 

[ajblaise]

When you see an ISTJ with a calculator they're doing accounting.
When you see an INTJ with a calculator they're doing advanced calculus.

 

[Totenkindly]

The underlying vision is different and makes a big difference in presentation.

ISTJ's running off Si are using that as a point of reference. If they are in their original environment (the one that originated the Si "hard drive image" so to speak), then they generally will not make waves and only start to cause friction when the culture changes around them, since they want to put it back to "what it should be" or "what makes sense" based on what it used to be.

INTJ's running from Ni are keying off their internal Ni vision, which might or might not match the external world, and they generally have no fear about challenging or changing things in order to align with what makes sense based on their VISION. You'll see them far more apt to stir things up; ISTJs tend to maintain the original system and challenge changes.

ISTJs also tend to follow the established social etiquette for that context, where INTJs are again letting Ni + Te guide (so they'll do what they need to do, with the vision and its implementation driving their behavior towards others).

Both will use Te well to implement what they see -- but you're going to see ISTJ using Te in typical, established, tried-and-true ways (they tend to distrust unproven or speculative procedures)... whereas INTJ is far more apt to use Te to implement speculative ideas that "should" work even if they haven't been tested yet.

 

[NewEra]

IN regards to leadership ability, leaders a grown more so than natural. INTJs might better leaders, but to be a good leader you have to be a good follower. Maybe they are seen as better leaders or more natural leaders in general because they refuse to follow, or have more trouble doing so seeing as ISTJs generally don't have trouble submitting to authority. I say generally because I have authority issues.. I want to be incharge.

I sort of disagree about leadership being grown in, I think in some people, it is definitely more natural to lead. I said in general, I don't mean that INTJs are always better leaders than ISTJs. There are definitely exceptions.

 

[Eiddy]

practical

Plan for revenge???

 

[Litvyak]

the INTJ's like to read poetry

No.

[*]The INTJ is likely smarter

NO.

INTJs are dorkier.

No.

INTJs are more abstract, imaginative, and head-in-the-clouds. They are more ingenious. In general, they have better leadership ability. They also seem more random (because of the leading Ni).

YES!

I think that INTJs are more likely to annoy ISTJs then the other way around. (opinions?)

No. INTs can find Guardians extremely annoying.

ETA:

there was a study some time ago that showed that the average INTJ IQ is higher than the average ISTJ IQ.

1.) Written by an INTJ on a blog
2.) Without any named sources

 

[NewEra]

YES!

Thanks. I've noticed this from interacting with a couple of INTJs I know personally. They're quite different from me, I argue with one of them a lot.

 

[Take Five]

The underlying vision is different and makes a big difference in presentation.

ISTJ's running off Si are using that as a point of reference. If they are in their original environment (the one that originated the Si "hard drive image" so to speak), then they generally will not make waves and only start to cause friction when the culture changes around them, since they want to put it back to "what it should be" or "what makes sense" based on what it used to be.

INTJ's running from Ni are keying off their internal Ni vision, which might or might not match the external world, and they generally have no fear about challenging or changing things in order to align with what makes sense based on their VISION. You'll see them far more apt to stir things up; ISTJs tend to maintain the original system and challenge changes.

ISTJs also tend to follow the established social etiquette for that context, where INTJs are again letting Ni + Te guide (so they'll do what they need to do, with the vision and its implementation driving their behavior towards others).

Both will use Te well to implement what they see -- but you're going to see ISTJ using Te in typical, established, tried-and-true ways (they tend to distrust unproven or speculative procedures)... whereas INTJ is far more apt to use Te to implement speculative ideas that "should" work even if they haven't been tested yet.

If I really am an ISTJ, this is not necessarily true-at least the ISTJ part anyway. I like to change the ways of things to make everything work better. For me, and others probably, sometimes stirring things up happens. In fact, I honestly don't even try to avoid it, except in certain polite company.

 

[NewEra]

If I really am an ISTJ, this is not necessarily true-at least the ISTJ part anyway. I like to change the ways of things to make everything work better. For me, and others probably, sometimes stirring things up happens. In fact, I honestly don't even try to avoid it, except in certain polite company.

+1. The respecting authority part is not true for me if the authority figure has been unfair.

 

[Take Five]

I'm not sure that leadership ability is a good criterion for these types. Unless you define leadership as simply taking charge, which would still be doubtful. This is more of a character and individual thing than a personality one imo.

 

[NewEra]

I'm not sure that leadership ability is a good criterion for these types. Unless you define leadership as simply taking charge, which would still be doubtful. This is more of a character and individual thing than a personality one imo.

But character goes hand-in-hand with personality, right? Maybe I should rephrase... I think in general INTJs have a better ability to lead, but that doesn't necessarily make them better leaders.

 

[Take Five]

But character goes hand-in-hand with personality, right? Maybe I should rephrase... I think in general INTJs have a better ability to lead, but that doesn't necessarily make them better leaders.

personality does not equal character. Again, this definition of leadership is problematic. Is leadership ability defined as likeliness to try to take charge? Is skill dependent on how willing others are to follow? To me this is mixing apples with oranges.

 

[Virtual ghost]

No. INTs can find Guardians extremely annoying.

I am waiting how long it will take for this argument to appear.
I have said this because I think that INTJ is more likely to annoy ISTJ.
While ISTJ will simply be boring to an INTJ instead of annoying.

Reverse situations are possible but somwhat less likely.

 

[JivinJeffJones]

IN regards to leadership ability, leaders a grown more so than natural. INTJs might better leaders, but to be a good leader you have to be a good follower. Maybe they are seen as better leaders or more natural leaders in general because they refuse to follow, or have more trouble doing so seeing as ISTJs generally don't have trouble submitting to authority. I say generally because I have authority issues.. I want to be incharge.

Personally I've never really understood the "to be a good leader you have to be a good follower" maxim. INTJs tend to be good leaders because they are goal-oriented, pragmatic, adaptable and very strategic. With everything they ask themselves "How does this serve the goal, and the critical path to that goal?" If it doesn't, they ditch it and try something else. They don't have a problem with confrontation, yet aren't especially egotistical (at least, not where the goal is concerned) and so are open to suggestion.

Factors in why they make such poor followers:
1. high value on autonomy
2. intolerant of fuzzy thinking, especially when it hinders the goal
3. often offend leaders when objecting to #2 through lack of diplomacy
4. natural leadership qualities when coupled with the underrated charisma of this type can lead to them accumulating a following of people disgruntled with the current leadership (or creating one), especially if they are in a position which denies them a realistic ability to change policy
5. unforgiving of leadership mistakes
6. generally unhappy doing as they're told if it seems to them to hinder the goal. The reasons for doing something may be ultimately sound and may involve more factors than the INTJ is aware of, but until the INTJ discovers this for themselves they will be unhappy with perceived inefficiency. Some leaders may be fine with explaining how things fit in to the bigger picture, but most probably won't.

There are more, but this post is too long already.

I haven't really addressed ISTJs here, but in general I'd say they are more focused on doing things the right way than doing the right things. More concerned with process than with the goal, though that's an oversimplification, and relative.