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Thread: Ask an ESTJ!

  1. #321
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    ^^ You INTP ladies. I wish I knew some of you irl so I could be your buddy.
    If you lived in Central Florida, (or if I lived where you do) I'd definitely be your buddy!
    ~luck favors the ready~


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  2. #322
    [bento boxed] EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    If you lived in Central Florida, (or if I lived where you do) I'd definitely be your buddy!
    Ah, too bad. I live way west of you... Can we be long distance buddies?

    Random factoid #2 (and I've kind of said this already, but this is a long thread, so it bears repeating):




    A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT
    TO ALL WHO DISLIKE ESTJS BECAUSE THEY "FORCE THEIR OPINIONS ON OTHERS"


    We don't think of them as our "opinions". We think of them as "the way things are supposed to be". Black and white, you know?

    THEREFORE...

    We are NOT as arrogant as you think!

    IN ADDITION...

    If your way is more efficient, and you PROVE it to us (thereby introducing a gray into our black/white color scheme), WE CAN BE CONVINCED. It is WAY easier to convince us of things than you might think. Just because we SEEM immovable in our positions, doesn't mean an article from the New York Times, or a study done at the National Institute of Health, won't change our minds.

    THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME




    .... are there any more questions for this ESTJ?
    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  3. #323
    Perfect Gentleman! =D d@v3's Avatar
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    How do we know if we have successfully convinced you though? It's not like you actually ADMIT that you were wrong!

    For instance, if you are trying to figure out how to fix something, and the idea that has worked for you before isn't working, and someone comes along and fixes it using his or her own idea. Then what? From my experience the ESTJ sheepishly says "thanks". IF that even. Otherwise they skip the "thanks" and go straight to the "Wow do you know how long I've been trying to fix this?" etc..
    Freedom Isn't Free. [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  4. #324
    [bento boxed] EJCC's Avatar
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    ^^ Well, it sounds like you've got it down. You know the phrases Some other ones are:
    "All right." (begins fixing it like you said to do)
    "...Okay, we'll do that, then." (if it's a work situation)
    etc. etc. etc.

    You really know that they've been convinced when they actually DO what you suggested to do. After that, it doesn't matter - you can sit in satisfaction knowing that you beat them.

    One (potentially) good way to know that you've convinced them is when they start to look embarrassed... 'cause that's why we don't (generally) admit when we're wrong. We feel like we look stupid ('cause we hold ourselves to high standards, often), and we're humiliated. So if, by any chance, you see physical signs of those emotions (e.g. blushing...), that could work, too.
    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  5. #325
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT
    TO ALL WHO DISLIKE ESTJS BECAUSE THEY "FORCE THEIR OPINIONS ON OTHERS"


    We don't think of them as our "opinions". We think of them as "the way things are supposed to be". Black and white, you know?

    THEREFORE...

    We are NOT as arrogant as you think!

    IN ADDITION...

    If your way is more efficient, and you PROVE it to us (thereby introducing a gray into our black/white color scheme), WE CAN BE CONVINCED. It is WAY easier to convince us of things than you might think. Just because we SEEM immovable in our positions, doesn't mean an article from the New York Times, or a study done at the National Institute of Health, won't change our minds.

    THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME




    .... are there any more questions for this ESTJ?
    Firstly, love the above.

    I have a question for you. How different are ESTJ and ESFJ? Its only 1 letter off.
    Would you obsess over Bejeweled (in the arcade) for over an hour to try and get in the top 3?
    Can you stop thinking? I think from the moment i wake until the moment i sleep. Even playing that game i was thinking all the way through. Mostly its crappy stuff, occasionally i am getting deep with myself.

    What are your thoughts?
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  6. #326
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Ah, too bad. I live way west of you... Can we be long distance buddies?

    Random factoid #2 (and I've kind of said this already, but this is a long thread, so it bears repeating):




    A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT
    TO ALL WHO DISLIKE ESTJS BECAUSE THEY "FORCE THEIR OPINIONS ON OTHERS"


    We don't think of them as our "opinions". We think of them as "the way things are supposed to be". Black and white, you know?

    THEREFORE...

    We are NOT as arrogant as you think!

    IN ADDITION...

    If your way is more efficient, and you PROVE it to us (thereby introducing a gray into our black/white color scheme), WE CAN BE CONVINCED. It is WAY easier to convince us of things than you might think. Just because we SEEM immovable in our positions, doesn't mean an article from the New York Times, or a study done at the National Institute of Health, won't change our minds.

    THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME
    Haha this reminds me of a public sign or flyer or something with important announcements.

  7. #327
    [bento boxed] EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne View Post
    Haha this reminds me of a public sign or flyer or something with important announcements.
    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    Firstly, love the above.
    Thanks! I was feeling random Also, it needed to be said!

    I have a question for you. How different are ESTJ and ESFJ? Its only 1 letter off.
    Well, there's the dominant function difference (me=Te, you=Fe), which is one of the biggest things, technically speaking. But speaking anecdotally, based on my experience with my two ESFJ friends... if you guys are the stereotypical "mom" (I'm sure you've heard that one once or twice... I don't need to elaborate), ESTJs are the stereotypical "dad". We're almost never afraid of conflict, we're bossy in an impersonal way (managers even outside of work), and instead of wanting to be the maternal figure in our group of friends/family, we want to be the strong, unwavering guardian, protecting them from all harm - like a father figure. (Of course, this is NOT gender-specific, and I know that it isn't politically correct, but I'm talkin' about 1950's-esque stereotypes here.)

    Would you obsess over Bejeweled (in the arcade) for over an hour to try and get in the top 3?
    Oh, totally, if I thought I had a chance. If I was just a beginner at it, then no way. (I'd do that with Dance Dance Revolution, though )

    Can you stop thinking? I think from the moment i wake until the moment i sleep. Even playing that game i was thinking all the way through. Mostly its crappy stuff, occasionally i am getting deep with myself.
    Yeah, I can stop thinking. Or, at least, I can get myself to think incredibly single-mindedly, which can be very zen and relaxing, especially if I have a lot of things that I could be worrying about at any given time. Some of my favorite activities for that are knitting, working out, and cleaning. However, with pretty much any task that I'm given (that I'm serious about), I can shove all else out of my mind and throw all my energy into that particular task. Sometimes when I'm in passionate conversation, I have no idea if I'm thinking. Occasionally I've succeeded in meditating (it helps me fall asleep sometimes). When I'm tired, I space out, which, I suppose, means that I'm not thinking.

    What are your thoughts?
    It varies. "I need to call that one guy..." "What was I about to do, again?", "Five times two, carry the one...", "OMG I'M WORRIED ABOUT THIS DEADLINE", etc. etc. etc.
    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  8. #328
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Well, there's the dominant function difference (me=Te, you=Fe), which is one of the biggest things, technically speaking. But speaking anecdotally, based on my experience with my two ESFJ friends... if you guys are the stereotypical "mom" (I'm sure you've heard that one once or twice... I don't need to elaborate), ESTJs are the stereotypical "dad". We're almost never afraid of conflict, we're bossy in an impersonal way (managers even outside of work), and instead of wanting to be the maternal figure in our group of friends/family, we want to be the strong, unwavering guardian, protecting them from all harm - like a father figure. (Of course, this is NOT gender-specific, and I know that it isn't politically correct, but I'm talkin' about 1950's-esque stereotypes here.)
    OK, granted people have told me i am a great mom. I won't lie, it is true. However, when you use this analogy of mom and dad. It doesn't quite fit with me. I don't like conflict unless i am fighting someone's cause then i am in knee deep. Bossy, yes. If people just listen to my way of doing things, then you'll see its a win win situation (although i am open to other suggestions). I do in the workplace find people who won't stick up for themselves and i'll jump in and protect them. You say this is down to Te and Fe. I have looked into it but i need to find a test or something that tells me i am this percentage of this and that percentage of that. Does a test of these sorts actually exist?

    I don't feel like i fit the box so i must find more information to make it concrete. Do you think like that at all?


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Yeah, I can stop thinking. Or, at least, I can get myself to think incredibly single-mindedly, which can be very zen and relaxing, especially if I have a lot of things that I could be worrying about at any given time. Some of my favorite activities for that are knitting, working out, and cleaning. However, with pretty much any task that I'm given (that I'm serious about), I can shove all else out of my mind and throw all my energy into that particular task. Sometimes when I'm in passionate conversation, I have no idea if I'm thinking. Occasionally I've succeeded in meditating (it helps me fall asleep sometimes). When I'm tired, I space out, which, I suppose, means that I'm not thinking.
    I do the same with tasks, 100% dedication and done to the best of my abilities. I just zone in and forget everything else.
    When i am having a passionate conversation, i find i just reel stuff off and sound bloody intelligent sometimes. Its later when i am thinking of what was said that i start thinking about it and how i came to that conclusion. I have to put the pieces together after but never during or i lose my concentration.
    When i space out in bed, i find my thinking process becomes more intense even though i am not thinking of anyway. Think clouds just drifting across the sky, thats my brain all the time.

    Thank you for this.
    Much appreciated.
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  9. #329
    [bento boxed] EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    OK, granted people have told me i am a great mom. I won't lie, it is true. However, when you use this analogy of mom and dad. It doesn't quite fit with me. I don't like conflict unless i am fighting someone's cause then i am in knee deep. Bossy, yes. If people just listen to my way of doing things, then you'll see its a win win situation (although i am open to other suggestions). I do in the workplace find people who won't stick up for themselves and i'll jump in and protect them. You say this is down to Te and Fe. I have looked into it but i need to find a test or something that tells me i am this percentage of this and that percentage of that. Does a test of these sorts actually exist?
    I'm sorry, I guess I wasn't as clear as I wanted. When I said "we", I meant "ESTJs", so no, of course you don't like conflict - ESTJs are fine with it, and ESFJs aren't. And when I was talking about wanting to protect your friends... well, what you described - sort of a freeing-the-oppressed INFJ-stereotype-esque thing - is very different from what I was talking about. Although ESTJs will do exactly what you described (often, if they can, and if they're nice), the motivation behind it is different. Even though a stereotypical mom and a stereotypical dad are equally protective, it's a different sort of protectiveness. Do you know what I mean?

    Based on what you just said in this paragraph, you sound like you fit with your type description. To clarify about the function thing, since I'm not sure if I understand it well enough to explain it, I'll direct you to the pages I was looking at. (I believe there's a test as to which functions you use most? or something like that? but each type has a definite function order, too. When I took the test, my result was not even close to my function order, but that's perfectly normal.)
    ESTJ Profile
    ESFJ Profile

    I don't feel like i fit the box so i must find more information to make it concrete. Do you think like that at all?
    Of course. No one is exactly like their Myers-Briggs profile. For instance, I'm not a natural leader (in many ways), I'm liberal politically, and I would NEVER join the military... contrary to what some websites may say. But it's nothing to worry about.
    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  10. #330
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Thank you for that.

    When i saw the profiles, i just thought 'Oh no'. There isn't much difference between us after reading them, i am surprised, well thats what i got from it anyway.

    I just have to admit i will never get the concrete facts. Never mind.
    I refuse to buy more books on the subject.
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

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