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Thread: Ask an ESTJ!

  1. #2011
    inside the lines EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Showbread View Post
    I have an ESTJ 1w2 father and we really can't seem to agree on anything... What would you say are some of the biggest differences between you and some of the ESFJs you know? Particularly in the way you view things like politics and various humanitarian issues?
    I haven't noticed a difference regarding politics/etc -- besides the obvious, i.e. that ESTJs are much more detached and cold about it when they describe their motivations for their political beliefs* -- but in terms of general differences? The major difference I've noticed, IME, is that ESFJs seem to be very calculated with their emotional decisions, whereas ESTJs are so terrible at that, that they end up barely handling them (or handling them childishly), if at all. Because chaos is antithetical to how ESTJs usually live their lives, it's frustrating beyond belief that they usually experience their emotions as a chaotic mess -- so, better to avoid getting overwhelmed by stuffing all that junk into the closet, shutting the door, and pretending like nothing's in there.

    Are your disagreements with your dad generally on philosophical things (e.g. politics)? Or is it more personal? (You don't have to answer if you don't want to)


    *notable exception being when they show their Fi marshmallow center (if you're so lucky... or something)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nørrsken impersonating EJCC
    It's strange. I keep banning morons, but they keep signing up? What is this?
    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  2. #2012
    climb on Showbread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post

    Are your disagreements with your dad generally on philosophical things (e.g. politics)? Or is it more personal? (You don't have to answer if you don't want to)
    I suppose mostly philosophical, particularly politics, and what is "fair" for lack of a better word. He just seems to lack the ability to see any given issue from any perspective other than his own. *I was talking about a friend of mine who has recently come out as gay and he kept asking questions like "But why is she gay?" "Is it because she doesn't get a long with her dad?"

    He just could not wrap his mind around the idea that just maybe, some people experience life and sexuality differently than he does. It's almost like if he doesn't understand it, it's wrong, or not real.

    * Side note, I fully support my friend and love her very much. If anything we've gotten closer since she shared this with me. I don't share my dad's opinion on the subject at all. It was just an example that came to mind.
    Friends, waffles, work

    "The problem is, when you depend on a substitute for love, you can never get enough" - Louis Cozolino

    3w2 6w7 1w2
    *Gryffindor*


  3. #2013
    inside the lines EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Showbread View Post
    It's almost like if he doesn't understand it, it's wrong, or not real.
    That's pretty close to how it feels from our end. I get the impression that this isn't universal, and that only a particular sort of ESTJ feels this(?), but when I'm in a situation like that, it REALLY bothers me to not be able to understand. It's like: "I've got to be missing something. There's no way this is as stupid as it looks." It's a combination between frustration at that apparent stupidity/ridiculosity/what have you, frustration at your inability to understand, and sometimes frustration at the other party for "not explaining well enough". Clearly your dad is like me in this regard: If he didn't want to learn, and to understand, he wouldn't be asking you questions. I know it's frustrating, but at the same time, he appears to still be humble, balanced, and objective (based on what you've told me).

    (I frel your pain, by the way. Been trying to work on my parents' anti-Muslim and anti-Catholic positions for a while now.)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nørrsken impersonating EJCC
    It's strange. I keep banning morons, but they keep signing up? What is this?
    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  4. #2014
    climb on Showbread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    That's pretty close to how it feels from our end. I get the impression that this isn't universal, and that only a particular sort of ESTJ feels this(?), but when I'm in a situation like that, it REALLY bothers me to not be able to understand. It's like: "I've got to be missing something. There's no way this is as stupid as it looks." It's a combination between frustration at that apparent stupidity/ridiculosity/what have you, frustration at your inability to understand, and sometimes frustration at the other party for "not explaining well enough". Clearly your dad is like me in this regard: If he didn't want to learn, and to understand, he wouldn't be asking you questions. I know it's frustrating, but at the same time, he appears to still be humble, balanced, and objective (based on what you've told me).

    (I frel your pain, by the way. Been trying to work on my parents' anti-Muslim and anti-Catholic positions for a while now.)
    Maybe a little bit too objective at times.
    Friends, waffles, work

    "The problem is, when you depend on a substitute for love, you can never get enough" - Louis Cozolino

    3w2 6w7 1w2
    *Gryffindor*


  5. #2015
    inside the lines EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Showbread View Post
    Maybe a little bit too objective at times.
    THERE IS NO SUCH THING.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nørrsken impersonating EJCC
    It's strange. I keep banning morons, but they keep signing up? What is this?
    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  6. #2016
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
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    How do you feel about people who don't have a career plan or secure job?
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  7. #2017
    Row row row your boat SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicolita View Post
    How do you feel about people who don't have a career plan or secure job?
    Due to the economy, that describes virtually everyone I know.
    1w2-6w5-3w2 so/sp

    "I took one those personality tests. It came back negative." - Dan Mintz

  8. #2018
    inside the lines EJCC's Avatar
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    Sorry I missed this, @five sounds!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    How do you feel about people who don't have a career plan or secure job?
    I think what would matter more to me would be whether the person is realizing their full potential. So I would see people without career plans and secure jobs as falling somewhere on a scale of 1 (realizing it, using their skills) and 10 (slacking).

    With the exception of people who have been screwed over by the economy:
    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    Due to the economy, that describes virtually everyone I know.
    ^
    Quote Originally Posted by Nørrsken impersonating EJCC
    It's strange. I keep banning morons, but they keep signing up? What is this?
    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  9. #2019
    Senior Member ColonelGadaafi's Avatar
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    Do you like me... feel annoyed when people formulate things wrong or can't think clearly?
    "Where can you flee? What road will you use to escape us? Our horses are swift, our arrows sharp, our swords like thunderbolts, our hearts as hard as the mountains, our soldiers as numerous as the sand. Fortresses will not detain us, nor arms stop us. Your prayers to God will not avail against us. We are not moved by tears nor touched by lamentations."

  10. #2020
    inside the lines EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelGadaafi View Post
    Do you like me... feel annoyed when people formulate things wrong or can't think clearly?
    Not generally. It only bothers me when I'm trying to do something quickly, and their lack of clarity is getting in my way.

    It actually bothers me more when other people are snippy with them, because it's not a pet peeve of mine. Why not be patient? Why not cut them a little slack? I know INTx folks who are snippy like that, and it strikes me as unnecessary, unproductive, and rude.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nørrsken impersonating EJCC
    It's strange. I keep banning morons, but they keep signing up? What is this?
    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

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