User Tag List

Page 113 of 259 FirstFirst ... 1363103111112113114115123163213 ... LastLast
Results 1,121 to 1,130 of 2589

Thread: Ask an ESTJ!

  1. #1121
    don't fence me in Array sui generis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    MBTI
    esTJ
    Enneagram
    875 sx/sp
    Socionics
    ESTx
    Posts
    746

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Hm... Maybe? My first instinct was something along the lines of

    Te: "I should be doing something productive."
    Ne: "Hey, let's draw a pretty picture, to put on the wall! "
    Te: "I guess I don't have that many decorations up there... so it's technically productive... Let's do it."

    What Si should be doing in this situation: "WTF PEOPLE I have a LONG LIST of things you could be doing that are WAY more productive."
    Which leads to...
    Te: "Oh right. Sorry Ne. Some other time."
    Ne: "... "
    OK, when you put it this way, sans jargon, I relate to it. I can procrastinate SO HARD when the task is unpleasant, and this behavior is so much more pronouced when I'm stressed out.
    Murphy Brown: What is it with us? Why can't we take the easy road once in awhile?
    Avery Brown: Because it's boring and dishonest and uncomfortable, like wearing a pair of shoes all day that pinch your feet.

    approx 55% ES, 90% TJ

  2. #1122
    Senior Member Array Keps Mnemnosyne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    Mm
    Posts
    400

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    ...
    Quote Originally Posted by Tamske View Post
    ...
    I guess I have to agree with both Tamske and EJCC...I guess it could go like this?

    Te: "I should be doing something productive."
    Ne: "Hey, let's draw a pretty picture, to put on the wall! "
    Te: "I guess I don't have that many decorations up there... so it's technically productive... Let's do it."
    Si (momentary):"WTF PEOPLE I have a LONG LIST of things you could be doing that are WAY more productive."
    Te: "Oh right. Sorry Ne. Some other time. Let's do this project!!!"
    Ne: "There has to be a better way of doing this."
    Te: "Let me think"
    Ne: "This improves the product."
    Te: "Implement it."
    Ne: "But what about this?"
    Te: "Which is better?"
    Ne: "Not sure."
    Te: "Let's be productive elsewhere until you know for sure."
    Ne: "Like drawing a pretty picture? "

    I know it's conjecture and I apologize for it and it's also still too simplistic I feel, but does it somewhat come close? There is still some Si, but it's has a weak influence and an inability to stop the cycle.
    Love wouldn't exist without loneliness to inspire it.

    Peach yogurt is made of love. And gnome kidneys. - Domino

    I can cope and will cope without polluting my lungs. - Saslou

  3. #1123
    Iron Maiden Array fidelia's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2 so/sx
    Posts
    9,424

    Default

    All dom-tert loops are hard to get out of because the behaviour seemed to keep cycling and spiralling deeper and deeper till you wear a big habitual thought/action rut into the ground. In an ideal world Si would step in, but I think Tamske is right that it rarely happens that quickly!

  4. #1124
    came back haunted Array EJCC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    173 so/sx
    Posts
    17,445

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Keps Mnemnosyne View Post
    I guess I have to agree with both Tamske and EJCC...I guess it could go like this?

    Te: "I should be doing something productive."
    Ne: "Hey, let's draw a pretty picture, to put on the wall! "
    Te: "I guess I don't have that many decorations up there... so it's technically productive... Let's do it."
    Si (momentary):"WTF PEOPLE I have a LONG LIST of things you could be doing that are WAY more productive."
    Te: "Oh right. Sorry Ne. Some other time. Let's do this project!!!"
    Ne: "There has to be a better way of doing this."
    Te: "Let me think"
    Ne: "This improves the product."
    Te: "Implement it."
    Ne: "But what about this?"
    Te: "Which is better?"
    Ne: "Not sure."
    Te: "Let's be productive elsewhere until you know for sure."
    Ne: "Like drawing a pretty picture? "

    I know it's conjecture and I apologize for it and it's also still too simplistic I feel, but does it somewhat come close? There is still some Si, but it's has a weak influence and an inability to stop the cycle.
    *Edited to remove my ridiculous misinterpretation of the above post, in which I thought I was being insulted*

    I actually think Tamske's section of the dialogue puts a little too much faith in Te From my experience, those downward spiral moments occur when my Te weakens in moments of stress and lets Ne rule in ways that it shouldn't.

    Here is a revised version that is very, very similar to Tamske's, but with weaker, more guilty Te (which is how mine is in these situations, but might not be how every ESTJ's is):

    Te: "I should be doing something productive."
    Ne: "Hey, let's draw a pretty picture, to put on the wall! "
    Te: "I guess I don't have that many decorations up there... so it's technically productive... Let's do it."
    Si:"WTF PEOPLE I have a LONG LIST of things you could be doing that are WAY more productive."
    Te: "Crap, you're right. I should be doing that... "
    Ne: "But it's boring and we hate it! And wouldn't it be better to do something interesting and creative?? "
    Te: "Well..."
    Ne: "Seriously - we hate this task, we don't like it - so let's do something interesting instead."
    Te: "... Fine. But I feel bad about this."
    Ne: "Feel bad about it later! NOW is about CREATIVITY!"
    *hours pass by*
    Ne: "The picture's done! And it's so pretty!!!"
    Te: "I guess... but I still feel really, really bad about this. The deadline is approaching. I should be doing my productive task. I really, really should."
    Ne: "You could do that OTHER work you have planned - you know, the project that's due later on in the week but isn't deathly boring!"
    Te: "I guess that's technically productive..."

    ... And the cycle repeats, and the spiral goes down, until the ESTJ has to resort to what most other people wouldn't have an issue with, but the ESTJ has issues with because of high standards - i.e. finishing the project within hours - or minutes - of when it's due. Because obviously there's an inevitable moment when it goes like this:

    Ne: "Fourteenth project: completed! Let's do another fun thing!"
    Te: "LET'S NOT! WHY DON'T YOU SHUT UP SO I CAN GET SOME WORK DONE!!!!!"
    Ne: ""
    Fi: "Sorry Ne, but it had to be said."
    Si: "Glad to see you've figured out what's REALLY important, Te. Now here's that priority list I was telling you about..."
    Last edited by EJCC; 09-16-2010 at 12:25 AM. Reason: Removing the stupidity
    "When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world -- 'No, YOU move.'"
    - Captain America

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  5. #1125
    Senior Member Array Keps Mnemnosyne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    Mm
    Posts
    400

    Default

    Using this:

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    ... And the cycle repeats, and the spiral goes down, until the ESTJ has to resort to what most other people wouldn't have an issue with, but the ESTJ has issues with because of high standards - i.e. finishing the project within hours - or minutes - of when it's due.
    What happens when the project is never due? As in for personal benefit or long-term goals? Would you say the cycle continues indefinitely or if it ends, why? Anyway to help the ESTJ in the cycle?
    Love wouldn't exist without loneliness to inspire it.

    Peach yogurt is made of love. And gnome kidneys. - Domino

    I can cope and will cope without polluting my lungs. - Saslou

  6. #1126
    came back haunted Array EJCC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    173 so/sx
    Posts
    17,445

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Keps Mnemnosyne View Post
    What happens when the project is never due? As in for personal benefit or long-term goals? Would you say the cycle continues indefinitely or if it ends, why? Anyway to help the ESTJ in the cycle?
    What happens is that we block it out. Happens to me almost every time - if I postpone it for long enough, and there's no inevitable/urgent due date for my Si to point out, then it goes so far off my radar that I completely and utterly forget about it. Only when someone reminds me will I go "Oh right! Whoops!" And even then, unless the reminder person gives me a reason to do that project that I hadn't thought of before that'll motivate me, I'll forget about it again.

    So... I guess the best way to help an ESTJ through it is to motivate them - and also to nag. But nagging will do no good unless motivation happens along with it.
    "When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world -- 'No, YOU move.'"
    - Captain America

    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    lawful good (D&D) / ravenclaw + wampus (HP) / boros legion (M:TG)
    conscientious > sensitive > serious (oldham)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  7. #1127
    Senior Member Array Keps Mnemnosyne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    Mm
    Posts
    400

    Default

    That's it. Thank you. I have the nagging part down. I would prefer to call it as gentle interrogation of whether he has completed something that he complained about not having done the previous week. I have yet to try the giving an additional reason though....that might be difficult for the situations, but it just makes it into a puzzle to solve.
    Love wouldn't exist without loneliness to inspire it.

    Peach yogurt is made of love. And gnome kidneys. - Domino

    I can cope and will cope without polluting my lungs. - Saslou

  8. #1128
    Writing... Array Tamske's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Posts
    1,764

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I actually think Tamske's section of the dialogue puts a little too much faith in Te From my experience, those downward spiral moments occur when my Te weakens in moments of stress and lets Ne rule in ways that it shouldn't.
    I put lots of faith in Te (except in my own, which is always nagging at the back of my head. I can't stop it even by doing the stupid needed things first, so why bother?)... I actually thought that in my little idea there still was too much Ne to be an ESTJ's Te-Ne loop
    Got questions? Ask an ENTP!
    I'm female. I just can't draw women

  9. #1129
    i love Array skylights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6w7 so/sx
    Socionics
    EII Ne
    Posts
    7,836

    Default

    lol. i'm familiar with Ne-Te looping

    for me it works like this:

    Ne: *idea*
    Te: "oh, nice. inefficient though. let's reorder it."
    Ne: another possibility
    Te: restructures
    Ne: adds additional elements to theory
    Te: builds on structure
    Ne: another possibility
    etc.

    Fi: "hey guys you're not really paying attention to how you might be hurting the people involved in this idea "
    Te: "shh Fi, our theory rocks."
    Ne: "damn straight. speaking of, i just realized..."

    Si: "hey, guys, we have a research paper to do."
    Te: "shit, we should start on that today so we can get some sleep tonight."
    Ne: "oh come on Si, this is interesting."
    Te: "yeah, but Si is totally right. plus that will be interesting too."
    Ne: "but not as much fun. plus we are, technically, being productive."
    Te: "well not really."

    Ne:
    Ne: *idea*
    Te: "ooh! maybe you could..."
    (proceeds)

    it usually lasts until Fi gets pissed off and explodes and then i feel guilty for ignoring it for so long, or when Si sounds the HEY IT'S GETTING TO THE POINT WHERE YOU HAVE TO WORK alarm. so basically Ne-Te loops cause me to ignore what i ought to be doing both in terms of realistic productivity and morality.

    it's interesting to hear how this is similar/different to the loop for ESTJs.

  10. #1130
    Permabanned Array
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    IT
    Posts
    147

    Default

    Any tips for courting this one: http://www.okcupid.com/profile/stillesf ?

Similar Threads

  1. [INTJ] Ask an INTJ
    By logan235711 in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 870
    Last Post: 05-22-2015, 05:04 AM
  2. [ISFJ] How to ask an ISFJ out?
    By Grungemouse in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 10-08-2009, 07:04 PM
  3. [MBTItm] How do you spot an ESTJ female?
    By INTJMom in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 12-23-2008, 01:27 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •