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  1. #1
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    Default so my gf is ESxJ...

    ...and I am IxTP.
    (I type her as ESxJ for the sake of precision, but I believe she's probably more F than T anyway.)
    We are in mid twenties and it's the first important relationship for the both of us. We've been together for about 2 years.

    Lately she's been telling me how much she's afraid of losing me and how much she can't live without me and how much she fears I'll betray her and how much she will love me forever etc. etc.
    She seems to be a little obsessed with fears ._.
    Our relationship has been steady, we haven't had major arguments for almost a year now, I AM the most loyal of men and never gave her any hint of the contrary. Our unresolved issue is marriage: she believes in it wholeheartedly, while I am very scared of formal/legal commitment (my parents sucked -hard- at living together, I have scars).
    To me, feelings of insecurity in a relationship are something to be suppressed: everyone should be independent, in a relationship or not. But obviously I am just a hopeless introvert thinker and I don't know shit about "love" as she experiences it! Her fears could be perfectly normal, that's why I'm posting here...

    AND, maybe I feel imprisoned by her growing emotional dependency on me (or maybe I am just inventing problems in my head.) Actually, I don't understand my own feelings very well too..

    Is there anything I can do about her fears? Should I do anything?
    Is it normal for an ESxJ female to have such fears and to be SO OPENLY VOCAL about them? Could it be just a bad period? (she has exams, she should finish her nursing degree in which she is very emotionally invested for her selfesteem..).
    Should I reassure her of my affection and loyalty, like a father would do to his child? Or is it better to ignore the issue, in the hope that she may become more self-assured?

    I see her twice a week (evening together plus sleeping at my place). Usually I keep the weekends for myself. Is this wrong? (everyone seems to think so!). I know it's normal for extraverts to see each other at least every other day but I could NEVER take it, I need a lot of space and time for myself.
    But I don't want to hurt her with my "distant" lifestyle, maybe she can't take it in the long run...
    I'm afraid that she has the ESFJ trait of over-sacrificing oneself: maybe she sticks with me "because of" while my loner ways are abusive to her delicate feelings... is this possible? I am brainstorming to fix potential problems in the relationship... any input is appreciated.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
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    What's her reasoning for her fears? It seems odd that it'd surface now having been together for 2 years. Depends whether she engaged in this behaviour before hand. Also perhaps she's just reinforcing her love for you, they say the 2 year mark is when infatuation starts wearing off but that needn't apply to your relationship.

    I reckon it's best to reassure her so she doesn't end up on some weird thought destructive cycle creating the downfall of your relationship. As for her becoming more independant, err not something I can help you with but it's best that she sorts that out before getting too involved with you. Otherwise it sounds as if there will be frustration. Hopefully an ESFJ will reply back. Mainly Saslou, she's your person!

  3. #3
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    I've been going out with an ESTJ for 6+ years, this scenario manifested itself my freshman year of college.

    ESxJs, when stressed, will grab onto NE as a relief function, and in this case her imagination is running wild and simply inventing scenarios and finding meaning in seemingly innocent behavior from you. She may have been stressed about the relationship, looks deeper for clues, and pieces some information together that give her an impending feeling of your infidelity.

    I would suggest confronting her about her fears. Ask her what makes her feel this way? Is there insecurity in her life somewhere else and it is carrying over? What is the behavior from you that makes her feel this way? Then, work together and show your intent in wanting to assuage her fears.



  4. #4
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Thank you kai.

    Funny .. I rarely vocally spoke up about my fears. I like to keep my cards to my chest, that way no one can hurt me. I think abandonment/trust issues are something we keep close to our hearts.

    On a very personal note though, be careful thinking she needs you .. I was told this all the time 'you need me, your too needy' .. oh gosh. It was never needing someone, i wanted that person in my life. Maybe its the fact we can be very affectionate towards you that makes it be perceived as needing.

    Ask me specific questions and i'll answer them ..
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  5. #5
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    You might also wanna address and open up about your own fears and anxieties. I realize you prolly don't wanna deal with them, but they definitely play too and unfortunately are likely to exacerbate hers. At least explain them to her, so she knows where you're coming from.

    Also, while your 'lone' ways are maybe just part of who you are, this in addition to your seeming fear of commitment makes it hard to actually see that you are in fact devoted to her. I have no doubt that you are, but these behaviors don't reinforce that picture, quite on the contrary. You may need to find your own way to show her your devotion, so she knows you're there for her
    And yes, she needs that. Knowing and actually getting that knowledge validated are two different things.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member wrldisquiethere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pardo View Post
    ...and I am IxTP.
    (I type her as ESxJ for the sake of precision, but I believe she's probably more F than T anyway.)
    We are in mid twenties and it's the first important relationship for the both of us. We've been together for about 2 years.
    Same for us. I'm an ESFJ; he seems to be ISTP. Until we started dating ten months ago, neither of us had dated anyone for a long time or been in a very serious relationship.

    Lately she's been telling me how much she's afraid of losing me and how much she can't live without me and how much she fears I'll betray her and how much she will love me forever etc. etc.
    She seems to be a little obsessed with fears ._.
    As an ESxJ, she is going to always be on the lookout for anything that threatens your relationship and is going to tend to worry about it until she is comfortable that the threat is gone. Being an ESFJ myself, I can say that there are times when these fears come up that aren't logical and seem to come from nowhere. My boyfriend and I went through a little situation like this not too long ago. I was crabby because I was worried, and finally one night I just told him a few of my fears. I admitted that I didn't know where they were coming from. He reassured me, and things were fine.

    Here is one thing you have to understand about an ESxJ...if she is anything like me, if there is not somewhat steady reassurance there, she will probably begin to assume that things are not going well and that she is doing something wrong or not making you happy. For an ESFJ, our whole world centers around supporting the people that are closest to us. If there's not validation that we are succeeding, we tend to assume we're failing. This is something that I've discovered is WAY different about me and my boyfriend: unless there's a disruption, he assumes the relationship is good; but for me I tend to assume it's not going well unless he indicates otherwise on a fairly regular basis.

    Because we desire to please so much, we ESFJ's can let these worries build and build because we don't want to complain about not getting the reassurance we need and we don't want to be high maintenance. For me at least, it'll build up and bother me for awhile until it gets to the place where I begin to feel resentful. It's possible that's the place where she's at right now, and this has caused her to all of a sudden boil over with her insecurities and fears.

    There's a lot of advice I could give to your girlfriend, as well. Anyone dating an ISTP (not sure about an INTP, but probably the same) has to be very cautious about coming across as too needy. My boyfriend and I have had to learn how to communicate the proper level of need for each other. Sometimes he gets his hackles up if I say that I miss him, and I have to reassure him that, yes, I can live without him, but I like seeing him and being with him and therefore miss him some while he's gone. I have to work to not take it personally when he is focusing on other aspects of his life and doesn't long to be with me all the time. In a conversation last night, he said to me, "I want to know that you like to have me around but that you could live without me and still be happy." Typical! Anyway, chances are many of her insecurities may very well be from feeling like she's not making you happy. At an appropriate time, try to explain to her in a sensitive way what your needs are, all the while assuring her that it doesn't mean that you don't care for her very deeply, but it's just a difference in personality. If she can grasp the need to support you in this way, she will probably try.

    Our relationship has been steady, we haven't had major arguments for almost a year now, I AM the most loyal of men and never gave her any hint of the contrary. Our unresolved issue is marriage: she believes in it wholeheartedly, while I am very scared of formal/legal commitment (my parents sucked -hard- at living together, I have scars).
    I can see where that would be very scary for her. For an ESFJ, love IS commitment. If you have been dating for two years and yet she still thinks that you are not even considering making that commitment, she may start to feel antsy.

    To me, feelings of insecurity in a relationship are something to be suppressed: everyone should be independent, in a relationship or not. But obviously I am just a hopeless introvert thinker and I don't know shit about "love" as she experiences it! Her fears could be perfectly normal, that's why I'm posting here...
    Just keep in mind that for her it's important that you accept her along with her emotions. She will want to know that she can trust you to help her through this issues. If she senses that you think she's just being ridiculous and you're not willing to listen to her, she very well may become either incredibly clingy OR close herself off from you. My boyfriend tries very hard to listen with tenderness, he'll express his own concerns and point of view, but often will end up saying, "So tell me what I need to do." He is a fixer by nature and wants to fix the problem. This makes me feel safe, but only if he's also allowed my to express my feelings before he rushes in to try to fix things. For an Extroverted Feeler, talking through emotions is how we process emotions.

    AND, maybe I feel imprisoned by her growing emotional dependency on me (or maybe I am just inventing problems in my head.) Actually, I don't understand my own feelings very well too..

    Is there anything I can do about her fears? Should I do anything?
    Is it normal for an ESxJ female to have such fears and to be SO OPENLY VOCAL about them? Could it be just a bad period? (she has exams, she should finish her nursing degree in which she is very emotionally invested for her selfesteem..).
    Should I reassure her of my affection and loyalty, like a father would do to his child? Or is it better to ignore the issue, in the hope that she may become more self-assured?
    My advice would be:

    Reassure her of your affection. Also make sure you show appreciation for what she brings to the relationship. If she is an ESFJ, she probably puts forth a lot of effort into doing things that she thinks will make you feel special. She gets happiness out of thoughtfully giving to you. Make sure you thank her for these things and give her the impression that it makes you happy. Unfortunately, one of the weaknesses of this is the fact that an ESFJ will tend to expect the same kind of treatment in return. It's not because we're giving to get, but it's just that it comes naturally for us to think of these things and do them and we can't understand why the other person is not doing the same (therefore, the conclusion is that WE must be doing something wrong).

    Encourage her to develop her independence outside of you. I am a pretty independent person (probably considered very independent for an ESFJ), and this independence has stemmed from 1) my social life and 2) my sense of responsibility. If you want her to have more independence from you, it might be best accomplished by encouraging her to plan social events with other friends...appeal to the extrovert in her. Encourage her to have some girls' nights. When you need alone time of your own, perhaps you could appeal to her sense of responsibility by explaining that there are things you need to be responsible for. (If my boyfriend were to just say he wanted alone time, I might not be able to understand that; but if he were to say that he needs to WORK, I am not offended in the slightest.)

    Encourage her to tell you what's bothering her when it FIRST starts to bother her. This is one of the biggest things I've had to work on. I tend to brood about things because I don't want to cause trouble or come across as unaccepting, and all that accomplishes is me dwelling on it for a long time until everything tends to become dramatized. This very well may be what is going on with your girlfriend right now. If this has all been building up for awhile, she's probably going to react dramatically. My boyfriend has been really good about trying to get me to talk out what's bothering me when it FIRST becomes a problem instead of waiting until it gets BIG. He has made it clear to me that it is really hard for him when I let something bother me for a long time and he doesn't realize it until it all spills over and hits him BAM like a ton of bricks. Assure her that you're not going to reject her if she approaches you when something bothers her. I guarantee you if she can learn to do that it will make a world of difference.

    And express to her that you're truly TRYING to be what you should be for her and TRYING what you know to do to invest in the relationship. If she knows you are putting forth effort into it, she'll probably find some reassurance. It's just that the kinds of effort you put into it are probably different than what she puts into it, so she may doubt at times that you are trying. She will need to learn that the fact that you are staying with her and continuing to spend time with her speaks volumes about your care for her.

    I see her twice a week (evening together plus sleeping at my place). Usually I keep the weekends for myself. Is this wrong? (everyone seems to think so!). I know it's normal for extraverts to see each other at least every other day but I could NEVER take it, I need a lot of space and time for myself.
    But I don't want to hurt her with my "distant" lifestyle, maybe she can't take it in the long run...
    That is something that you two will just have to determine together. You'll have to both make sacrifices in this area to help one another out.

    I'm afraid that she has the ESFJ trait of over-sacrificing oneself: maybe she sticks with me "because of" while my loner ways are abusive to her delicate feelings... is this possible? I am brainstorming to fix potential problems in the relationship... any input is appreciated.
    Just reassure her. I think you can find ways to deal with this.

    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    Thank you kai.

    Funny .. I rarely vocally spoke up about my fears. I like to keep my cards to my chest, that way no one can hurt me. I think abandonment/trust issues are something we keep close to our hearts.
    I agree. I have to be really uncomfortable before I will admit them. Reason being I don't like burdening someone else with them.

    On a very personal note though, be careful thinking she needs you .. I was told this all the time 'you need me, your too needy' .. oh gosh. It was never needing someone, i wanted that person in my life. Maybe its the fact we can be very affectionate towards you that makes it be perceived as needing.)
    I have to agree with this wholeheartedly. ESFJ's are fiercely devoted. However, they are also very sensible. My boyfriend and I have even had the talk before of what "I need you" actually means. Don't freak out...if she has actually said that she NEEDS you, she probably isn't saying that she can't live without you. It's just her way of saying that she appreciates what you bring into her life. If she hasn't said she NEEDS you, then dont' assume that's what she means, either.
    Si, Fe equal Fi & Ti

    "I had a bag of Fritos, they were Texas grilled Fritos. These Fritos had grill marks on them. They remind me of summer, when we used to fire up the barbeque and throw down some Fritos. I can still see my dad with the apron on. Better flip that Frito, dad, you know how I like it." -Mitch Hedberg

  7. #7
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    ^^^ Wow. i know i should elaborate on some of the points you have made there because some of them i am thinking to myself Whatttttt???.

    I am happy you seem to worked yourself out. I have explained this to someone else. I feel that i am a 3000 piece puzzle, and sometimes i just don't know where to start. I know what i know, and the rest i can just speculate on. My view from one day to the next can change as my views are not set in stone. That's why i can get frustrated on this site as my view 2 days ago could of changed today.

    I would go into detail, but i think i will water my plants instead. lol.
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

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