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  1. #51
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    What seems like an innocent conversation to you may actually be a touchy subject for me. It's hard for me to talk about some things, but I am willing to go there if the conversation warrants it and we are bonding or whatever. I am not willing, however, to bring up all that shit simply because someone is curious or nosy. In discussions of a personal nature, things just have to flow.

    For mundane things, it just amazes me why you need to know in the first place. How does what cereal I ate affect your life? If something is nonsensical to me, I react to it very poorly.

  2. #52
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    I am so confused by some of these comments. I wonder what I do in these situations...
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  3. #53
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AutumnReverie View Post
    The only time I'll ask questions back-to-back (firing questions) is when the person just keeps giving me a "uh, I don't know" answer or just a one-word response (and is still giving me the impression that they would like to talk but isn't actually offering up any of their own topics of conversation). I'm looking for something we can have a good/interesting/fun conversation about, and if the person won't answer or elaborate on the answers then it's difficult for me to learn about him or her. Though I've found that, once people "give in" they actually quite enjoy it. In the past couple of years, I've been directly told twice that I'm a very intellectually stimulating conversationalist...once from an INTJ peer/friend of mine and once from an english Professor of mine.
    I don't know why you feel that they are giving you the impression that they still want to talk, because the minute I answer back with one word, it means you're stepping in the wrong direction. But I guess that's just me...

    The phrase "give in" shows a little bit of that controlling aspect that I was talking about...

  4. #54
    Senior Member AutumnReverie's Avatar
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    Why do we sometimes ask questions about seemingly "mundane" things?

    To quote Dave...
    Quote Originally Posted by d@v3 View Post
    I love asking questions! It is how I learn... you see, if we get a fact we will remember it for a very long time. BUT I know when to stop asking questions as it annoys some people.
    I ask because it's how I learn. It's true that your answers to some (or all) of these questions won't "affect my life"...but it helps me learn more about you. Some questions help me learn about bigger things like your values/beliefs/etc. and other questions help me learn the details of your personality -- the little things, that may seem meaningless to you, but that I find interesting.

    Also if I learn a particular "fact" about you, I won't ever forget it.

    So for example, if I asked "what kind of cereal did you eat this morning?" and you replied "Cheerios" and I asked "oh, do you always eat that type?" and you replied "yes, it's always been my favorite. I hate xxxx kind of cereal," that's something I'll always remember and you'll never have to tell me again. It could be three years down the line on your birthday and you wake up to find a cabinet full of cheerios that say "happy birthday" on the box (or...something less lame than that )

    I usually show that I care about someone, not through my words or touchy-feely displays, but through subtle actions. And I choose these actions using information that I've received from you or learned about you.

    For example, I had a conversation once where I asked a friend of mine questions about languages. In one of his answers, he told me that he though Italian was a very interesting language and he'd think someone who spoke it would be interesting. After that, we never once talked about the Italian language again. At least 8 months later, he kept bugging me to sign his yearbook for sentimental value. I took the yearbook, wrote what I had prepared to write to him...in Italian. When he saw it, he flipped out and was extremely happy that I actually remembered that detail about him.

    I don't know why you feel that they are giving you the impression that they still want to talk, because the minute I answer back with one word, it means you're stepping in the wrong direction. But I guess that's just me...
    I meant that they still want to talk to me "in general" but they just don't want to talk about that particular topic...which is why I then wait for them to redirect the conversation to something else or I go ahead and redirect the conversation to something else.

    What seems like an innocent conversation to you may actually be a touchy subject for me. It's hard for me to talk about some things, but I am willing to go there if the conversation warrants it and we are bonding or whatever. I am not willing, however, to bring up all that shit simply because someone is curious or nosy. In discussions of a personal nature, things just have to flow.
    If someone doesn't want to talk about a certain subject and expresses that or says that, then I won't ask them about it anymore. I've actually never had that happen to me before though, since I don't usually ask particularly intrusive questions. Anything I ask could be asked in a classroom setting (a psych class, a ethics class, a political science class, etc.)

    The phrase "give in" shows a little bit of that controlling aspect that I was talking about...
    I'm sorry if my use of the "give in" phrase had a more serious tone then I intended, I meant it more as a joke which is why I put quotes around the word (in response to the controlling aspect that was talked about earlier). I can tell you honestly that I don't ask questions as a means to "control" the person or get control. Like I said before, I do it to learn about the person and possibly spark an interesting conversation (which will also help me learn about the person). That's it.
    After all,
    you're my wonderwall...

    {listen: }

  5. #55
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I understand everything you are saying and appreciate the fact that you are willing to explain it. I know the intentions can be honorable, but it does feel suffocating at times.

    I prefer to bond by sharing activities. If we go out to brunch and a museum, then on your birthday a few years later, I may cook what we ate that day and surprise you with a print from a favorite artist that we saw. I also notice those details. I guess what I mean is that asking me question after question does not feel like an attempt to share in my life, only to know about it. It feels like someone is taking an ownership position - the way you would inspect a horse for sale or something.

    I know that most times this is harmless. I have an ESTJ friend who questions me to death about the most mundane things. I get irritated and stop answering. But then, she'll just start talking about all the mundane things in her own life, in excruciating detail. My goodness, sometimes when I'm with her I just want to blow my brains out. I know, for her, it's not about control (for the most part) - it's just about finding something to talk about. If we're fishing for conversation, I would rather look externally and talk about what's on the news or an interesting article I read. Looking for conversation about the things in our own lives feels forced and I feel they should occur on their own volition.


    (and btw, politics and psych can be considered very personal... )

  6. #56
    Senior Member AutumnReverie's Avatar
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    Yeah, I understand where you are coming from. I wouldn't want anyone to feel suffocated or controlled, since I would never do that intentionally.

    I like the "share my life" example that you gave as well. I'll definitely try that form of bonding/learning in the future, when I try to gather information about an individual. Oh...wait...that probably sounds kind of bad, yes? Correction: when I try to bond and learn about an individual.

    I guess questions/answers are just more concrete for me. I could observe that a person consistently orders a particular meal every time we go out to eat. From that, yes, I could possibly infer that the meal is that person's favorite and use that detail in the future to do something nice for that person. However, I don't know for sure. There could be various reasons why the person consistently orders that meal (health reasons, financial reasons, "it's just the best thing out of a variety of crappy things on the menu" reasons, etc.). But if I ask "is that your all-time favorite meal?" then I would know for sure. That detail of their personality would be "fact" in my mind, and I would feel confident about it. By the way, that's not to say that I take everything someone says about themselves as "fact". In my mind it wouldn't be "her favorite meal is this", it'd be "she strongly believes that her favorite meal is -this-, yet perhaps I've seen her eat -that- more often"

    Haha, I think I just need to tell myself that I don't need to know all the details/facts to learn about someone. It's easier for me, but maybe not for them. Maybe, like with you, they'd rather not talk and answer questions...maybe they'd rather do something with me and learn that way.

    ...it's hard for me though, I love questions so much (and it really does make me feel like I'm bonding with the person)!

    But then, she'll just start talking about all the mundane things in her own life, in excruciating detail.
    Eh, I never do that. Thank goodness! I'm a fairly private person, so I don't tell people things about my life unless they directly ask.

    If we're fishing for conversation, I would rather look externally and talk about what's on the news or an interesting article I read. Looking for conversation about the things in our own lives feels forced and I feel they should occur on their own volition.
    I do both -- conversation about our own lives or converstation about external topics (the news, an article, etc.)

    Yes, politics and psych can be very personal and get heated depending on who you're talking to. Which is why it's best to know your audience. Every time I've debated/discussed with people about those types of issues, the discussion has always been a nice mix of interesting/thought-provoking and hilarious/fun. Mostly because I know where I stand on issues and am firm in my beliefs, but I would never judge anyone else for thinking differently. I wouldn't ask a question and refuse to hear or respect the answer. I ask because I'm interested in a different point of view, and I can listen to that, input my own thoughts, and have also have fun with it. If I sense someone else can do the same, then I know it's probably okay to go there with them.
    After all,
    you're my wonderwall...

    {listen: }

  7. #57
    Senior Member professor goodstain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    it does feel suffocating at times.

    It feels like someone is taking an ownership position - the way you would inspect a horse for sale or something.

    an ESTJ friend who questions me to death about the most mundane things. I get irritated and stop answering. she'll just start talking about all the mundane things in her own life, in excruciating detail. when I'm with her I just want to blow my brains out. - it's just about finding something to talk about. If we're fishing for conversation, I look externally interesting . Looking for conversation they should occur on their own volition.


    (and btw, politics and psych can be considered very personal... )
    *No need for tact here* How familiar
    everyone uses every function about evenly. take NE for example. if there are those who don't use it much, then why are there such massive amounts of people constantly flowing through Wallmart with 20 items or less?

  8. #58
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Hahaha, I love you "J"s... concrete - what does that even mean? My tastes change with the wind. What I love to eat today, could be what I'm sick of tomorrow.

    And the "S" penchant for details... Man, now I really see why NPs and SJs can be like oil and water if we don't take the time to understand each other's perspectives.

    It's good to know that it's just information gathering and not actual judging or controlling behavior. I think I'll be able to have better friendships now that I know this, thanks.

  9. #59
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by professor goodstain View Post
    *No need for tact here* How familiar
    you called it!!! I need to hang out in the Guardhouse more since I can speak freely without emoticons!!!

  10. #60
    Senior Member AutumnReverie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    Hahaha, I love you "J"s... concrete - what does that even mean? My tastes change with the wind. What I love to eat today, could be what I'm sick of tomorrow.

    And the "S" penchant for details... Man, now I really see why NPs and SJs can be like oil and water if we don't take the time to understand each other's perspectives.

    It's good to know that it's just information gathering and not actual judging or controlling behavior. I think I'll be able to have better friendships now that I know this, thanks.
    Haha true! In that case I would ask "I thought x was your favorite?" and you would say "Well, I've changed my mind. I now love z". Then I would have two new "facts" about you: 1) you have a new favorite food and 2) you change your mind quite often and sometimes without reason.

    Yes an NP and SJ combination could possibly be a disaster if there's miscommunication.

    You're welcome! I'm glad that I've talked to you as well. I'll definitely try to keep in mind what you've said in the future. I'd hate to accidentally drive someone away when all I was actually trying to do was getting to know them.
    After all,
    you're my wonderwall...

    {listen: }

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