[ISTJ] How does one go about wooing an ISTJ? (and other questions)

[Lady_X]

yeah...we stay in relationships longer than we should...i just thought if it wasn't me who broke it off then i would be able to get over it quickly...but i don't know...i've always had to make the decision and i HATE big decisions like that!

anyway...sidetracked...i just think she should try to talk with him about it...that's what i would do anyway...good luck.

 

[Giggly]

Tea Party, after reading your posts, I think I'd just forget about being more than friends with him if were me in your position for many reasons.

 

[d@v3]

Whoa, okay. I'm sorry I didn't have the time to respond to everyone yesterday, but I did get to read all of your awesome posts which were so, so helpful, and I was all encouraged and determined to be friendly the next time I saw him and everything, but... well, I probably should've mentioned this earlier.

His friend/the girl he was dating (an ENFP, meep) is still interested in him, and is apparently still trying to win him back. This causes a vast and terrible mix of emotions in me, but they basically all sum up to me feeling horribly sick whenever I see her or think about her (this is of course multiplied tenfold when she is with my ISTJ.) I am extremely paranoid about them getting back together, and it's always really hard to tell whether or not they have because they have remained close friends, and she likes to flirt with him (which he doesn't seem to discourage, but I am not sure if this is because he doesn't mind or because he is simply not receptive to it.) She has a huge advantage over me, a, being an ENFP and therefor naturally more compatible, and b, being able to talk to him whenever she wants to without feeling nervous. (This I am WILDLY and exceedingly jealous of.)
And like I said, I was really ready to talk to him today. But she was there. She doesn't have our first period (I'm afraid that this is a high school situation... which I'm sure has everyone rolling their eyes, I'm sorry) but she was there... waiting for him. (It's an elective period, so it's sort of permissible for random kids to just come and hang around.) He was uncharacteristically late today, but she went up to him once he arrived and was all "woo" and I was all "kill me." And it was kind of like that.

But besides the primary emotion I feel for her, which I will concede is hate (I tried really hard at first not to hate her, but... I just can't help it) she also fills me with the most painful sort of guilt and empathy, because I know exactly how she feels (assuming that she actually loves him and is not just infatuated) and somehow, even though I can't stand her, I feel like if one of us should suffer through the excruciating pain of unrequited love, it should be me. I can't help but immediately come to this conclusion and back down, even though I know it is ultimately the ISTJ's choice! D: And then there is of course the guilt that comes from hating a perfectly nice person... it's awful.

She asked him to go to this dance with her (it's a formal dance that I guess you could say is kind of specific to our school? It's not the prom or anything but it's about as important.) and he said yes, so.... I feel horribly discouraged and just generally sick. I know this is in the SJ forum, but does anyone know how hard it is for an ENFP to get over unrequited love? Is it as hard as it is for an ISFJ? Do you guys think I actually have any serious competition with her, considering that he was the one to end their relationship? :c

Yikes! I didn't see this post. Yeah.... highschool... I did not date in high school. If you feel too nervous to talk to him or can never get to talk to him without the ENFP around, perhaps you should write him a short note? It would be MUCH easier than trying to talk to him. Slip it into his locker or something! Don't worry, he WILL get back to you. Even if it takes a little time!

Either way, I think you need to convey your feelings to him before he goes with the ENFP. I'm afraid to tell you though, if he has already said yes to go to the dance with the ENFP, he WILL more than likely go to the dance with the ENFP- even if he does not WANT to go to the dance with the ENFP. (Sense of duty/commitment. )

 

[Shadow]

Whoa, okay. I'm sorry I didn't have the time to respond to everyone yesterday, but I did get to read all of your awesome posts which were so, so helpful, and I was all encouraged and determined to be friendly the next time I saw him and everything, but... well, I probably should've mentioned this earlier.

His friend/the girl he was dating (an ENFP, meep) is still interested in him, and is apparently still trying to win him back. This causes a vast and terrible mix of emotions in me, but they basically all sum up to me feeling horribly sick whenever I see her or think about her (this is of course multiplied tenfold when she is with my ISTJ.) I am extremely paranoid about them getting back together, and it's always really hard to tell whether or not they have because they have remained close friends, and she likes to flirt with him (which he doesn't seem to discourage, but I am not sure if this is because he doesn't mind or because he is simply not receptive to it.) She has a huge advantage over me, a, being an ENFP and therefor naturally more compatible, and b, being able to talk to him whenever she wants to without feeling nervous. (This I am WILDLY and exceedingly jealous of.)
And like I said, I was really ready to talk to him today. But she was there. She doesn't have our first period (I'm afraid that this is a high school situation... which I'm sure has everyone rolling their eyes, I'm sorry) but she was there... waiting for him. (It's an elective period, so it's sort of permissible for random kids to just come and hang around.) He was uncharacteristically late today, but she went up to him once he arrived and was all "woo" and I was all "kill me." And it was kind of like that.

But besides the primary emotion I feel for her, which I will concede is hate (I tried really hard at first not to hate her, but... I just can't help it) she also fills me with the most painful sort of guilt and empathy, because I know exactly how she feels (assuming that she actually loves him and is not just infatuated) and somehow, even though I can't stand her, I feel like if one of us should suffer through the excruciating pain of unrequited love, it should be me. I can't help but immediately come to this conclusion and back down, even though I know it is ultimately the ISTJ's choice! D: And then there is of course the guilt that comes from hating a perfectly nice person... it's awful.

She asked him to go to this dance with her (it's a formal dance that I guess you could say is kind of specific to our school? It's not the prom or anything but it's about as important.) and he said yes, so.... I feel horribly discouraged and just generally sick. I know this is in the SJ forum, but does anyone know how hard it is for an ENFP to get over unrequited love? Is it as hard as it is for an ISFJ? Do you guys think I actually have any serious competition with her, considering that he was the one to end their relationship? :c

Oh no! That sounds really painful! It is hard for us introverts in these situations isn't it? Sometimes just getting in there first seems to work best. I would say if he had any sense at all he would decide which one of you he would prefer to go out with, and since his ex/current girlfriend/friend seems pretty indecisive and confused, I think you would be the better bet personally. However, to make this decision he has to know how you feel, and I wouldn't assume he knows this, especially as he's ISTJ. You may think you're making it obvious, but it's best to get your feelings out there. Don't dismiss the note idea! He's unlikely to be the type to think it's naff, in fact he may find it sweet that you were too shy to approach him directly. Plus it's better than going through the pain of seeing him with the ENFP. It would be better if you told him how you felt and he chose the ENFP than if he stayed with the ENFP and you never told him, because at least you'd know you tried and that it's nothing to do with how you played it. Obviously it's best if you talk to him alone, but this ENFP sounds like she's clinging to him like a limpet... maybe she's spotted that you're interested and is thus intrigued about him again as a result.

<3 !

It is such a relief to know there are ISTJ-ISFJ relationships out there. All of the ISTJ profiles on the internet make it seem like they would only ever be interested in Es. :/ And they make them sound almost robot-like, which I know is not my ISTJ.

Yeah, I don't think these relationship compatibility suggestions always work, for whatever type. I personally can't stand Es. ISFJ is great because we're on a level and have a shared outlook on life and the world, but his Feeling means he coaxes out my emotions plus he understands what I'm about without me having to explain, so we have only ever argued once in 3 years and that wasn't even a real argument.
There was some sort of theory posted in 'Perfect match theory' on the relationships board suggesting that medium-level introverts liked medium-level extraverts but strong introverts like weak introverts and strong extraverts like weak extraverts... or some such thing anyway! But yeah, that's probably true.

Yikes!
Either way, I think you need to convey your feelings to him before he goes with the ENFP. I'm afraid to tell you though, if he has already said yes to go to the dance with the ENFP, he WILL more than likely go to the dance with the ENFP- even if he does not WANT to go to the dance with the ENFP. (Sense of duty/commitment. )

Sadly, I agree.

 

[d@v3]

Tea Party, after reading your posts, I think I'd just forget about being more than friends with him if were me in your position for many reasons.

Why? What reasons do you have, Hmm?

 

[Giggly]

Why? What reasons do you have, Hmm?

Well, the most important one being that she is a girl and kind of young. You can think about what that means and the ramifications of that.

Also, based on everything she's said, it seems like he prefers extroverted girls. Most likely because he is introverted. I have a feeling that even if she does tell him how she feels, he'll want her to continue to be assertive (more like the ENFP he's used to) and she'd have to change who she is, which is not a good idea, especially not right now.

 

[Eagle]

Whoa, okay. I'm sorry I didn't have the time to respond to everyone yesterday, but I did get to read all of your awesome posts which were so, so helpful, and I was all encouraged and determined to be friendly the next time I saw him and everything, but... well, I probably should've mentioned this earlier.

His friend/the girl he was dating (an ENFP, meep) is still interested in him, and is apparently still trying to win him back. This causes a vast and terrible mix of emotions in me, but they basically all sum up to me feeling horribly sick whenever I see her or think about her (this is of course multiplied tenfold when she is with my ISTJ.) I am extremely paranoid about them getting back together, and it's always really hard to tell whether or not they have because they have remained close friends, and she likes to flirt with him (which he doesn't seem to discourage, but I am not sure if this is because he doesn't mind or because he is simply not receptive to it.) She has a huge advantage over me, a, being an ENFP and therefor naturally more compatible, and b, being able to talk to him whenever she wants to without feeling nervous. (This I am WILDLY and exceedingly jealous of.)
And like I said, I was really ready to talk to him today. But she was there. She doesn't have our first period (I'm afraid that this is a high school situation... which I'm sure has everyone rolling their eyes, I'm sorry) but she was there... waiting for him. (It's an elective period, so it's sort of permissible for random kids to just come and hang around.) He was uncharacteristically late today, but she went up to him once he arrived and was all "woo" and I was all "kill me." And it was kind of like that.

But besides the primary emotion I feel for her, which I will concede is hate (I tried really hard at first not to hate her, but... I just can't help it) she also fills me with the most painful sort of guilt and empathy, because I know exactly how she feels (assuming that she actually loves him and is not just infatuated) and somehow, even though I can't stand her, I feel like if one of us should suffer through the excruciating pain of unrequited love, it should be me. I can't help but immediately come to this conclusion and back down, even though I know it is ultimately the ISTJ's choice! D: And then there is of course the guilt that comes from hating a perfectly nice person... it's awful.

She asked him to go to this dance with her (it's a formal dance that I guess you could say is kind of specific to our school? It's not the prom or anything but it's about as important.) and he said yes, so.... I feel horribly discouraged and just generally sick. I know this is in the SJ forum, but does anyone know how hard it is for an ENFP to get over unrequited love? Is it as hard as it is for an ISFJ? Do you guys think I actually have any serious competition with her, considering that he was the one to end their relationship? :c

To all of that my heart goes out to you.

Oh yes, I am quite sure that I love him. C:

Oh no oh no, it sounds like he probably feels like I'm ignoring him for sure. D: Sometimes I actually HAVE tried to ignore him because being around him hurt so much. Aagh, I feel so guilty!
Don't feel guilty. Even if you are. Makes you feel worse.

A LOT of reasons. My fear of rejection, my fear of being inadequate... (a lot of my childhood experiences greatly encouraged my already-powerful ISFJ tendency to feel inadequate/unworthy.) I just sort of... think too much. I tend to think about all the things that could go wrong in any given situation, the more emotionally invested I am in the situation, the more this is true. When I am with him I tend to think about all of my faults and all the things I am probably doing wrong, and end up convincing myself that there is no way he would like me. I guess you could say that my mind is somewhat self-destructive in this way. And of course when he is with or has been with the ENFP, that's the worst.

Awwww. My I have two sisters that are ISFJ. I can see (especially in the one that's closest to me) how that can happen. I'm now throwing out the offer that we can talk in some PMs if you want. At the least I can attempt to encourage you.

...but immature people of any type are bad.

HAHAHA, understatement.

Yikes! I didn't see this post. Yeah.... highschool... I did not date in high school. If you feel too nervous to talk to him or can never get to talk to him without the ENFP around, perhaps you should write him a short note? It would be MUCH easier than trying to talk to him. Slip it into his locker or something! Don't worry, he WILL get back to you. Even if it takes a little time!

Either way, I think you need to convey your feelings to him before he goes with the ENFP. I'm afraid to tell you though, if he has already said yes to go to the dance with the ENFP, he WILL more than likely go to the dance with the ENFP- even if he does not WANT to go to the dance with the ENFP. (Sense of duty/commitment. )

Highschool... Wow. I think that hit a few of us with surprise. I also didn't/don't date in highschool. Rather a good practice in my mind. But, to each his own.

Well, the most important one being that she is a girl and kind of young. You can think about what that means and the ramifications of that.

Also, based on what she's said, it seems like he prefers extroverted girls. Probably because he is introverted. I have a feeling that even if she does tell him how she feels, he'll want her to continue to be assertive (more like the ENFP he's used to) and she'd have to change who she is which is not a good idea right now.

Maybe she would, maybe she wouldn't. The fact that she is young does make a big difference in our minds.

 

[Giggly]

Maybe she would, maybe she wouldn't. The fact that she is young does make a big difference in our minds.

She's already trying to change.

 

[Eagle]

She's already trying to change.

Which there is really nothing wrong. By just trying she'll grow. What she'll learn though, is that the best way to get someone is to be who you are.

 

[d@v3]

Well, the most important one being that she is a girl and kind of young. You can think about what that means and the ramifications of that.

Also, based on everything she's said, it seems like he prefers extroverted girls. Most likely because he is introverted. I have a feeling that even if she does tell him how she feels, he'll want her to continue to be assertive (more like the ENFP he's used to) and she'd have to change who she is, which is not a good idea, especially not right now.

I agree it wouldn't be good for her to change who she is just for this one guy. But I think the ISTJ would much prefer her over the ENFP. It depends on how mature he is though. Besides, didn't she say that the ISTJ is the one who called it off with the ENFP before? I think she should write him the note and see what happens. If she writes the note, then he will see through her smoke screen of emotional disregard for him and he will appreciate it. She really has nothing to lose by doing that.

 

[Eagle]

I agree it wouldn't be good for her to change who she is just for this one guy. But I think the ISTJ would much prefer her over the ENFP. It depends on how mature he is though. Besides, didn't she say that the ISTJ is the one who called it off with the ENFP before? I think she should write him the note and see what happens. If she writes the note, then he will see through her smoke screen of emotional disregard for him and he will appreciate it. She really has nothing to lose by doing that.

Indeed. Notes are good. One thing to do is actually not sign with her name. Just leave it anonymous. Then after writing him a few notes if it seems that he is interested, arrange a meeting. When he gets there he would see that it is actually her... I know I read/heard/saw that somewhere before.

I do think that it would be a bad thing for her to try and change. See, either way. When do people try to change? Typically when they are young. By doing this they actually grow more. So, although it's a bad thing in some sense, its a good thing. I am encouraging her to be who she is. Yet, I want her to grow as an individual as well. One way to do that is to learn life lessons. The only real teacher in life is experience (that statement works just takes a lot of explaining). I see her growing so much more by trying to change and then realizing she can't and then growing as an individual, than just being who she is and going after the boy. So, I'm torn, between helping her in two different ways. One might be more painful, but isn't that pain what helps us grow? So, yes.

 

[d@v3]

I don't think she should leave it anonymous. Because personally, I hate playing games like that! How would she know if he was interested or not if she does not put her name on it? He could become skeptical and think it was a prank. I think she should leave him a note and put her name on it because it time ISN'T on her side. Worst still, he could think that the note is from the ENFP and it could turn into a total backfire!

If she leaves him a note with her name, she will know for sure what is going on. That way everyone is on the same page. If he is as nice/mature as she is describing, then he will probably get back to her within a week letting her know his decision whatever it may be.

 

[Shadow]

I don't think she should leave it anonymous. Because personally, I hate playing games like that! How would she know if he was interested or not if she does not put her name on it? He could become skeptical and think it was a prank. I think she should leave him a note and put her name on it because it time ISN'T on her side. Worst still, he could think that the note is from the ENFP and it could turn into a total backfire!

If she leaves him a note with her name, she will know for sure what is going on. That way everyone is on the same page. If he is as nice/mature as she is describing, then he will probably get back to her within a week letting her know his decision whatever it may be.

I agree with you.

The whole point of the note is letting him know she has those feelings, because she may not have been getting that across. Therefore if he finds this anonymous note he is unlikely to think it'll be from Tea. Not only that, he may get ENFP involved if he think it's her and she'll wonder who it is; she may even suss out that it's Tea, and that would get nasty.
No, if notes are being used, they should be named.

 

[Giggly]

Tea Party reminds me so much of myself. I relate to her soo much. I just realized that my advice is probably useless in this thread because of that.

 

[d@v3]

Tea Party reminds me so much of myself. I relate to her soo much. I just realized that my advice is probably useless in this thread because of that.

There, there, Hmm. Your advice is not useless. Perhaps you will learn something about us whilst we learn something about you? I like ISFJ's they are very cute and shy, right? -That is, until they get to know you better?

 

[Giggly]

There, there, Hmm. Your advice is not useless. Perhaps you will learn something about us whilst we learn something about you? I like ISFJ's they are very cute and shy, right? -That is, until they get to know you better?

Yeah.

 

[Eagle]

Indeed. To both d@ve's and Shadow's responses to my post and to Hmm's post.

 

[Tea Party]

Alright, so I caught him in the hallway today and told him that I needed to talk to him in private soon.... so tomorrow will probably be the day I tell him. Um... do you think he'll remember that I needed to talk to him? If he forgets, should I still bring it up again? I'm really nervous and he seemed kind of unresponsive, even though earlier in the morning he was doing his whole "how are you" thing like normal. :c One of my friends said that he seemed tired in his third period and that's probably why he seemed unresponsive but I am still very worried... I don't want to bother him...

 

[Eagle]

Don't be nervous (I know that you can't not be but relax). If you've committed yourself to this just follow through.

 

[Tea Party]

Don't be nervous (I know that you can't not be but relax). If you've committed yourself to this just follow through.

Okay. :c