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Thread: ESTJ vs. ISTJ

  1. #31
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donna Cecilia View Post
    As for me, the only ESTJ I know personally is my Grandmother, and, form interacting with ESTJs on this board, the main difference I notice is they are more "human" than ISTJ, that means, more in touch with people´s feelings, willing to help, while the ISTJs would see crying babies or incompetent fools instead of a person who needs affection or help.
    Hah, this is a good way of putting it. I've definitely seen this.

    I have a good amount of great STJs around me, so I don't have the negative associations that most do. Plus, it probably helps that I don't turn into a passive aggressive weakling with no backbone around them either *eyes rest of the forum*

    GF- ESTJ
    Dad and Sis-ISTJ

    The first obvious difference is the degree of socialization. GF is the quintessential social butterfly and she will talk to a wall. Dad and Sis have lower thresholds for conversation out of their existing social circle.

    Second, is priority. Dad and Sis have an extreme tendency to get their environment, or get into an environment, that is as comfortable as possible. For the GF, this tendency is largely secondary and is only pursued as long as "things to be corrected" or "tasks to be performed" in the environment are completed or in the process of being completed. Dad and Sis are content to do nothing and be cozy, GF is not.

    Third, obstinance. I actually find the ISTJs to be more "dug in" than ESTJs. For the ESTJs, Si is in support, not in control, so essentially I've found that ESTJs use it a lot to simply discourage time-wasting exploratory endeavors. They are still logical beings, and as such, far easier to convince to your viewpoint provided the structure of your thought is sound and your reasoning proper. With ISTJs, the final stop is their personal experience. Far harder to change and screw around with.

    Just thinking out loud. Call me on BS if you see it.



  2. #32
    Aquaria mrcockburn's Avatar
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    ESTJs and ISTJs do appear different to me. ESTJs, ironically, are much easier to get along with imho. I say "ironically" because as an NP, SJs are my opposite, and you'd think an ESJ would be loud about it too.

    But, no. The ESTJs I've encountered are usually happy to hash out a plan with reason, logic, which they then execute.

    ISTJs on the hand, can be nasty little stinkers - in my experience working and schooling with them. Very anal, brooding, rigid, and not even willing to actually talk through their reasoning. Just kind of like, "It's right, because the professor/textbook/boss said so. Be quiet and let me crunch the numbers we were told to crunch in the way we were told to. And just let me write, your handwriting is too sloppy."

    And I notice a lot of them regularly eat bologna sandwiches... just an observation. Never mind.
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  3. #33
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    Hah, this is a good way of putting it. I've definitely seen this.

    I have a good amount of great STJs around me, so I don't have the negative associations that most do. Plus, it probably helps that I don't turn into a passive aggressive weakling with no backbone around them either *eyes rest of the forum*

    GF- ESTJ
    Dad and Sis-ISTJ

    The first obvious difference is the degree of socialization. GF is the quintessential social butterfly and she will talk to a wall. Dad and Sis have lower thresholds for conversation out of their existing social circle.

    Second, is priority. Dad and Sis have an extreme tendency to get their environment, or get into an environment, that is as comfortable as possible. For the GF, this tendency is largely secondary and is only pursued as long as "things to be corrected" or "tasks to be performed" in the environment are completed or in the process of being completed. Dad and Sis are content to do nothing and be cozy, GF is not.

    Third, obstinance. I actually find the ISTJs to be more "dug in" than ESTJs. For the ESTJs, Si is in support, not in control, so essentially I've found that ESTJs use it a lot to simply discourage time-wasting exploratory endeavors. They are still logical beings, and as such, far easier to convince to your viewpoint provided the structure of your thought is sound and your reasoning proper. With ISTJs, the final stop is their personal experience. Far harder to change and screw around with.

    Just thinking out loud. Call me on BS if you see it.
    I'd say you're pretty much entirely correct. +1!

    Points two and three especially resonate with me. I have a hard time "relaxing" unless it's as a reward for completing a task, and I'd like to think that, given enough evidence to the contrary, I could abandon even the most deeply held beliefs.
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    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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  4. #34
    Let's make this showy! raz's Avatar
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    ISTJs and ESTJs both utilize all of the tools at their disposal, quickly understand technical items and readily look for scientific/logical tools to be used. The difference is an ISTJ actually respects who made the tools/theories and where they came from.


  5. #35
    homo-loving sonovagun anii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donna Cecilia View Post
    And all friends comes to me in a crisis, but not looking for a shoulder to cry on: to get impersonal, objective opinion and advice, to bring them "back to Earth", and help them putting their feelings aside and see the problem as it is.
    That's' correct. They're the ones you want around if the car breaks down or you've fallen down a well.
    There's reason to be afraid, and reason to open your heart. ~ Seal

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  6. #36
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkIceTD View Post
    My sister is ESTJ. We get along just fine as long as I:

    1. don't oppose her point of view

    If we see things differently, which 90% of the time we usually do, we will end up arguing until I concede, don't care, or leave. Once she believes she's right, she will not let up and she MUST have the last word.

    2. Don't try to convince her about anything

    Plain and simple because it won't happen. It's her way, end of story. (Unless it can be proved otherwise with reason that SHE deems worthy)

    My ISTJ friend and hardly ever argue because I guess even though he might be as rigid in his opinions or way of doing things he doesn't try to push them on me or he doesn't express them as vehemently. I don't know if it's because he's an introvert or because he doesn't feel comfortable enough to be that way, yet.

    I noticed major similarities and contrasts between the way her and my ISTJ friend get things done. Both will not do anything without analyzing it to death. But my sister does this out loud. I can sit there and she will think out loud for an hour or two about whether she should buy something, do something, eat something, etc or not. My ISTJ friend will just sit quietly and (seemingly) randomly he will finally tell me what he's concluded about something we talked about hours or days before. It's like I get the last paragraph to whatever he's been thinking, with my sister i get the whole story.

    My sister will not do anything if she can't predict the outcome favorably, and she's pretty pessimistic, like my friend. Except my sister will tell me why, and my friend will just tell me the answer.

    I've noticed that in social situations where she doesn't know anyone she's sometimes shy or quiet, but people easily misinterpret that as being stuck up or rude mostly because of her facial expression or her conversation is kind distant. My ISTJ has told me that people read him wrong all the time. The difference between them is that my sister wants people to know that she isn't being mean, aloof, whatever. On the other hand my friend prefers for people not to know that he might be really feeling embarrassed, shy, nervous, etc.

    My point in this post is that I find it interesting how similar they both seem, but what a difference the E seems to make. Out of the two the ISTJ is easier to get along with. If my sister wasn't my sister I don't think we would get along as friends. I would feel like I'm being bossed around.
    Compliance is not about push. A short cut is.
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