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  1. #11
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Let me rephrase. If getting along is a priority, it can be arranged. Naturally getting on together though, and having a blast without trying, can't.
    I agree.

    The original poster seemed to be prioritizing getting along, though. Although... I really have no idea since I didn't read the post

  2. #12
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    I figured the main question was "how do we get along?"

    It's a lot easier if both sides put in some effort.
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  3. #13
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    I figured the main question was "how do we get along?"

    It's a lot easier if both sides put in some effort.
    People tend to get along if they want to.

    If people don't get along, there's usually a deeper motivation at play.

    (I agree)

  4. #14
    WTF is this dude saying? A Schnitzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evan View Post
    If people don't get along, there's usually a deeper motivation at play.
    I don't know. The ESTJs underlying problem seems to be that he doesn't understand the other side of the coin. If he doesn't understand why would he flex? Sure she can flex to his way of thinking, but that wears a person down after time and can often make her resentful for always having to see things his way.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Schnitzel View Post
    I don't know. The ESTJs underlying problem seems to be that he doesn't understand the other side of the coin. If he doesn't understand why would he flex? Sure she can flex to his way of thinking, but that wears a person down after time and can often make her resentful for always having to see things his way.
    That's been my experience with STJs (specifically those relatively unfamiliar with or unconvinced of personality studies). They have absolutely no idea where I'm coming from, but I understand their motivation and methods. According to them, I just don't want to do things the proper way.

  6. #16
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Schnitzel View Post
    I don't know. The ESTJs underlying problem seems to be that he doesn't understand the other side of the coin. If he doesn't understand why would he flex? Sure she can flex to his way of thinking, but that wears a person down after time and can often make her resentful for always having to see things his way.
    I doubt he's literally incapable of understanding the other side of the coin.

    It's just that the other side of the coin represents something deep, something that invokes a lot of cognitive dissonance. Something is scary about it. Until he matures, he may not be consciously able to see this stuff, but believe me, he sees it deep down.

  7. #17
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    That's been my experience with STJs. They have absolutely no idea where I'm coming from, but I understand their motivation and methods. According to them, I just don't want to do things the proper way.
    I know some mature STJs that have absolutely no problem following anything I say.

    It's the immature ones that "can't understand". Which is really, they have an unconscious reason for not wanting to go there. It makes them feel unsafe for some reason.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by evan View Post
    I know some mature STJs that have absolutely no problem following anything I say.

    It's the immature ones that "can't understand". Which is really, they have an unconscious reason for not wanting to go there. It makes them feel unsafe for some reason.
    It's not an issue of understanding what I say. (And you're not INTP, either.)

    It's an issue of full confidence that their way of thinking is the proper way, the way which gets things done (the things they care about), and while they understand what I'm saying, they disagree with it.

  9. #19
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evan View Post
    I doubt he's literally incapable of understanding the other side of the coin.

    It's just that the other side of the coin represents something deep, something that invokes a lot of cognitive dissonance. Something is scary about it. Until he matures, he may not be consciously able to see this stuff, but believe me, he sees it deep down.
    Probably, and even if not, then a person can still realize that they don't/can't see the opposing argument and open themselves up to suggestions. This was a tactic I took to heart sometime in my teens, I think.
    Last edited by Cimarron; 11-30-2008 at 05:39 PM. Reason: personal
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  10. #20
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    It's not an issue of understanding what I say. (And you're not INTP, either.)

    It's an issue of full confidence that their way of thinking is the proper way, the way which gets things done (the things they care about), and while they understand what I'm saying, they disagree with it.
    I'm not talking about MBTI. I happen to be a person that tends to get more general and vague than most others. Those people that happen to prefer concrete tangible ideas, as long as they're mature, tend to be able to follow along with me, no problem.

    It's the immature people (like my mom for example) that can't. It's because open thinking like mine (and yours) threatens the worldview that they've protected for so long. It's not that they are literally incapable of comprehension. It's that they unconsciously see that the "new" view is dangerous, so they suppress it -- their consciousness doesn't even have to feel the discomfort of comprehension. But it still gets to them -- they just don't know why it does -- and it usually manifests as anger towards the person with the new idea, or defensiveness, or whatever.

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