• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[NT] Famous historical NT's

entropie

Permabanned
Joined
Apr 24, 2008
Messages
16,767
MBTI Type
entp
Enneagram
783
Anyone named him for a famous historical NT, yet ? xD

bgs170-719671.jpg
 

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
3,376
MBTI Type
ENTP
I disagree with Warren Buffet being an entp. Warren buffet's investment strategy is extremely risk averse, and focus much more on analysis and logic than random intuition. So this rules Ne out. He would be much more likely an IXTJ.

A) Intuition is not random. It's probably best described as insight. Investment can use a lot of logic and analysis, but it also requires insight that most people do not have. If investment did not require insight, then a lot of people could replicate what Warren Buffet does simply by applying reason. In other words we should expect to see a ton of investment billionaires around if logic and analysis were all that was required.

B) I watched a one hour interview with Warren Buffet a couple of months ago and he was cracking jokes and acting silly through the whole thing. If that doesn't describe an ENTP, then I don't know what does.
 

SolitaryWalker

Tenured roisterer
Joined
Apr 23, 2007
Messages
3,504
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w6
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
-------------------------------------------------------


I have much to say,but I'm afraid that now I have a little difficultness in English.I can't communicate my ideas clearly.



INFJ:
Dominant Introverted Intuition (Ni)
Auxiliary Extraverted Feeling (Fe)
Tertiary Introverted Thinking (Ti)
Inferior Extraverted Sensing (Se)

INTJ:
Dominant Introverted Intuition (Ni)
Auxiliary Extraverted Thinking (Te)
Tertiary Introverted Feeling (Fi)
Inferior Extraverted Sensing(Se)


The reason to believe that Schopenhauer was an Extroverted Feeling type is that he was very direct in his expression of values. This we see in Parerga Und Paralipomena where he speaks of German pride and the need for a solitary lifestyle. He often makes claims such as 'those of you who have understood my philosophy without a dout will embrace this', he sought to persuade not through a rationale but through forcefulness of conviction.

He did not get reclusive and melancholy about his passions like the Fi types, he went out to champion them every chance he got as explicitly as possible.

Schopenhauer's genius was chiefly manifestation of Ni. However this does little to sugges that he was an INTJ rather than an INFJ.

Hegel was an INTP. Yes, Schopenhauer did have intellectual reasons for reviling Hegel, as he thought his philosophy was unsound. However, his personal reasons seem to far outweigh the intellectual as he often refers to him as the 'wretched charlatan'. He also wrote about his dismay for Hegel for confusing the minds of the youth. This is also more akin to Fe, as he was concerned for the welfare of his environment, unlike a Te type who sought to impose an impersonal regime onto his environment, E.G Nietzsche.

Schopenhauer was a very serious person, yes, almost from the get-go, however, this is not evidence of him being a Te type rather than Fe. A more plausible explanation that I see is that his Ni was preponderous over Fe.
 

Turkish_Cats

New member
Joined
Aug 12, 2008
Messages
12
MBTI Type
INTJ
The reason to believe that Schopenhauer was an Extroverted Feeling type is that he was very direct in his expression of values. This we see in Parerga Und Paralipomena where he speaks of German pride and the need for a solitary lifestyle. He often makes claims such as 'those of you who have understood my philosophy without a dout will embrace this', he sought to persuade not through a rationale but through forcefulness of conviction.

He did not get reclusive and melancholy about his passions like the Fi types, he went out to champion them every chance he got as explicitly as possible.

Schopenhauer's genius was chiefly manifestation of Ni. However this does little to sugges that he was an INTJ rather than an INFJ.

Hegel was an INTP. Yes, Schopenhauer did have intellectual reasons for reviling Hegel, as he thought his philosophy was unsound. However, his personal reasons seem to far outweigh the intellectual as he often refers to him as the 'wretched charlatan'. He also wrote about his dismay for Hegel for confusing the minds of the youth. This is also more akin to Fe, as he was concerned for the welfare of his environment, unlike a Te type who sought to impose an impersonal regime onto his environment, E.G Nietzsche.

Schopenhauer was a very serious person, yes, almost from the get-go, however, this is not evidence of him being a Te type rather than Fe. A more plausible explanation that I see is that his Ni was preponderous over Fe.

It's happy to talk with you.
Neither Schopenhauer nor MBTI is popular in China,it's difficult to find someone to talk about both of them.In fact,we have no complete translated version of The World as Will and Representation and other Schopenhauer 's works.
Although almost all the Chinese know Karl Max,only few are interested in studying communism.Philosophy is strange to most people.


By the way:Is Spinoza an INTP?
 

Uytuun

New member
Joined
Apr 19, 2008
Messages
1,633
MBTI Type
nnnn
Very interesting to see how I am naturally drawn more towards the philosophers BW describes as INTJ: Nietzsche, Hobbes, Popper...even Heraclitos.
 

LunarMoon

New member
Joined
Oct 19, 2007
Messages
309
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
3
I disagree. ENTJs use Se as often as ENTPs use Fe. Both types do not know how use to these functrions properly.
Simply because ENTJs don’t use it as efficiently as pure Artisans doesn’t mean they don’t use it; even a type’s inferior function will influence them to an extent, causing many of the weaknesses that most will associate with a given type. In the case of a Tertiary Function, the qualities of that function will be manifested as a clumsily but still visibly used appendage. For example, due to their tertiary Fi INTJs may subscribe to an unusually strong and thorough moral code in comparison to their Rational peers. But the manner in which its manifested is far more clumsy and even dogmatic in view of how it’s used by an INFP.

Low conscientiousness and high openess to experience is an EP trait, making estp's more similar to entps than entjs.
Low Conscientiousness and high Openness to Experience is an xxNP trait so Artisans don’t inherently possess it. High Openness to Experience is related to Intuition, not Perceiving. Likewise, the external behavior of an MBTI type is controlled in large part by the functions as opposed to the simple dichotomy. An ENTJ’s functional make-up is a lot closer to that of an ESTP than an ENTP’s is and regardless of how the dichotomy shows up, the Perceiving behavior of an ENTP simply won’t have the specific characteristics of Se.

What is more nuts about this paragraph is that Warren Buffet is an ENTP. If he doesn't know how to handle money, then who does?
I agree with Untypable. His manner of accumulating money is very different from the way in which Bill Gates or Ted Turner succeeded in doing so, through collection of enterprises and calculated risks. Warren Buffet, while very successful within his business and stock trading history, is notable for how ridiculously frugal he is for a billionaire. He’s lived in the same house for thirty years and has rarely made any expensive purchases. In comparison, Bill Gates previously bought a home for $125 million at a continuing property tax of $991,000 per year. Warren almost seems SJ in his philosophy on money.

For example Warren Buffet, an ENTP, succeeds because he knows how to pick stocks better than anyone else.

A) Intuition is not random. It's probably best described as insight. Investment can use a lot of logic and analysis, but it also requires insight that most people do not have. If investment did not require insight, then a lot of people could replicate what Warren Buffet does simply by applying reason. In other words we should expect to see a ton of investment billionaires around if logic and analysis were all that was required.
That can be either Ni or Ne at work since both are rare functions. It’s much more likely to be Ni since the entire purpose behind the function is to predict the future of situations and assets.

In the case of Bill Gates and Microsoft, their success is due to being the first company in the software industry. Before Bill Gates everyone thought that the money was in hardware. He had the idea of licensing software and turning it into a marketable product.
Both of the Intuitive functions are rare and would be likely to produce an edge in the market. A focus on unconventional ideas is a primary feature of Intuitives in general.

The success of Microsoft has more to do with Gates' cleverness than his ability to maximize efficiency. A thinker's approach would be to make the best product possible and maximize the efficiency of the company. That is more similar to Apple's approach. Microsoft on the other hand is characterized by using tricks to force out competition and maintain monopoly-like control.

His approach to beating AC current was to trick people into thinking it was evil (by associating it with the electric chair). Again the focus on cleverness and trickery is more of a hallmark of ENTP.
Te combined with Ni doesn’t just maximize efficiency. Te combined with Si attempts to maximize efficiency while simultaneously preserving the current conditions while Ni seeks to maximize efficiency in view of a targeted vision or goal. Cleverness and unconventional approaches to situations is more so a facet of Openness to Experience than anything else. An ENTP is more likely to improvise an Indiana Jones-esque escape route while an INTJ has a higher chance of planning a clever scheme based on a predicted domino effect and conveniently placed pawns, ala the Count of Monte Cristo or the more realistic situation you described. Ni and Ne approach clever actions in these two differing ways while Te within ENTJs never acts by itself.

Likewise on the case of Edison the very fact that his company is focused on creating patents practically guarantees he's an ENTP. A company focused on cranking out new ideas and products is basically an ENTP dream.
As noted by Jack Flak, most of his inventions were soon to be produced by someone else and many of his most famous ones such as the carbon filament light bulb were simply improvements in efficiency on another inventor's model. His only real ENTP quality was that he was an inventor who continually produced good ideas, which is a quality shared by several other non-ENTP figures throughout history. His Te-based actions, flaws, and personality characteristics were far more numerous, including the efficiency based flaw that helped to lower his relationship with Tesla, his rejection of Tesla’s less financially practical ideas.


B) I watched a one hour interview with Warren Buffet a couple of months ago and he was cracking jokes and acting silly through the whole thing. If that doesn't describe an ENTP, then I don't know what does.
Surely you wouldn’t imply that all comedians are ENTP? I’ve seen ISTJs capable of cracking jokes. Humor is a very basic human quality.
 

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
3,376
MBTI Type
ENTP
Surely you wouldn’t imply that all comedians are ENTP? I’ve seen ISTJs capable of cracking jokes. Humor is a very basic human quality.

I'm starting to think that you wouldn't recognize an ENTP if one came up and bit you on the nose. I can tell you that it will be a lot easier to come up with a list of ENTP comics than ISTJ ones. The thing with ENxP's is that regardless of their profession it's very common for them to have an overactive sense of humor. One would not expect an ISTJ CEO to crack jokes constantly throughout an interview. An overactive sense of humor is what you expect from an ENxP.:yes:
 

LunarMoon

New member
Joined
Oct 19, 2007
Messages
309
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
3
I can tell you that it will be a lot easier to come up with a list of ENTP comics than ISTJ ones.
That's exactly my point. Even the ISTJ, the personality stereotyped as being the most inhumorous of them all, demonstrates an appreciation for humor. I.E. humor is a basic human quality that can be found within any type. Stating that a famous figure demonstrates a penchant for telling jokes doesn't designate them as one of the sixteen personality types.

The thing with ENxP's is that regardless of their profession it's very common for them to have an overactive sense of humor. An overactive sense of humor is what you expect from an ENxP.:yes:
The same can be said for all of the Artisans and every one of the Rationals, though in the case of INTJs and INTPs, they carry an Introverted personality so it often isn’t apparent. A sense humor has more to do with high creativity than being of a specific personality type (Getzels and Jackson 1962), and many of the types possess that, INTJs included.
 

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
3,376
MBTI Type
ENTP
That's exactly my point. Even the ISTJ, the personality stereotyped as being the most inhumorous of them all, demonstrates an appreciation for humor. I.E. humor is a basic human quality that can be found within any type. Stating that a famous figure demonstrates a penchant for telling jokes doesn't designate them as one of the sixteen personality types.

The same can be said for all of the Artisans and every one of the Rationals, though in the case of INTJs and INTPs, they carry an Introverted personality so it often isn’t apparent. A sense humor has more to do with high creativity than being of a specific personality type (Getzels and Jackson 1962), and many of the types possess that, INTJs included.

Warren Buffet displays a overactive sense of humor like an ENxP would. I'm not talking about having a sense of humor that you keep to yourself, lol. Warren Buffet acts like an ENxP, because he's an ENTP. It's not just that he tells an occasional joke. He was making jokes the whole time spontaneously...like an ENTP.
 

LunarMoon

New member
Joined
Oct 19, 2007
Messages
309
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
3
Warren Buffet displays a overactive sense of humor like an ENxP would. I'm not talking about having a sense of humor that you keep to yourself, lol. Warren Buffet acts like an ENxP, because he's an ENTP. It's not just that he tells an occasional joke. He was making jokes the whole time spontaneously...like an ENTP.

ENTPs aren't the only type with an overactive sense of humor; anyone who frequents comedy movies or goes around quoting Monty Python could qualify for that. As for the constant jokes throughout the interview it's rather difficult to predict Introversion or Extroversion based on that one factor and almost impossible to predict an exact type from it. Introverts are notorious for speaking as much as Extroverts do within the presence of friends or under certain conditions. In this case it was an interview in which speaking was the main objective.
 

Venom

Babylon Candle
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
2,126
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1w9
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
common theme:

The ENTP invents it (apple, Tesla)
The ENTJ steals it, makes it better, and then sells it (Edison, Gates)


Bill Gates stole an idea, and then used his inner bully to force a monopoly. Microsoft has NEVER been about innovation. They have always been about securing their market by bullying out competitors.

I see apple and Steve Jobs as the more ENTP company.


I have read in numerous places that Buffet was an ISTJ. I see no reason to think otherwise:

-he is frugal, risk averse, and is not some crazy entrepreneurial risk taker.
-my grandpa is an ISTJ who has lots of funny sayings (that get really old). If you met him for the first time, like in an interview, you would think he was hilarious too.
 

Edgar

Nerd King Usurper
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
4,266
MBTI Type
INTJ
Instinctual Variant
sx
Stanley Kubrick, INTJ

I always thought Kubrick to be an INTP. He went to ridiculous lengths for his research - the kind of drive that only INTPs thirst for trivial knowledge can justify. And his directing style involved showing up at the set and taking an enormous amount of takes, which can be explained with the fact that he had a general idea of what he wanted, and then played by ear until he got it right (hence P). An INTJ director would a lot more precise with his execution.
 

BlackOp

New member
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Messages
211
MBTI Type
intj
I always thought Kubrick to be an INTP. He went to ridiculous lengths for his research - the kind of drive that only INTPs thirst for trivial knowledge can justify. And his directing style involved showing up at the set and taking an enormous amount of takes, which can be explained with the fact that he had a general idea of what he wanted, and then played by ear until he got it right (hence P). An INTJ director would a lot more precise with his execution.

No...Kubrick is an intj. Molded cinema to his sensibilities. I have studied him extensively...true embodiment of a mastermind. INTPs dont put conceptual ideas in motion with such linear conviction. There is a common tone that is undisrupted regardless of topic or premise throughout his body of work. He did so many take because he knew what he was looking for... a deliberate result. He was the quintessential "does it work/make it work' director.
 

Jack Flak

Permabanned
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
9,098
MBTI Type
type
Kubrick isn't INTP. I've thought INTJ or ENTP from time to time. One of my favorite filmmakers. He can do no wrong in my eyes.
 

Edgar

Nerd King Usurper
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
4,266
MBTI Type
INTJ
Instinctual Variant
sx
What do you guys figure made Kubrick an INTJ (as opposed to INTP)?

I'm curious to know.
 

Edgar

Nerd King Usurper
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
4,266
MBTI Type
INTJ
Instinctual Variant
sx
Deliberate action.

I don't know, he never struck me as "deliberate". There was no consistency in the way he made movies (it ranged from every two years to once a decade) and he had various unfinished projects that he researched in depth but never brought to life (like Napoleon and A.I.).

And he also had that shaggy INTP look to him.
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
1,755
common theme:

The ENTP invents it (apple, Tesla)
The ENTJ steals it, makes it better, and then sells it (Edison, Gates)


Bill Gates stole an idea, and then used his inner bully to force a monopoly. Microsoft has NEVER been about innovation. They have always been about securing their market by bullying out competitors.

I see apple and Steve Jobs as the more ENTP company.

No sir, i disagree with this.

Steve Jobs has a strong J tendency in him, he got misclassed as an ENTP because innovation is often confused with entpism. If I were to classify Jobs, i woulf say he is an entj with a strong N. Apple has a very strong Ni vibe. And steve often trust his own ideas and shoot down ideas that are not his own, A very Ni thing. Whereareas Ne would trust and be open with anyone's ideas and steal them if necessary.

And steve is a perfectionist, ENTP's are not bery perfectionistic.

If i were to name an ENTp company, it would be google.
 
Top