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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Semantics will now ensue

    Conviction is emotional. Conclusion is objective.

    If INTPs are the most objective of types then why can they not achieve the simplest of things without recourse to redundant thinking and posturing. It has been my experience that an INTP will try to reinvent the wheel before he or she will accept that it is a valid solution. Such is based in subjectivity as is the whole problem with authority. INTPs like to validate data for themselves but in doing so they are inferring themselves as an authority, which is entirely subjective.

    Note I do not argue that under certain parameters which you have stated or inferred that INTPs are very objective. What I do question is the foundation for these parameters.
    To say anyone is 100% objective is false. The question is degree, and the answer is in the OP.

    While trimming my nails, I've come up with a tentative representation of the thought process behind my conclusion.

    Type/Area of Most Experience On Average

    INTP/Analysis
    ENTP/Object Manipulation
    INTJ/Self Advancement
    ENTJ/Human Manipulation

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    To say anyone is 100% objective is false. The question is degree, and the answer is in the OP.

    While trimming my nails, I've come up with a tentative representation of the thought process behind my conclusion.

    Type/Area of Most Experience On Average

    INTP/Analysis
    ENTP/Object Manipulation
    INTJ/Self Advancement
    ENTJ/Human Manipulation
    Ooooh! Jack's losing his objectivity.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    Ooooh! Jack's losing his objectivity.
    I never had any to begin with. I was merely discussing the archetypical members of type, which I am not one of...But wait, this makes me extremely objective...It's a logical nightmare.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick View Post
    ENTJ: System Manipulation (Goals, Policies, Rules, Criteria, etc.)
    I would agree to that except how would you then define the ENTP activity, because it could be called the same (System Manip.).

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    ...It's a logical nightmare.
    welcome to my world
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #96
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    ...
    Type/Area of Most Experience On Average

    INTJ/Self Advancement
    Since I am an INTJ, I would like to understand what you mean by "Self Advancement".
    Would you - or someone - please explain it to me?
    I couldn't make out the meaning just from the context.
    (The reason I ask is because it sounds like "self-promotion" which INTJs are stereotypically bad at.)

  7. #97
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    It means such as choosing a career or area of interest and concerning oneself with excellence in it, and specifically being better than others.

    Arnold Schwarzenegger is the perfect example. In the film Pumping Iron, in 1977, while he was generally considered the best bodybuilder of all time, he discussed possibly getting majorly into the movie business in Hollywood, then someday moving on to politics. He did exactly that.

  8. #98
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    It is about personality.
    If it's all about personality, or lack thereof, then INTPs win going away.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    If it's all about personality, or lack thereof, then INTPs win going away.
    Touche!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  10. #100
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    It means such as choosing a career or area of interest and concerning oneself with excellence in it, and specifically being better than others.

    Arnold Schwarzenegger is the perfect example. In the film Pumping Iron, in 1977, while he was generally considered the best bodybuilder of all time, he discussed possibly getting majorly into the movie business in Hollywood, then someday moving on to politics. He did exactly that.
    Ok. I guess I can agree with that since I am loath to do something if I'm going to be incompetent at it.

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