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  1. #1
    Clean Slate CitizenErased's Avatar
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    Default Ti, inconsistency, and turning people into systems

    Hey!

    I've been discussing about Ti's tendency to build systems (the same way it builds its own system to analyze/revisit information) with other INTPs and we all agreed that, to some extent, Ti also constructs systems of other people, being able to predict some of their actions (though not to a social level in which you know something you say is going to make someone mad). It's as if every person we encounter becomes an abstraction, a system (like a stereotype of its own?), and every "system" (person) becomes consistent. It's different from labelling people, because every person is a separate abstraction, I just wanted to make that clear.

    Unless it's another Ti-user, or oneself. We were also discussing that the way Ti updates itself (mainly when it's dom/aux) makes us seem inconsistent sometimes, because we always change our values, meanings, preferences, etc depending on how we evaluate them.

    So, do you turn people into systems? If so, do you find it convenient/comfortable or you try to neglect the "abstractions" you make of people? Do you believe it's because of Ti or not (or a mix between Ti and some other function), or just Ti-doms?

    As a Ti user, do you often find people consistent? Do you find yourself or other Ti users inconsistent?

    Non-Ti users, do you find Ti user inconsistent? Do you construct people into systems?
    MBTI: INTP (though I'm PINT-sized) * Ti = Ne > Fi > Ni > Si > Te = Se >>> Fe
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    Omnis res est se ipsa singularis et per nihil aliud
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenErased View Post
    Hey!

    I've been discussing about Ti's tendency to build systems (the same way it builds its own system to analyze/revisit information) with other INTPs and we all agreed that, to some extent, Ti also constructs systems of other people, being able to predict some of their actions (though not to a social level in which you know something you say is going to make someone mad). It's as if every person we encounter becomes an abstraction, a system (like a stereotype of its own?), and every "system" (person) becomes consistent. It's different from labelling people, because every person is a separate abstraction, I just wanted to make that clear.

    Unless it's another Ti-user, or oneself. We were also discussing that the way Ti updates itself (mainly when it's dom/aux) makes us seem inconsistent sometimes, because we always change our values, meanings, preferences, etc depending on how we evaluate them.

    So, do you turn people into systems? If so, do you find it convenient/comfortable or you try to neglect the "abstractions" you make of people? Do you believe it's because of Ti or not (or a mix between Ti and some other function), or just Ti-doms?

    As a Ti user, do you often find people consistent? Do you find yourself or other Ti users inconsistent?

    Non-Ti users, do you find Ti user inconsistent? Do you construct people into systems?

    As a dom Ti I am pretty good at knowing a person on a social level. Now what I will not claim is that I will get it right everytime because I really have no control over the person external environment outside of mine and their conversation. I am pretty good at picking up those moments after the fact. I may even directly challenge the person in a manner that makes them go "this is whats bothering me" as well. Its all part of the internal understanding I build of how systems work. People fit into that very well and have been told by many that I am actually VERY good at learning people because I actually listen, process, understand as that's the most important part of building a system.

    What I will never claim to know is how a person will react upon meeting them, I don't apply "stereotypes" or abstractions unless I know they fit. I don't say, oh thats a guy he will be like this. I may group "guys" into a stereotype, but never a person into a guy until I know that person. That's a more extroverted thing and the way an introvert actually has to get around that is just flat our not knowing and running with it. I don't really have much faith in external systems or abstractions unless I actually know it fits. At that point I have internalized it.

    I find most people very consistant, even if the consistency is that there is a lack of consistency. My ex is one that to this day baffles me, I know her very well, I know what she values, cares about, etc. but I could not even come close to devising a system to determine her thoughts or answers as they have no consistency and are very emotionally driven goal based without any sense what so ever even when you know her goal. My system says "flip a coin is the best you will get to a good vs bad response as that is actually the accurate probability". I will adjust probability as time goes on and the probability will slide back and forth. That's as close to consistant as I can get.


    If you wanna see the INTP side search for EricB on here

    Don't confuse with a Te system.
    Im out, its been fun
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  3. #3
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Yes I do this as a Fi type.
    Before I discovered typology I already picked up on these patterns, but I had no language for it.
    I very much pick up on an invididual's pattern as well as larger patterns in people. It is definitely a system and I can often predict behaviors or responses by it. But it's so theoretical for me. In real time, I am a helpless observer who can analyze, but not put it into use.

    So where I fail is the dynamics of social interactions, aka the extroverted stuff. I understand people's internal motivations better, sometimes motivations they seem unaware of themselves (people hate when NFs claim this, but then they love it when we help them uncover those motivations).
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe
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  4. #4
    SpaceCadetGoldStarBrigade Population: 1's Avatar
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    I'm able to figure most people out fairly quickly in person. People leave little breadcrumb trails to their underlying topography and I can often follow them back to their own little realm. Well at least the outskirts. Note I said in person. Online is completely void of tiny physical cues and tone and inflection so I have to read between the lines going off of what they don't say as much as what they do and also how they word things.

    I have some kind of system but if you asked me to give you a detailed breakdown of it I'll likely start blathering and become really perplexed because apparently it's as much a subconscious process as it is a conscious one for me and I can't clearly define it for myself.

    Edit: I hope that made as much sense to everyone as it did to me. Sometimes I'm actually concise with my thoughts. Sometimes.
    To give real service you must add something which cannot be bought or measured with money, and that is sincerity and integrity. Douglas Adams

    As per orders of the No likes experiment I am not liking posts for the duration.
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  5. #5
    Mind Wanderer Zeego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenErased View Post
    So, do you turn people into systems? If so, do you find it convenient/comfortable or you try to neglect the "abstractions" you make of people? Do you believe it's because of Ti or not (or a mix between Ti and some other function), or just Ti-doms?
    I used to turn people into systems more than I do now, and learning about the Grant/Beebe stack and Socionics made that even more intense for a while. I still do it now to some extent (I think it's just a part of how I process the world), though not as much as I used to. I take more of an "analog" approach to mentally modeling people, which might be why I've been putting less stock in a lot of cognitive function models lately.

    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenErased View Post
    As a Ti user, do you often find people consistent? Do you find yourself or other Ti users inconsistent?
    I am inconsistent in that my personality is a bit self-contradictory. I often find myself fluctuating between extremes of rationality and irrationality, logic and emotion, science and spirituality. I've been interested in those kinds of dichotomies for a while, whether they are naturally opposites or artificially so, and I like exploring both sides of them.

    As for other people, I've come to accept the fact that the universe is ruled by chaos, and people can often be unpredictable even to themselves. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, it's just how humans are.
    We will meet again in Etruria.

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  6. #6
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poki View Post
    I may even directly challenge the person in a manner that makes them go "this is whats bothering me" as well. Its all part of the internal understanding I build of how systems work. .
    I don't know about you but I don't like getting there because when I do? I often haven't thought about the aftermath too much. It's like, I got this and I'm going to show you yourself here. Then I become Oppenheimer, destroyer of worlds. Keymaster of drama. Breaker of Chains. Khaleesi.....





    [I][B]So, do you turn people into systems? If so, do you find it convenient/comfortable or you try to neglect the "abstractions" you make of people? Do you believe it's because of Ti or not (or a mix between Ti and some other function), or just Ti-doms?
    I tend to take people as they come. What do you mean by "abstractions" here?


    As a Ti user, do you often find people consistent? Do you find yourself or other Ti users inconsistent?
    Do I know them? Makes a difference. I think people as a whole are predictable but not necessarily consistent.
    ~luck favors the ready~


    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    I don't know about you but I don't like getting there because when I do? I often haven't thought about the aftermath too much. It's like, I got this and I'm going to show you yourself here. Then I become Oppenheimer, destroyer of worlds. Keymaster of drama. Breaker of Chains. Khaleesi.....
    I am more like a rock in that instance. They end up between a rock and their own hard place. I try to avoid destroy the world style...man does it build up though. Ex-GF used to say dont poke the sleeping bear. Most dont
    Im out, its been fun
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  8. #8
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poki View Post
    I am more like a rock in that instance. They end up between a rock and their own hard place. I try to avoid destroy the world style...man does it build up though. Ex-GF used to say dont poke the sleeping bear. Most dont
    I was just going to say, how can it not be destroy the world style with an ENFJ?? That's who I had in mind when I thought of that.
    ~luck favors the ready~


    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Population: 1 View Post
    I'm able to figure most people out fairly quickly in person. People leave little breadcrumb trails to their underlying topography and I can often follow them back to their own little realm. Well at least the outskirts. Note I said in person. Online is completely void of tiny physical cues and tone and inflection so I have to read between the lines going off of what they don't say as much as what they do and also how they word things.

    I have some kind of system but if you asked me to give you a detailed breakdown of it I'll likely start blathering and become really perplexed because apparently it's as much a subconscious process as it is a conscious one for me and I can't clearly define it for myself.

    Edit: I hope that made as much sense to everyone as it did to me. Sometimes I'm actually concise with my thoughts. Sometimes.
    I agree with detailed breakdown. Its complicated as shit, but eady for me to navigate
    Im out, its been fun
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  10. #10
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    People ARE SYSTEMS

    sys·tem
    ˈsistəm/
    noun
    1.
    a set of connected things or parts forming a complex whole, in particular.



    Regarding the inconsistency thing not sure I follow. Maybe it's a function of youth. My ethics etc have been pretty consistent so far. With the occasional fuck up. But rare.
    Though i agree that yes humans are generally inconsistent but isn't it the "job" of a function like Ti to make us internally consistent ?
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
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    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE
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