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  1. #231
    Wait, what? Varelse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jae Rae View Post
    .He also has no filter on yucky topics and has to be reminded again and again
    that I don't want to hear about blood, disgusting crimes or operations at the
    dinner table. To him it's just information. Recently, he tried to discuss who was worse, Hitler or Stalin - both killed their own people, but Hitler treated the Jews like vermin, not like people. This is mealtime conversation?
    What's wrong with discussing such things? Actually, the only person I know who's really disturbed by such is an ISFJ. Pretty much everyone else is ok-especially my brothers.

    I don't mind discussing death. Perhaps it's too familiar to me.

    Oh, and I've been told I apologize too much.
    We are not poets
    We have no right to make amendments

  2. #232
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Case in point: I know an ISFJ who was in forensics and could poke at a dead body while eating a sandwich. She has a cast iron stomach.

    I think the problem stated above was not the subject matter so much as when the topic arose -- dinner. That's inappropriate. He can logically control himself long enough to refrain from such discourse until everyone is done eating. Imposing unwanted conversation on the people he's chosen for company (i.e. his family) is unacceptable. Hence, the horrified laughing. It doesn't matter if it's about fluffy bunnies or chainsaw murders. If fluffy bunnies offend the people you've chosen to associate with, then no fluffy bunnies.

    No doubt his forensic mind is appreciated the rest of the time.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  3. #233
    Wait, what? Varelse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I think the problem stated above was not the subject matter so much as when the topic arose -- dinner. That's inappropriate. He can logically control himself long enough to refrain from such discourse until everyone is done eating. Imposing unwanted conversation on the people he's chosen for company (i.e. his family) is unacceptable. Hence, the horrified laughing. It doesn't matter if it's about fluffy bunnies or chainsaw murders. If fluffy bunnies offend the people you've chosen to associate with, then no fluffy bunnies.
    Why?

    Most of the people I know who are easily offended by such seem to be trying to delude themselves into pretending it doesn't exist. (No offense intended). But I prefer not to have people for company who are that easily offended. Then my honesty is inherently a problem with them.
    We are not poets
    We have no right to make amendments

  4. #234
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Could it be that your honesty (which is great thing) could be bridled in a temporary fashion for when you're in company? It's not about not being truthful. It's about being uncouth. Social mores DO count, do carry weight, do hold back or promote a person, so it's important to consider that. Saying that it doesn't matter would be naive. One of your best assets, your honesty, would quickly be perceived as too blunt or boorish, and that defeats the purpose of making yourself understood (that's the point of conversation with anyone -- making yourself understood and exchanging ideas, not compelling others INTO a thought they don't want to have.)

    Certainly you have friends who don't care about blood and guts at the table, and these are the people you're most comfortable with, but many people do care (or even if it was a small minority) it doesn't hurt to control yourself for an hour or two, at least until you can exit their presence. Making allowances for others is just that. An allowance. Not a permanent drastic imposition on your way of life. I don't discuss certain things with certain people because I care about them and I know that some topics will disturb them, not because I'm pussyfooting around their fragile glass-like egos. Brittle people are a hassle, but family/friends, not so.

    Johnny Rotten, one of my favorite people, even said himself that there are times when he's said things that he felt were true, but were scathing, inappropriate or just flat-out acid. He says his wife has been a great tempering force on his outspoken nature. Is he any less Johnny? Not at all. And no doubt he hangs around people that allow for him to be what he is -- a loudmouthed acerbic punk.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  5. #235
    Free-Rangin' Librarian Jae Rae's Avatar
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    In response to your last reply, yes, the forensic mind is appreciated. He
    also has a gift for staying calm which is wonderful.
    I relate well to NTPs in general, having a husband, son, close friend and a boss of 22 years who fit that description. This forum is excellent and I've already benefited from being on it. I look forward to more type talk from the NTs and NFs. Although my type is ISFJ, I find myself nearer to NF typology as time goes on, and enjoy exploring writing and other forms of self-expression, intuition, spirituality and meditation.

  6. #236
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jae Rae View Post
    On the other hand, he's something of a kitchen bully - no one can do things as well as he can in the kitchen. He's quite proud of his ability and friends rave about his food. However, it's hard on the rest of us, who can't do things in the kitchen without comments, suggestions or constructive criticism.

    He also has no filter on yucky topics and has to be reminded again and again
    that I don't want to hear about blood, disgusting crimes or operations at the
    dinner table. To him it's just information. Recently, he tried to discuss who was worse, Hitler or Stalin - both killed their own people, but Hitler treated the Jews like vermin, not like people. This is mealtime conversation?
    On the kitchen bullying part -- OMG, is this an NT thing?? That makes so much sense now...I have 2 NT friends and between the two, they fill the requirements of being a good cook AND a cooking bully (1 is a good cook, 1 is a kitchen bully, it actually drives other people nuts)

    On the second part -- HAHAHAHAHAH. Actually, I do discuss 'heavy topics' things like this including at dinner but only with people want to discuss them. And not usually about things like genocide, war, or murder or other violent crimes (not my cup o' tea) but once in a while I DO discuss things like strange diseases and graphic surgeries that I've seen on Discovery Health Channel. Actually, scratch that, I try to and when people start screaming and make faces and yell at me to stop.

    And I'm not even NT. LOL.

    PinkPiranha, I swear I don't do this in new company and otherwise I make a great dinner guest. My friends sometimes like the disease/surgery topic at hand over a meal, and sometimes...no.

    My ISTJ friend said when I stayed with her sometimes she would just peek in to see what I was watching on TV and it was some 'gross surgery show' on TLC and she couldn't watch it with me.

  7. #237
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
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    Jae Rae, I know this isn't your intro thread, but I just have to say: Welcome!

  8. #238
    Wait, what? Varelse's Avatar
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    I was only being semi-serious, PinkPirahna. But good points. I'm just too used to having to fake things around most people-if I say something "sucks" they'll act like I sacrificed a virgin.
    We are not poets
    We have no right to make amendments

  9. #239
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post

    PinkPiranha, I swear I don't do this in new company and otherwise I make a great dinner guest.
    *shakes a shame-on-you finger in your direction* LOL!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Varelse View Post
    I was only being semi-serious, PinkPirahna. But good points. I'm just too used to having to fake things around most people-if I say something "sucks" they'll act like I sacrificed a virgin.
    Oh I know, I was trying to perhaps, in my rambling ENFJ manner, make unpleasant stifling social moments for you a bit easier? My INTJ and ENTJ get SO annoyed with having to check everything they're thinking and saying for the sake of others, so I get it. It's a struggle for me too sometimes. (I march into my room, slam the door and bellow every last profanity-laced eyebrow-searing un-PC thing rattling around in my head until I feel calmer. LOL!)

    Sacrificing virgins is absolutely good table talk! I like to roll 'em right into the volcano! All that screaming gets the ol' blood goin' in the morning!!
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  10. #240
    Senior Member DaRick's Avatar
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    Well, since INTP's and INTJ's are different, I will decry both types individually:

    INTJ
    1) Remote and withdrawn
    2) Reluctant or unable to praise the efforts of others
    3) Rarely admit that they have flaws

    INTP
    1) Poorly organised
    2) Can provide 'empty compliments' (i.e - insincere compliments)
    3) Can 'backstab' without realising the emotional consequences for their victim

    These are just my personal experiences. Sorry if I have offended anybody.
    MBTI: INFJ (I: 100% N:58% F: 58% J: 84%)
    Socionics: INFJ
    Enneagram: 4w5 sp/so/sx

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