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  1. #21
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uytuun View Post
    So then what would be the difference with a Fe manifestation of external warmth and understanding? I have noticed that I'm better at and more comfortable with comforting my ESFP friend than at dealing with my INFJ friend's or my ESFJ mother's emotions - I feel ineffective or (at times) held back with them, despite sensing the Fi-ing inside. There's nothing to connect the Fi to. Hmm...I feel like it's empathy (Fi) vs. sympathy (Fe) sometimes.
    Fe makes value judgments based on the external standard, Fi the internal.

    So an Fe user's values will actually change when they're interacting with other people, as the external standard is different. Fe is about appropriateness given the situation.

    Fi's values are validated internally, so they have to match up with the situation for them to empathize.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Uytuun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dissonance View Post
    Fe makes value judgments based on the external standard, Fi the internal.

    So an Fe user's values will actually change when they're interacting with other people, as the external standard is different. Fe is about appropriateness given the situation.

    Fi's values are validated internally, so they have to match up with the situation for them to empathize.
    Yes, but perhaps a more concrete example of how you as a feeler notice the difference? I stand by my sympathy-empathy thing.

    From Wikipedia: "Sympathy should not be confused with empathy (more than simply the recognition of another's suffering, empathy is actually sharing another's suffering, if only briefly)." I definitely notice this in daily life. Fe is "wide", overt, there for everyone, Fi is "deep", unclear and rarer.

    To me, Fe often feels empty and it always surprises me how Fe users don't "experience the outlook or emotions of another being within oneself" (again from wikipedia) - they can be surprisingly cold.

    Don't take it personally.

  3. #23
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Well, Fe users look obvious to me because there's a sort of chameleon effect -- they WANT to agree with the people around them. They also get mad when someone does something "inappropriate", like doing something that makes the group dynamic worse (someone refusing to compromise for the sake of the group).

  4. #24
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uytuun View Post
    What I meant was that I have a comparatively weak Te for an INTJ. And a comparatively very high Ni. I didn't speak about the order of the functions.
    Although I agree with dissonance that an INTJ can have a "stronger" Fi than Te,
    Im going to somewhat pick up from smileyman that ultimately the "correctly built" INTJ will have Te built up at least to the level of Fi and certainly shouldnt be less.

    for example: I have a very good friend who is INTJ in that she is Ni Fi and horrifically defunct in everything else! She has to be INTJ because its Ni Fi and not Ni Ti. However, it doesnt make it "okay". Its like shes a broken type. someone who neglects their auxilary will have some issues.

    For instance, the Ni Fi girl i mentioned is probably the dumbbest and least effective INTJ I know. She analyzes the world through Ni, and then makes judgments on Fi...without any LOGIC (Te)!!!! She simply comes to intuitive conclusions through inner values and she cant explain why she does or believes anything. She cant effectively troubleshoot or deal with the outside world. As an ENFP, my own Te trumps hers...its sad.

    But yes, you dont have to be Ni Te Fi to be INTJ....but you would be a better INTJ if you were Ni Te Fi Se etc....

  5. #25
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    I get very frustrated when it does not work.

    Because, when it comes to doing things, it's all I've got.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  6. #26
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    I have weakish Te, imo. I mostly only apply it when I have an idea or goal I feel like I can't be without. But I simply don't use it that frequently. Sometimes I do think I use Ti since I often do more organizing and planning internally, but I feel like tertiary Fi fits, and I think (thought I'm not sure) I use Ni, so if that's the case INTJ is likely my type. Unless I'm an INFJ with stronger Ti than Fe...

    I see my Fe as very weak, but my Te as also weak, so I don't get it.

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