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[INTJ] INTJ flirting

Usehername

On a mission
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May 30, 2007
Messages
3,794
I have ethics against flirting.

Why, you ask?

a) The objective behind flirting is to form a romantic relationship with that person (Assuming you are not one who does it just for the fun. I'm assuming most introverts do not.)
b) I want to develop a relationship formed on the best analysis of who that person is.
c) When you're flirting, you're acting. You're not behaving as you normally do.
d) Flirting is therefore a detraction from the main objective. It wastes time, b/c it takes way longer to figure out the practicalness if that person is someone that you should actually be attracted to.

I see flirting as a complete waste of time. I'd rather just not hide the fact that I'm interested, and then wait until I feel comfortable enough to be frank with my feelings.

I'm mildly scared that by flirting I will be unintentionally giving off a false version of myself; I don't want people to do that with me and therefore don't flirt.


The downside, of course, as an ENFP friend of mine pointed out, is that I likely give off "mixed signals" because I don't treat the object of my desire any differently. In my head, I like to think that I do, but that's up for discussion, I suppose.
 

rivercrow

shoshaku jushaku
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type
Cool!

I had an INTJ explain very carefully to me the difference between flirting with intent and flirting without intent. He was always very aware of how he was flirting and would size up the actions of others on the same scale.
 

htb

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Outside of controlled situations, I eschew flirting and, post hoc, am terrible at it.

The closest I've come to enjoying and succeeding at flirting is while debating in conversation -- playing games of oneupmanship -- with ENTJ girls. A forgotten episode recently came to mind, and the memory is a very happy one.
 

Usehername

On a mission
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Messages
3,794
Outside of controlled situations, I eschew flirting and, post hoc, am terrible at it.

The closest I've come to enjoying and succeeding at flirting is while debating in conversation -- playing games of oneupmanship -- with ENTJ girls. A forgotten episode recently came to mind, and the memory is a very happy one.

OH YEAH I was gonna mention that!

If it's "intellectual flirtation" then I'm all for it; flirting with neural connections is what I'm all about. But at the same time, I could be having the same conversation with a female and obviously have no romantic intent.

But I don't think I'd be as passionate if I didn't already feel something toward the person:)
 

htb

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But I don't think I'd be as passionate if I didn't already feel something toward the person
You may be surprised. I had just met the aforementioned girl. At the end of the evening my friend noted that he had never seen such chemistry between myself and -- well, anybody.
 

cafe

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Does that mean INTJs don't flirt with their spouses? Because that would be really no fun.
 

Mycroft

The elder Holmes
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Jun 7, 2007
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Ah yes, "intellectual flirting". The problem I've encountered is that only other Js will do this sort of thing and I've established that I prefer to be in relationships with Ps.

As for typical flirting, I virtually never emote so when I try to I look completely ridiculous. Like when Linus chided Lucy, telling her she was incapable of smiling, and she tried to prove him wrong but only succeeded in frowning even more sharply when she attempted it.

I've just accepted that some girls think I look like a sociopath and others think I look confident and go from there.
 

spartan26

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Apr 29, 2007
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Yeah, I don't know. This intellectual flirting sounds a lot like "victimless crime." Maybe you feel dorky giving the come hither look or can't toss your hair back without looking like you've just caught yourself nodding off while driving but to suggest one is acceptable while the other is not I think is a bit of a stretch.
a) The objective behind flirting is to form a romantic relationship with that person
c) When you're flirting, you're acting. You're not behaving as you normally do.

I see flirting as a complete waste of time. I'd rather just not hide the fact that I'm interested, and then wait until I feel comfortable enough to be frank with my feelings.

I'm mildly scared that by flirting I will be unintentionally giving off a false version of myself; I don't want people to do that with me and therefore don't flirt.
Don't over think attraction. It seems like something more an INTP male to believe that there's always something sinister behind a woman's every action. Some just do it because they like to have a deeper communication experience. One with not just words but echoing body movement. Some do it as an extension of how they're feeling about themselves or their environment - men and women I'm talking about here. I wouldn't leap ahead to looking for a romantic relationship when it really may just be saying hello and finding something someone interesting.

Sure some people really like to be a tease when they flirt but sometimes it could be a method to find out what a person is like. They might flirt and see how you respond. If you don't meet the criteria of what they're looking for, they might move on. It might not have been an intentional mislead from the start. Like say you're at a bar or party and you wind up in a conversation with someone. You want to have an intelligent talk with this person with big deep eyes and engage in a convo on what, if any, effects immigration is having on the M1 money supply and the person across from you responds by saying "I was a banker once for monopoly. It totally sucteded cuz I ran out of 100's..." You'd probably just smile, nod your head and inform that person "Hey, Access Hollywood is on" before moving on to the other side of the room.

In times of nervousness and stress, we revert to our weakest function. Patience needs to figure into the like/dislike, date/don't date equation. First impressions are important but not everybody treats every encounter with a new individual as a job interview. Plenty of people not only date but fall in love and marry people they didn't like right off the bat. Trying to assign an intellectual reason behind a person's every action will only cause you to miss out.

Purposefully hiding your feelings is akin to burying your head in the sand. You're gonna give off signs involuntarily. Second, I hate to say, it's not going to protect you from the pain. Worst of all, that feeling of shame, the "I'm so stupid. I'm so stupid. I'm so STUPID!" that splits your head down like a spear down to the middle of our chest when you fall for someone who doesn't like you will still be there whether or not you explicitly state your feelings. The rejection is gonna come and it's gonna sting. Problem is you'll probably take a soft no from somebody not joining your group of friends for lunch one day into meaning, "Get away from me your hideous troll. I wouldn't be caught dead with you."

There are those times when flirting or stating your interest in somebody can help the cause. Sometimes people aren't so much not interested as that they haven't considered it. You may flirt with someone and that person might suddenly see you in a different light or really start to pay attention to you. Or, stating that interest may show you to be a little more confident than that person initially given you credit for. Granted I probably missed more signs in flirting since adolescence on than sitting in the interior facing seats of my parent's Country Squire station wagon.

I think it's noble to do your best not to lead anyone on but flirting can be merely a step. It'd be just as wrong to take someone touching your hand as you light that person's cigarette as an indication you'll be on your way to booking a room at the Hyatt w/in the hour.

Sucking at something or not understanding something doesn't make it useless or a crime. Even being honest in your inability or reluctance in the matter can be charming to some people you engage with.
 

Cerpin_Taxt

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May 8, 2007
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Oh god I hate flirting, if you have something to say just fucking say it already.
It just strike's me as pointlessly mysterious, but whatever. People are strange when your a stranger.

I'm very oblivious to flirting, and it's usually only pointed out to me by friends about 5-10 mins after the fact.
 

The Ü™

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I have gotten my share of flirty comments through messages at MySpace from fake slut profiles. If this is what flirting really is like, I pity the fools who think I am that easy.

Online, people will often send me the following words and characters: <3, XOXOXO, "hey babe", "hi, sexy", and so forth.

If a flirt sends me a picture of herself in a bikini or shows cheek by pulling down a side of her thong then, quite honestly, I am appalled by her notion that I am that easy, and I will assume that she is a slut.

Besides the obvious superficial flirting technique I described above, I have either not noticed a "coming on" tactic or have not experienced it altogether. I assume that any woman who openly states that I'm a "hottie" or any other "flattering" comment is a slut who is not worth my time and deserves to die.
 

MacGuffin

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They look a lot. Almost as if they dislike you.

Sometimes punching is involved.
 

Shimpei

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I totally agree with Spartan.
It's not exactly what you say but how you say things that makes all the difference. You can say what you want in a playful way as well.
Consider if you're not flirting (you're not playful, or teasing), you may come off less attractive (even boring or too predictable) in the eyes of the opposite sex.
By being playful you radiate confidence and emotional stability, which are very attractive.
 

Siúil a Rúin

when the colors fade
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a) The objective behind flirting is to form a romantic relationship with that person (Assuming you are not one who does it just for the fun. I'm assuming most introverts do not.)
It can also be simply for the purpose of making somebody feel good about themselves. I flirt a bit with guys and girls - mostly as teasing, joking, or letting them know they are attractive.

b) I want to develop a relationship formed on the best analysis of who that person is.
c) When you're flirting, you're acting. You're not behaving as you normally do.
There are all types of flirting, but when I have flirted (and I used to be way too shy to try) I'm actually revealing myself in certain ways.
d) Flirting is therefore a detraction from the main objective. It wastes time, b/c it takes way longer to figure out the practicalness if that person is someone that you should actually be attracted to.
You're right if it is fake like your assumption. Oftentimes it is, so I do understand that.

I'm guessing you'll be alright even without flirting because you sound strong and direct. Those are both qualities men tend to need in women which are rare to find. Your rejection of flirting is also a bit of a challenge to guys. Many will want to conquer you all the more to get past that defiant exterior to make you knees weak, and your cheeks flushed. It's going to happen to you whether you like it or not. And you're prolly cute to boot! :wubbie:
 

Natrushka

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Jun 7, 2007
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Oh I could answer this right now - I've been out in the sun all day and I've had a beer. Maybe two. I've always been a cheap drunk. But I have mundane shit to do tonight. I'll be back </Arnold>
 

Metamorphosis

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You may not enjoy flirting but I'm sure it has a purpose. It's difficult to go from an intellectual conversation to sex with no transition.
 

spartan26

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I assume that any woman who openly states that I'm a "hottie" or any other "flattering" comment is a slut who is not worth my time and deserves to die.
:horor: Good heavens, Uberfuhrer! Where on earth do you expect to find "worthy" women to date, holding signs at a Repeal the 19th Amendment Rally?! :doh:

Honestly, it is not that serious. A woman saying "Hey Hottie" can be merely the equivalent to "What's up, dude," by a male. Sure there are etiquette issues and some acts that are so bold they come across distasteful but give people a chance. There are many reasons why people act the way they do.

Consider the present climate that we live in. Women can feel they have a lot to compete against. Before even getting a guy's attention away from an X-box of X-Games, she's got to deal with getting by the images melded into a guy's psyche of the Madonna-Britney kiss, Beyonce videos, Jessica Simpson calendars and Scarlett Jo pictorials. Without even getting into the surgical cosmetic reconstructions some under go, if you haven't noticed there is a constant barrage aimed at a woman's sense of appearance, clothing ads on TV, diet foods, fashion mags, it never ends.

I do think it is very unfortunate and a sad indictment against society that modesty is so routinely scoffed at but people do adapt to the environment they're in. There's kinda this defense now in the world of athletics that if you don't do performance enhancing drugs you'll never make it because so many others are doing them. The same can hold true for flirting. There are some actions that would be the casual equivalent to the norm of taking protien powders that years ago would've seemed rather racy.

This is not to say you can't or shouldn't be able to identify in your mind what actions would be more like injecting HGH and that you would find subject to banning but I'd urge you not to take every open sign of affection as a sign of moral decay.

Just as people can dismiss NT's as dufuses or nerdy dolts right off by merely looking at their well, rather nerdy appearance, so can the incorrect judgment go the other way in defining a women as slutty. There's gotta be some give and take. I mean have you even thought about how women can signify that A) they are open and assessable to the thought of meeting someone or B) that they might be specifically interested in you? It's gotta start somewhere. Even for the people who wed in Vegas 5 hours after meeting one another had the initial smile and hello. You may really have to face some control issues, among other things, if you expect a woman to walk around in a Laura Ingalls' dress and submit a written application for dating between the hours of 3-5 PM on M-W-F.

Although in may sound conniving, some appearance and flirty stuff is just like flyers to get people interested, to get people to check out what's inside. Not a "Take Free" sign. A low cut top or bikini photo can mean "hey, look at me," not necessarily "hey, I'll do whoever now in the parking lot." Some people like attention, others do not.

Honestly, this is all coming from a place of empathy and experience. (Of which I'm obviously warning others not just trying to in any way attack you.) Many a night I have anguished away over what I could've said or could've done but I'm telling you now you don't get that time back. I am still guilty of probably dismissing outright in my head without so much as greeting a woman who seems a little too...welcoming, shall we say. But there were those time and those cases where I believed a woman to be one way when she was totally not. After a very short time of getting to know one of them, that sort of slutty appearance I had for them in my mind was quickly erased and replaced with a more endearing image. I'd strongly recommend telling the flirters on MySpace or whoever you meet in life, "Hey, you're moving a bit too fast for me" and just see where that goes. While you'll probably get some who'll slap the back of their hand against their forehead and give you the captain's L, others will step back and prolly wanna get to know someone who stands out from the norm.

Be forewarned that if your distrust of all things flirty is coming from a place of anger, resentment or deep negativity, it's gonna come out and these women will move on so you better be prepared for self examination from that point on.
 

nottaprettygal

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May 1, 2007
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Y'all are a bunch of uptight Js. Flirting=fun. I flirt all the time in my own way, which usually means that I pretend to hate your guts. Although it gets confusing when I really do hate your guts.
 
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