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[INTJ] Why do INTJ still keep in touch with their exes... too much?

ImNoBozo

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ENFP female here, recently met this INTJ, hit it off, he directly told me he wants to pursue and date me, I said the feelings are mutual. We met online and video chatted, we live too many states away, I'm suppose to meet him next month in person. We already have insane amounts of chemistry and he even professed to me that he's not had a connection like this before. We used to talk all the time when we first met, now not as much. He said he's been "busy" with his new job.

Well....

I was going through his facebook page and I learned he started talking to me right around the time he broke up with his ex girlfriend (so what am I here, a rebound???). They were together for 1.5 years. They are no longer friends on facebook. However, they are still in touch, he helps her with her business, and I learned this through the facebook business page his ex girlfriend created for his business and that he "liked". He likes all the stuff she posts, and everything. She once posted a pic of him on there, she also posted another pic with his name and heart emoji's next to it. What is that suppose to mean?

Here's what troubles me:

I've asked him on two separate occasions that if he's seeing someone now, he needs to let me know now so I can move on, it's not fair to me to I told him, I said to him I don't want to become more vulnerable and I NEED TO KNOW NOW, I don't like talking to a guy who's involved with another woman or talking to another women (especially his ex!). When I asked him two separate times, he told me he's not involved with anyone else on those two separate times. And all I can think is, "liar".

Isn't this like cheating? He seems like he's emotionally involved with both me and his ex at this point and it's disgusting that he tells me he's not. His ex, judging from her comments on her business facebook page, clearly wants him still, the heart emojis by his name? Come on. Who even knows if he's even sleeping with her. And he's just as supportive of her, "liking" all of her posts on her page.

I don't even know what to do, or how to overcome this. I've already asked him twice if he's seeing someone else and he said "no". What am I suppose to say, I've been stalking your facebook page and learned otherwise? The information is crystal clear, right there, it's nothing I'm imagining or weaving together.

I would never think an INTJ is this dishonest. I'm an ENFP and despite the reputation my type has, I never lie about these things. Am I overreacting here? Why would INTJs keep in touch with ex's this much?
 

ceecee

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I have no idea. I don't talk to any ex's. They're ex's. That's the point. I never understood the stay friends thing. As far as you are concerned...
I was going through his facebook page

this pretty much means things are over on your end. Something is certainly going on because a) you shouldn't ever be prying like that and b) if there is such a lack of trust and such a huge amount suspicious behavior that you need to verify, there is no trust. You should just cut your losses.
 

BadOctopus

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I don't think it has anything to do with being an INTJ. But if it helps at all, my personal view on the subject of exes is that just because a romantic relationship doesn't work out, that's no reason to discontinue a friendship, if you still like and respect each other. To end a friendship solely on that basis doesn't make sense.

Unless, of course, one party still harbors feelings for the other. In that case, continuing to be friends probably would do more harm than good.
 

ImNoBozo

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I'm very black and white, I either love someone or I don't, I don't love people by halves, that is why I refuse to stay friends with an ex. And I'm an ENFP sx/so.
 

BadOctopus

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You can still love someone, but not be in love with them. My ex and I are good friends, but we realized we were incompatible as a couple. If a relationship ended on good terms, why cut someone you care about completely out of your life, just because you broke up? That seems petty to me.
 

grey_beard

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ENFP female here, recently met this INTJ, hit it off, he directly told me he wants to pursue and date me, I said the feelings are mutual. We met online and video chatted, we live too many states away, I'm suppose to meet him next month in person. We already have insane amounts of chemistry and he even professed to me that he's not had a connection like this before. We used to talk all the time when we first met, now not as much. He said he's been "busy" with his new job.

Well....

I was going through his facebook page and I learned he started talking to me right around the time he broke up with his ex girlfriend (so what am I here, a rebound???). They were together for 1.5 years. They are no longer friends on facebook. However, they are still in touch, he helps her with her business, and I learned this through the facebook business page his ex girlfriend created for his business and that he "liked". He likes all the stuff she posts, and everything. She once posted a pic of him on there, she also posted another pic with his name and heart emoji's next to it. What is that suppose to mean?

Here's what troubles me:

I've asked him on two separate occasions that if he's seeing someone now, he needs to let me know now so I can move on, it's not fair to me to I told him, I said to him I don't want to become more vulnerable and I NEED TO KNOW NOW, I don't like talking to a guy who's involved with another woman or talking to another women (especially his ex!). When I asked him two separate times, he told me he's not involved with anyone else on those two separate times. And all I can think is, "liar".

Isn't this like cheating? He seems like he's emotionally involved with both me and his ex at this point and it's disgusting that he tells me he's not. His ex, judging from her comments on her business facebook page, clearly wants him still, the heart emojis by his name? Come on. Who even knows if he's even sleeping with her. And he's just as supportive of her, "liking" all of her posts on her page.

I don't even know what to do, or how to overcome this. I've already asked him twice if he's seeing someone else and he said "no". What am I suppose to say, I've been stalking your facebook page and learned otherwise? The information is crystal clear, right there, it's nothing I'm imagining or weaving together.

I would never think an INTJ is this dishonest. I'm an ENFP and despite the reputation my type has, I never lie about these things. Am I overreacting here? Why would INTJs keep in touch with ex's this much?
Key point, sorry for butting in.

With this guy and his ex, there are several pertinent questions.
1) Who broke up with who?
2) *Why*? If the INTJ broke up, then under MOST circumstances, you don't have to worry about his going back to her: INTJs do this to cut the waters when there far-seeing Ni realizes that there are going to be INSURMOUNTABLE differences in the relationship. The only case this might not be true, is if there is a present issue, he's willing in principle to work it out, but the change is too slow and it is costing too much pain, with no guarantee of success.
3) Perhaps *she* is trying to win him back, and he, being guilt-ridden over promises made earlier, is trying to be [strike]a sucker[strike] supportive?

In either case, I understand and appreciate your feelings. You have every right to make this request, but I don't know of that type of ultimatum, this early, is the best way to yank an INTJ's cage to get him to move in the direction you want him to (that is, towards you and away from her).

Oh -- one or two other points. Just to mull over, since I don't know any of you in real life.

1) Have you met this guy in person yet? Had intense kissing sessions or anything? If so, that'd likely bond you to him more.
2) INTJs really, honestly disappear and submerge either in their work, or to recharge their batteries, even with someone they're crazy about.
3) If you ask an INTJ a point-blank question, they will duck the question. But they won't *lie*.

Good luck, btw. However this turns out, I hope it doesn't sour you on the possibilities for dating a member of the INTJ armoured regiment.
 

Opal

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I'm drawn to people whose traits I value and respect. When we part ways I usually still regard them highly.

People tend to straddle possibilities in uncertain times, so he may be keeping his options open.
 

GarrotTheThief

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ENFP female here, recently met this INTJ, hit it off, he directly told me he wants to pursue and date me, I said the feelings are mutual. We met online and video chatted, we live too many states away, I'm suppose to meet him next month in person. We already have insane amounts of chemistry and he even professed to me that he's not had a connection like this before. We used to talk all the time when we first met, now not as much. He said he's been "busy" with his new job.

Well....

I was going through his facebook page and I learned he started talking to me right around the time he broke up with his ex girlfriend (so what am I here, a rebound???). They were together for 1.5 years. They are no longer friends on facebook. However, they are still in touch, he helps her with her business, and I learned this through the facebook business page his ex girlfriend created for his business and that he "liked". He likes all the stuff she posts, and everything. She once posted a pic of him on there, she also posted another pic with his name and heart emoji's next to it. What is that suppose to mean?

Here's what troubles me:

I've asked him on two separate occasions that if he's seeing someone now, he needs to let me know now so I can move on, it's not fair to me to I told him, I said to him I don't want to become more vulnerable and I NEED TO KNOW NOW, I don't like talking to a guy who's involved with another woman or talking to another women (especially his ex!). When I asked him two separate times, he told me he's not involved with anyone else on those two separate times. And all I can think is, "liar".

Isn't this like cheating? He seems like he's emotionally involved with both me and his ex at this point and it's disgusting that he tells me he's not. His ex, judging from her comments on her business facebook page, clearly wants him still, the heart emojis by his name? Come on. Who even knows if he's even sleeping with her. And he's just as supportive of her, "liking" all of her posts on her page.

I don't even know what to do, or how to overcome this. I've already asked him twice if he's seeing someone else and he said "no". What am I suppose to say, I've been stalking your facebook page and learned otherwise? The information is crystal clear, right there, it's nothing I'm imagining or weaving together.

I would never think an INTJ is this dishonest. I'm an ENFP and despite the reputation my type has, I never lie about these things. Am I overreacting here? Why would INTJs keep in touch with ex's this much?

if we went by the stereotype of mastermind we might say it's ammo or deterrence.

But since we don't do that here...it's anyone's guess.
 

ImNoBozo

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Key point, sorry for butting in.

With this guy and his ex, there are several pertinent questions.
1) Who broke up with who?
2) *Why*? If the INTJ broke up, then under MOST circumstances, you don't have to worry about his going back to her: INTJs do this to cut the waters when there far-seeing Ni realizes that there are going to be INSURMOUNTABLE differences in the relationship. The only case this might not be true, is if there is a present issue, he's willing in principle to work it out, but the change is too slow and it is costing too much pain, with no guarantee of success.
3) Perhaps *she* is trying to win him back, and he, being guilt-ridden over promises made earlier, is trying to be [strike]a sucker[strike] supportive?

In either case, I understand and appreciate your feelings. You have every right to make this request, but I don't know of that type of ultimatum, this early, is the best way to yank an INTJ's cage to get him to move in the direction you want him to (that is, towards you and away from her).

Oh -- one or two other points. Just to mull over, since I don't know any of you in real life.

1) Have you met this guy in person yet? Had intense kissing sessions or anything? If so, that'd likely bond you to him more.
2) INTJs really, honestly disappear and submerge either in their work, or to recharge their batteries, even with someone they're crazy about.
3) If you ask an INTJ a point-blank question, they will duck the question. But they won't *lie*.

Good luck, btw. However this turns out, I hope it doesn't sour you on the possibilities for dating a member of the INTJ armoured regiment.


I think everything you said makes sense and is really on point.

1) I do not know for sure, but I am almost completely positive he broke up with her. His ex was an ENFP as well. She seems way too interested and up his butt, for me to think it's the other way around. Plus, he told me some of the problems he had with her was watching her openly flirt with other men in front of him, and she wouldn't tone down the flirting. He also told me that she always perceived him as controlling her, he would suggest/advise her on some things, and she would do the exact opposite just to tick him off. It sounded like a volatile relationship.

2) He's an INTJ 6w5 sx/so, and I'm an ENFP 7w6 sx/so, our chemistry is insane and off the charts. We have insane chemistry on the mental/intellectual, emotional, and sexual level. We have not met in person but we video-chatted for like 2 months straight for hours every single day. I think because we are both Head Types on the Enneagram, our connection is more in sync, especially with being both SX types. He told me his ex-girlfriend is an ENFP 4w3, and he feels a better and healthier connection with me than he does with her. I am pretty positive the chemistry is still going to be there when we meet in person, it sounds crazy to everyone, but we have gotten really close, revealing everything to each other. It's a very intimate bond we have established. He even told me himself in a message that he's never had a connection with another person like he has with me, and it's a deep connection he's never experienced before and he knows it's "real".

3) I do plan on kissing and making out with him when we meet, he expressed he wants to do that too. I believe it's one of those situations where I will have to force myself not to sleep with him too soon. Our bond isn't only just on the mental and emotional level, it's on the sexual level as well. There will be flames.
 

ImNoBozo

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if we went by the stereotype of mastermind we might say it's ammo or deterrence.

But since we don't do that here...it's anyone's guess.

can you elaborate on ammo vs. deterrence?
 

grey_beard

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I think everything you said makes sense and is really on point.

1) I do not know for sure, but I am almost completely positive he broke up with her. His ex was an ENFP as well. She seems way too interested and up his butt, for me to think it's the other way around. Plus, he told me some of the problems he had with her was watching her openly flirt with other men in front of him, and she wouldn't tone down the flirting. He also told me that she always perceived him as controlling her, he would suggest/advise her on some things, and she would do the exact opposite just to tick him off. It sounded like a volatile relationship.

2) He's an INTJ 6w5 sx/so, and I'm an ENFP 7w6 sx/so, our chemistry is insane and off the charts. We have insane chemistry on the mental/intellectual, emotional, and sexual level. We have not met in person but we video-chatted for like 2 months straight for hours every single day. I think because we are both Head Types on the Enneagram, our connection is more in sync, especially with being both SX types. He told me his ex-girlfriend is an ENFP 4w3, and he feels a better and healthier connection with me than he does with her. I am pretty positive the chemistry is still going to be there when we meet in person, it sounds crazy to everyone, but we have gotten really close, revealing everything to each other. It's a very intimate bond we have established. He even told me himself in a message that he's never had a connection with another person like he has with me, and it's a deep connection he's never experienced before and he knows it's "real".

3) I do plan on kissing and making out with him when we meet, he expressed he wants to do that too. I believe it's one of those situations where I will have to force myself not to sleep with him too soon. Our bond isn't only just on the mental and emotional level, it's on the sexual level as well. There will be flames.

Let me know when you're scheduled to meet, so I can turn away and not get blinded by all the sparks. :wubbie: :wink:
 

GarrotTheThief

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can you elaborate on ammo vs. deterrence?

Ammo = use it against you
Deterrence = threatened use if you threaten.

Ex's are used as leverage often. It lends some credence to the aphorism: love is a battlefield.
 

Jaguar

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First of all, you have one experience with a so-called INTJ and apply it to an entire group as if all individuals in the same group would behave the exact same way. Ridiculous.
Two, did it ever occur to you he thinks you might boil his bunny on a stove if he told you to take a hike? For all he knows, you might be able to give Glenn Close a run for her money.
 

Qlip

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Oh, come on guys, lighten up. You always stalk the one you love. And some of us stalk people we are just passingly interested in. It's a thing.

And really, these are things she just noticed and are worried about. Ne can lead to a type of hyper-awareness and speculation in things that are of import. There's nothing wrong with it as long as serious privacy boundaries aren't crossed.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Oh, come on guys, lighten up. You always stalk the one you love. And some of us stalk people we are just passingly interested in. It's a thing.

I once told people I had a crush on an actress, and people's reactions to that were that it was very off-putting. Some people called it sinful lust. Other people just said it was "creepy." If you ask me, I'd say both are expressions of the same underlying phenomena and cultural assumptions. It seems rather nonsensical to me; nobody would have cared if I was a woman with a crush on a man.

I'm a little too old for that kind of crush, but I don't see what the big deal was at the time. I don't really understand what was so objectionable.
 

Qlip

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I once told people I had a crush on an actress, and people's reactions to that were that it was very off-putting. Some people called it sinful lust. Other people just said it was "creepy." If you ask me, I'd say both are expressions of the same underlying phenomena and cultural assumptions. It seems rather nonsensical to me; nobody would have cared if I was a woman with a crush on a man.

I'm a little too old for that kind of crush, but I don't see what the big deal was at the time. I don't really understand what was so objectionable.

Started a thread about it:

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/relationships/76982-line-creepy-normal.html

And, to the OP, relationships don't ever start without some intent to trust. You have to make the leap at some point, if you express your concerns and you don't feel safe, either due to his reaction or your own insecurities, it's best to move on. It should be so much more than just chemistry, especially with something as high investment as having physical distance between you. He should be willing to meet you halfway.
 

INTP

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Sounds like he might be stringing you along in case he cant get his ex back. But what ever the reason is, this combined with other stuff you posted about this, its pretty clear that he is just playing with you or just doesent have the balls to tell you that he isnt interested anymore.
 

PeaceBaby

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I've asked him on two separate occasions that if he's seeing someone now, he needs to let me know now so I can move on, it's not fair to me to I told him, I said to him I don't want to become more vulnerable and I NEED TO KNOW NOW, I don't like talking to a guy who's involved with another woman or talking to another women (especially his ex!). When I asked him two separate times, he told me he's not involved with anyone else on those two separate times. And all I can think is, "liar".

I am going to advocate the direct approach. Tell him you were looking at his Facebook profile and noticed he still talks to his ex-girlfriend. Ask him, "Are you still interested in her? Are you still involved with her?" Then, wait to hear the answer. Ask when you can actually see his face so you can read the response as well visually.

So, the answer to this:

What am I suppose to say, I've been stalking your facebook page and learned otherwise? The information is crystal clear, right there, it's nothing I'm imagining or weaving together.

is yes.

If he tells you that the ex doesn't mean anything to him, he tries to be supportive of her business or whatever, you have two choices to make - you either trust him or you don't. And if you don't trust him, you don't have a relationship. Get out of interacting with this guy as soon as possible.

I mean, you haven't even met this person! On-screen chemistry is easy because it only involves you and your imagination. Meet this man and see if you really do have compatibility. You might meet him and every fiber of your physical being is turned off by him - doesn't feel right, doesn't smell right, doesn't look right. Don't just fall in love with your ideal of him, if this is going to go anywhere it has to step out into real life.
 

grey_beard

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I am going to advocate the direct approach. Tell him you were looking at his Facebook profile and noticed he still talks to his ex-girlfriend. Ask him, "Are you still interested in her? Are you still involved with her?" Then, wait to hear the answer. Ask when you can actually see his face so you can read the response as well visually.

So, the answer to this:



is yes.

If he tells you that the ex doesn't mean anything to him, he tries to be supportive of her business or whatever, you have two choices to make - you either trust him or you don't. And if you don't trust him, you don't have a relationship. Get out of interacting with this guy as soon as possible.

I mean, you haven't even met this person! On-screen chemistry is easy because it only involves you and your imagination. Meet this man and see if you really do have compatibility. You might meet him and every fiber of your physical being is turned off by him - doesn't feel right, doesn't smell right, doesn't look right. Don't just fall in love with your ideal of him, if this is going to go anywhere it has to step out into real life.

I must agree -- *provided* the guy really is an INTJ. If you hit him head on, directly, he will *gulp* hard and then answer the question. If it's been bothering him, you may get a core dump of his underlying reasoning while he's at it.

Also : by instinct I agree about the in-person part -- I've never had an LDR or an online one; but I know there is no substitute for ...personal presence / vibe / "looking in their eyes" in a way that just can't happen online, even over skype. I think it's the whole *integration* of facial expression and the *timing* of associate postures, a language too rich to be captured in the frame of a screen, where you can't embed it in how they are reacting to your shared physical environment (following your lead, gazing at something they want you to see and share in too), like you might have on an in-person walk...
 
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