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  1. #31
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Okay so that makes sense. How fast do you generally catch onto these concepts? Is it slow or fast?
    Depends on the concept. The actual moment of understanding is quick, but it varies in how much study leads up to it.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  2. #32
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Depends on the concept. The actual moment of understanding is quick, but it varies in how much study leads up to it.
    So obviously the more you study, the more you understand, right?

  3. #33
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    So obviously the more you study, the more you understand, right?
    Not necessarily. It varies in how much study needs to happen (e.g. how much exposure to various aspects of the concept). It's not as simple as: if I study more, it happens faster.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  4. #34
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Not necessarily. It varies in how much study needs to happen (e.g. how much exposure to various aspects of the concept). It's not as simple as: if I study more, it happens faster.
    So now that confuses that hell out of me.

  5. #35
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    So now that confuses that hell out of me.
    How so? Some concepts are just easier to grasp than others, whatever one's methods.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #36
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    so.. who/where are those non-INTJs who are able to understand 22.6% of an abstract concept before understanding 27% of it? what is 22.6% of the concept of liberty? [(insert joke about your apposing party of choice) + "but no, seriously..."] what does 22.6% of a concept? what does it look like? can you pick a concept and describe just 22.6% of it to me?

    i don't think Ne is that different tbh - your brain casts a web (or in the case of Ne doms "is a web" is more like it), catches a concept, know that the concept is in that general area and start pulling out what doesn't belong - because, you know, dolphin tuna regulations... the gradual process isn't in grasping what the concept is, but in using Ji to look at it more intimately from different angles and differentiating what the concept isn't. you still never really hold a fraction of a concept, it's just an illusion stemming from holding vaguer versions of the concept.

    if anything, i think that would be a pretty unique ability. can you imagine the ability to hold 22.6% of a concept? is that like downloading a pre built concept from a server? was there a moment when Neo knew 22.6% of kung fu which didn't make the finale cut? or is it like a concept with a scalable business plan for establishing itself in your brain.. how would the whole thing work?

  7. #37
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    How so? Some concepts are just easier to grasp than others, whatever one's methods.
    Well it almost sounds like more studying doesn't help. It almost sounds like you have to reflect to understand, not to study. It almost sounds like studying doesn't really even do that much.

  8. #38
    failed poetry slam career chubber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    so.. who/where are those non-INTJs who are able to understand 22.6% of an abstract concept before understanding 27% of it? what is 22.6% of the concept of liberty? [(insert joke about your apposing party of choice) + "but no, seriously..."] what does 22.6% of a concept? what does it look like? can you pick a concept and describe just 22.6% of it to me?

    i don't think Ne is that different tbh - your brain casts a web (or in the case of Ne doms "is a web" is more like it), catches a concept, know that the concept is in that general area and start pulling out what doesn't belong - because, you know, dolphin tuna regulations... the gradual process isn't in grasping what the concept is, but in using Ji to look at it more intimately from different angles and differentiating what the concept isn't. you still never really hold a fraction of a concept, it's just an illusion stemming from holding vaguer versions of the concept.

    if anything, i think that would be a pretty unique ability. can you imagine the ability to hold 22.6% of a concept? is that like downloading a pre built concept from a server? was there a moment when Neo knew 22.6% of kung fu which didn't make the finale cut? or is it like a concept with a scalable business plan for establishing itself in your brain.. how would the whole thing work?
    It's more like a binary thing.

  9. #39
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    One aspect that hasn't yet been discussed but which I find to be crucial for effective learning for me. My learning windows spans exactly 30mins at a time. I cannot sit down for hours and study a subject. My mind does not work that way. I'm a scanner by nature and my mind constantly scans for lots of subjects for consideration. After 30mins my focus on any one subject wanes and time spent after that is really unproductive. I worked out that if I did study in short sharp bursts then I could cut my total time learning a subject down exponentially. What used to take 30hrs of study now takes less than 10 as long as I don't go past the 30min focus time in any one day.

    So of course lectures, schooling and traditional learning sessions work against me since they require longer periods of focus and a slower assimilation process. When I'm assimilating something I am not judging the material, just absorbing it whole. The rumination and judgement happens in the background when I am not studying the topic. It's akin to taking a photo, then shoving that image in a computer to be broken down pixel by pixel in the background and then put together again at some later point.

    On top of that the greater the amount of overall stimulation in a day the greater the level of retention by me. So if I flip between 5 different subjects in a day I find I have greater retention of all of those subjects simply because my mind had not been bored by one one of them.

  10. #40
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    so.. who/where are those non-INTJs who are able to understand 22.6% of an abstract concept before understanding 27% of it? what is 22.6% of the concept of liberty? [(insert joke about your apposing party of choice) + "but no, seriously..."] what does 22.6% of a concept? what does it look like? can you pick a concept and describe just 22.6% of it to me?
    You don't understand a fraction of a concept, though smaller concepts can together form larger ones. You amass facts, perhaps processes, and get a sense of the data that build or support the concept. This knowledge increases with the usual reading and study, and really can get unwieldy, like a loose armful of kindling wood. At some point, all of a sudden the concept comes together and becomes clear. To follow the analogy, the wood is now tightly bound, and easy to heft. It is the difference between seeing alot of individual trees, and then finally comprehending the entire forest.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Well it almost sounds like more studying doesn't help. It almost sounds like you have to reflect to understand, not to study. It almost sounds like studying doesn't really even do that much.
    Yes reflection is needed, and almost un/subconscious reflection. Studying helps in making the material more familiar and thus readily accessible to the brain, in whatever way it is going to play with it.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

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