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  1. #41
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phoenix13 View Post
    Here is the heart of cognitive process appreciation. It is not appropriate to use feeling to evaluate the empirical formula of a monosaccharide just as it is not appropriate to use impersonal reasoning to nurse a broken soul back to health. As Oprah would say, both are valuable and you need both to function in this world.
    Agreed.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  2. #42
    Don't pet me. JAVO's Avatar
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    Why the long rant on feelers stating what everyone already knows about an unbalanced F? It doesn't seem rational given that we all know the negative consequences of unbalanced thought and behavior.

    Are you going to create a "T mystery debunked" thread about unbalanced T behavior too, or has that not rubbed your consciously-denied subjective values judgments the wrong way?

  3. #43
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    While I do enjoy the theatrics, I'm still not convinced that the feeling function alone (or at all) is responsible for what you're illustrating. That just seems like pure emotion (and laziness). The decisions that the feeling function would be responsible for fundamentally elide logical justification. Take aesthetic preference as an example. How am I supposed to logically justify why I don't prefer Dadaism? I can't, and it isn't appropriate to that type of decision anyway.
    Feeling is analogous to emotion as a magnet to metal. How about I put a bag of shit right outside your door and ask you, if it doesnt reek. Is it the shit alone thats making it smell this bad?

    Feeling when unbalanced by other faculties, especially Thinking will turn out exactly that way, shall be pure emotion.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

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  4. #44
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAVO View Post
    Are you going to create a "T mystery debunked" thread about unbalanced T behavior too, or has that not rubbed your consciously-denied subjective values judgments the wrong way?
    It can be done, but at this point simply irrelevant.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

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  5. #45
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    A diatribe against feelers because *I* happen to be *feeling* like shit today.
    Mr. Wing,

    Your OP is, hands down, the most ironic post I have yet to read, period.

    It can quite easily be inferred that you wrote this under an emotional haze, while in a torrential mood.

    I bet you either consciously or subconsciously know this, too.

    When you write your ideas on type theory from a more objective standpoint, you actually come up with some pretty accurate and elucidating stuff.



    Sorry that one or some of us "feelers" has done you wrong, but it's not fair for you to take out your personal issues with one or a few of us, on *all* of us.

    Oh, and...

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

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    Intelligentle sparkles

  6. #46
    almost half a doctor phoenix13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Feeling is analogous to emotion as a magnet to metal. How about I put a bag of shit right outside your door and ask you, if it doesnt reek. Is it the shit alone thats making it smell this bad?

    Feeling when unbalanced by other faculties, especially Thinking will turn out exactly that way, shall be pure emotion.
    ... my shit smells like roses.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Blackwater's Avatar
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    1
    There is indeed a possibility that Bluewing's sentiments are fed off inferior Feeling. Should we then, turn this entire matter into a question of wheter Bluewing is deluded, rather than wheter Bluewing is correct? - I think that we are doing ourselves a disfavour if we opt to do the former.

    2
    Jennifer I'm not questioning your type, but from a Ti perspective your rebuttal seems rather normative. Now that you've made your point about the influence of inferior F on Bluewing, if we were to look ahead, what would you respond to the actual content of the post?

    3
    I can't believe that some think to argue against the OP on the relativistic assumption that "all values are equally good". This is demonstratably false, though I won't go into it here.

    4
    Economica: I'm sure Foucault would back you up in saying that what appears to be logical truth can indeed by heavily influenced by factors unkown to the subject presenting those truths, yes.
    Points for bringing up philosophy in a Bluewing thread!

    5
    Personally, I think there's a lot to be said for the content of the OP. I have had the same experiences with feelers, and I don't even live on the same continent! Though I do by no means wish to discount all feelers; my partner, and several close friends being Fs. In fact, I very much cherish the competent use of F.

    5a
    One thing I objectively believe to be true is that it is relatively easy to point out the logical fallacy in malfunctioning T, which in theory should help the T to redeem himself.
    (In theory, at least - though we might actually argue that what is getting in the way of the T redeeming himself after being proven logically wrong in practice is actually their inferior F)
    Whereas, malfunctioning F is often pretty hard to rectify because little or no logic is really necessary. - Just like the OP describes.

    6
    When it all comes down to it, most people actually act as if Thinking is superior to Feeling without even knowing it.

    You might ask yourself: How come its ok for a one-sided-feeler to expect a thinker to take account of his feelings, while its not okay for a one-sided thinker to expect a feeler to express himself rationally?

    In other words, its okay for feelers only to play their own chord, while thinkers are expected to play two chords.

    This implies to me, that Feelers are somehow regarded as less in control of themselves than Thinkers.
    best collection of philosopher typings online

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  8. #48
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Thus when they say the wall is red, they are not talking about the actual wall, but about their feelings about the wall.
    This statement is more F then I ever could hope to muster. Are you sure you're talking about feelers as opposed to how you feel about feelers?
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  9. #49
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackwater View Post
    5a
    One thing I objectively believe to be true is that it is relatively easy to point out the logical fallacy in malfunctioning T, which in theory should help the T to redeem himself.
    (In theory, at least - though we might actually argue that what is getting in the way of the T redeeming himself after being proven logically wrong in practice is actually their inferior F)
    Whereas, malfunctioning F is often pretty hard to rectify because little or no logic is really necessary. - Just like the OP describes.

    6
    When it all comes down to it, most people actually act as if Thinking is superior to Feeling without even knowing it.
    The situations that call for "T" style judgment are generally more publicly valued in modern society (at least in America). Therefore it is not the feeling function itself that is devalued, but the activities for which it is appropriate are not as, shall I say, prestigious. No one is going to give you the Nobel Prize for helping a friend through a hard time, though it may have taken a lot of time and effort to do so.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  10. #50
    Senior Member Blackwater's Avatar
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    Orangey I don't think your line of reasoning is wholly compatible with what I said. It appears that we are talking about different things there.

    Though I agree that the things Feeling excels at are generally devalued in Western society. I even put that on my webpage


    No one is going to give you the Nobel Prize for helping a friend through a hard time, though it may have taken a lot of time and effort to do so.
    But then again, I think most of the people who win the laurelates for litterature are NFs.
    best collection of philosopher typings online

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