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  1. #41
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    INTPs are perceiving types, and INTJs are judging types.

    More specifically:

    INTJ: Ni, Te, Fi, Se

    INTP: Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

    They have no functions in common, but they share an interest in abstract, logical reasoning despite being interested in and using very different aspects of it regularly. Ti tends to see everything in terms of a logical framework and nitpicks, Ni tends to have a "vision."

    Another important thing to remember is that an INTJ is an INTUITIVE type first and foremost, while an INTP is a THINKING type first and foremost... meaning that their emphasis is different. Yet ironically, INTJs interact via Te and INTPs via Ne, so one would get the opposite impression at first.

    I would conjecture that INTJs are more like strategists and practical achievers, and INTPs are more like engineers or philosophers.

  2. #42
    Senior Member htb's Avatar
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    Respectively: Egon Spengler, Ray Stantz.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by htb View Post
    Respectively: Egon Spengler, Ray Stantz.
    What do you think about Venkman? I'm INTP, and I operate like that pretty regularly with friends. It's ego*, but nonetheless.

    *2.Psychoanalysis. the part of the psychic apparatus that experiences and reacts to the outside world and thus mediates between the primitive drives of the id and the demands of the social and physical environment.

  4. #44
    Senior Member htb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    What do you think about Venkman? I'm INTP, and I operate like that pretty regularly with friends. It's ego*, but nonetheless.
    Well, I was thinking out loud, but Venkman is Murray with a few original characteristics, so -- ENTP.

  5. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer View Post
    INTJs also tend to be more melancholic while INTPs are more phlegmatic.
    Yes.
    I am afraid that I'm going to be a melancholic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    INTPs are perceiving types, and INTJs are judging types.

    More specifically:

    INTJ: Ni, Te, Fi, Se

    INTP: Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

    They have no functions in common, but they share an interest in abstract, logical reasoning despite being interested in and using very different aspects of it regularly. Ti tends to see everything in terms of a logical framework and nitpicks, Ni tends to have a "vision."

    Another important thing to remember is that an INTJ is an INTUITIVE type first and foremost, while an INTP is a THINKING type first and foremost... meaning that their emphasis is different. Yet ironically, INTJs interact via Te and INTPs via Ne, so one would get the opposite impression at first.

    I would conjecture that INTJs are more like strategists and practical achievers, and INTPs are more like engineers or philosophers.
    In fact,there are many philosophers and scientists of INTJ.
    Ni makes them to be...
    Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the more often and steadily we reflect upon them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me. --Kant

    Enneagram: 5?1
    Functional Strengths: Ni, Te, Fi, Ti, Si, Fe, Ne, Se

  6. #46
    Senior Member Uytuun's Avatar
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    Where society doesnt fit in with my image of how things should be, I just change the reality of it.
    Very true, reality is malleable, sometimes it feels like it simply doesn't pertain to me, can't touch me...reality, society etc.

  7. #47
    sophiloist Kaizer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    INTPs are perceiving types, and INTJs are judging types.

    More specifically:

    INTJ: Ni, Te, Fi, Se

    INTP: Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

    They have no functions in common, but they share an interest in abstract, logical reasoning despite being interested in and using very different aspects of it regularly. Ti tends to see everything in terms of a logical framework and nitpicks, Ni tends to have a "vision."

    Another important thing to remember is that an INTJ is an INTUITIVE type first and foremost, while an INTP is a THINKING type first and foremost... meaning that their emphasis is different. Yet ironically, INTJs interact via Te and INTPs via Ne, so one would get the opposite impression at first.

    I would conjecture that INTJs are more like strategists and practical achievers, and INTPs are more like engineers or philosophers.
    INTPs more like planners , make systems more efficient or come up with seemingly original efficient system instead of existing ones etc. ...
    INTJs systems but ones that conform more to structure since they lead with structure... so they're more like philosophers since they basically follow the sequence of having a construct first & thinking based substance second.

    Till an INTJ gets at least a semblance of a structure, even if its non information based and even if its pretty amorphous, the thinking doesn't naturally kick off and that too is off of others cause its extraverted, but by the time it does kick in the structure is so much more complete that INTJs appear to be thinking types with a strategic outlook whereas they are strategically oriented and fill the strategy construct with thinking.

    Their leading Ti makes INTPs the type that leads with a judging function and not a perceiving function.

    Also, I won't be surprised if a multi functional analysis shows INTPs and INTJs having secondary preference for each other's type's functional hierarchy.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Erudur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uytuun View Post
    You are correct, I find that I can look at things from so many angles that it is sometimes impossible for me to form 1 solid opinion. It's like I start out and then a whole sequence of "yes, but what ifs" starts rolling out into infinity. Cognitive processes said I was Ne Ni Ti Fi so maybe this is Ne influenced? But I'm not sure in how far these results are trustworthy.

    Ti in itself is a lot more fixed and rigid than Ni and there is very little you can do about Ti principles in a discussion. They just won't budge.
    I find that I am often in a conversation on a topic I've spent considerable time pondering. I'll mull over something for a period of years sometimes. When, in the conversation, opinions or points are expressed that I've already discarded (after extensive consideration), I come across as close-minded. I don't like coming across as close-minded but once I've identified what I see as a logical flaw or an inconsistency with the big picture, I am no longer open to the idea.

    I think INFJs do this too, they are just much more socially skilled in navigating the conversation without offense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacuss View Post
    It seems to me that INTJs tend to presume to know more and be more confident making ASSumptions based on their presumptions where INTPs are comfortable keeping an eye out for other possibilities.
    This is only the case where we feel we've developed an expertise. (i.e. spent a lot of time on). We are extremely open (and along the lines of the Ni vs Ti comments perhaps more open) to possibilities we are early in the process of evaluating.

  9. #49
    Senior Member Erudur's Avatar
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    And by the way, I am stunned by the volume of really insightul discussion on this site in general, this thread being a notable example.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer View Post
    INTPs are more logical, but INTJs are more efficient.

    Also, it is theoretically possible for INTJs to be more motivated by emotion...in fact, this is probably more true of them than INFJs. This is due to the INTJ's tertiary Fi, which means they could have a stronger sense of internal values.

    When not extroverting, the INTJ uses Ni and Fi, which could combine to form an idea subconsciously motivated by passion, which is then expressed forcefully via Te, without regard to established norms.

    The INFJ, by contrast, uses Ni and Ti, so they are more motivated by imagination like the INTJ, but their tertiary function is motivated by pure reason and logic. When these introverted functions work together, we get the stereotype of the INFJ being a psychic prophet, or the paranoid person whose conspiracies are right...it's the axis of Ni's imagination and Ti's penchant for logical skepticism.

    When functioning internally, the INTP uses Ti and Si, and this is how they represent the "walking encyclopedia" stereotype or a person who is interested in learning for the sake of learning. Ti analyzes the logical fluency of Si's internal forms. When engaging their Ne, the INTP has a knack for gaining a new way of logically seeing reasons behind things.

    The ISTP, using Ti and Ni internally, is probably the source of this type's tendency to be rebellious. When engaging Se externally, the ISTP is able to use these functions for troubleshooting. This type is also stereotypically a keen observer of subtle changes in the environment. And since Se alone is focused on pure enjoyment of physical impulses, the function is modified for the ISTP and is thus more graceful and conscientious of them -- they are less reckless in expression of physical impulses. They use Ti to satisfy Se, and Ni serves this type's improvisational skills. I have observed, too, that many ISTPs are indeed interested in martial arts, individual sports, mechanics, working with tools, etc., and at the core, the ISTP, like the INTP cousin, is into science and mathematical theory, but the difference is that the ISTP will use the theory for more applied purposes (troubleshooting, observation, labwork, and so forth), while the INTP will use it to dream up something new with their auxiliary Ne.

    So the INTJ and ISTP are more similar in that they are more concerned with usefulness. But the INTJ is more useful in that he uses the external world for purposes of fulfilling a vision, while the ISTP uses the internal world as a means for planning the next physical move. Now the INTJ also has Se as an inferior function, but since it is so undeveloped, the INTJ could merely fantasize about the physical responses to make by imagining various scenarios -- a famous example of an INTJ is, therefore, Travis Bickle in the film Taxi Driver -- the ISTP is more about analyzing opportunities for the next move.
    can you repeat the same thing for the ENTJs funtion, and ENTPs

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