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View Poll Results: NTJs, do you prefer 'Practice' or 'Theory'?

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  • Practice

    4 40.00%
  • Theory

    6 60.00%
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  1. #1
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    Default NTJs: more 'Practical' or 'Theoretical'?

    Each NTJ type seems to do a lot of both, though there seem to be extremes on the E/I ends. ENTJs in general seem more into the 'practice', whereas INTJs seem more into the 'theory'. But obviously, they all like to use practice and theory together, even if one is preferred. However, there seem to be little exceptions here and there, where they will both very strongly either be pragmatists or theoreticians (which I will outline).

    The case for 'Pragmatism':
    1. Many NTJ atheists (and there seem to be a lot of them) don't believe anything without evidence or experimental proof (like the existence of God).
    2. Even if God or whatever were true, some NTJs would still would find exploring this topic useless (unless it gives results in a working procedure).
    3. They want useful predictions for all processes and will only implement (in their blueprints for the future) productions that can be controlled.

    The case for 'Theoreticism':
    1. NTJ thinkers and sages can have a hyper-focused mental connection (like when they meditate) to a world that's very metaphysical in nature.
    2. The 'systems-builders' will refine completely unprecedented revolutions in understanding the architecture of everything and what can be altered.
    3. NTJ visionaries have powerfully prophetic or perhaps even 'psychic' revelations into a destiny that (within the intuitive 'flow' of events) is immanent.

    I'm adding a poll in this thread (for NTJs) on whether they prefer practice or theory. Also, I could be wrong in parts of my above analysis on the NTJ philosophies, so I can be corrected.

  2. #2
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    theoretical about practicality, ENTJ leaning more to practicality side and INTJ to theoretical
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  3. #3
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    This is actually not bad. This in particular:

    Quote Originally Posted by Poimandres View Post
    3. NTJ visionaries have powerfully prophetic or perhaps even 'psychic' revelations into a destiny that (within the intuitive 'flow' of events) is immanent.

    I've always had a definite sense of the contours of my own life. It's more than just planning for the future, it's like a sense of knowing how the future is meant to unfold.

    I like your choice of the word "flow" simply because it really strikes on something true to my experience. I feel I'm most successful as a creator when my work is inspired by more than my own logical capacities. I rarely "think" so much as wait for something to emerge from that quiet, connected space, and then develop what needs to be in order to actualize it. There's a definite flow to it. If you're not open to these intuitions then you have to work so much harder. It's like the wind is never with you. When it is, though, the idea has it's own force and gravity: it possesses the elemental quality that enables true transformation.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
    you are only a troubled guest on the dark earth

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-Up Rex View Post
    This is actually not bad. This in particular:
    Time for inspection!

    I've always had a definite sense of the contours of my own life. It's more than just planning for the future, it's like a sense of knowing how the future is meant to unfold.
    This must mean that God is watching, can give us glimpes of his omega vision!

    I like your choice of the word "flow" simply because it really strikes on something true to my experience. I feel I'm most successful as a creator when my work is inspired by more than my own logical capacities. I rarely "think" so much as wait for something to emerge from that quiet, connected space, and then develop what needs to be in order to actualize it. There's a definite flow to it. If you're not open to these intuitions then you have to work so much harder. It's like the wind is never with you. When it is, though, the idea has it's own force and gravity: it possesses the elemental quality that enables true transformation.
    A flow is going somewhere, and it also can be focused onto a different course. This fluididity to things doesn't need to have tracible chain to it, so much as it is a "quantum generator" of sorts. It's much easier to climb up the stairs towards what must be done when we can actually see the path. It's a bridge. We have to unleash the gates to the way. The "Force" gives us the power to navigate what's ahead. It can change things, make them become what we mentally "will".

  5. #5
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    NTJs aren't as practical as STJs or STPs.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    INTJs would seem to be more theoretical, being Ni-doms. ENTJs might be a little harder to identify as purely theoretical, and I suspect that the INTJs that seem really applied could actually be ISTJs or ENTJs. Ni is pretty dang floaty.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  7. #7
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-Up Rex View Post


    I've always had a definite sense of the contours of my own life. It's more than just planning for the future, it's like a sense of knowing how the future is meant to unfold.

    I like your choice of the word "flow" simply because it really strikes on something true to my experience. I feel I'm most successful as a creator when my work is inspired by more than my own logical capacities. I rarely "think" so much as wait for something to emerge from that quiet, connected space, and then develop what needs to be in order to actualize it. There's a definite flow to it. If you're not open to these intuitions then you have to work so much harder. It's like the wind is never with you. When it is, though, the idea has it's own force and gravity: it possesses the elemental quality that enables true transformation.
    That's one of the most articulate ways I've heard anyone describe what it "feels" like to use Ni. Thanks. It's hard to get something that clear about Ni from an NJ....
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  8. #8
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poimandres View Post

    The case for 'Pragmatism':
    1. Many NTJ atheists (and there seem to be a lot of them) don't believe anything without evidence or experimental proof (like the existence of God).
    2. Even if God or whatever were true, some NTJs would still would find exploring this topic useless (unless it gives results in a working procedure).
    3. They want useful predictions for all processes and will only implement (in their blueprints for the future) productions that can be controlled.

    The case for 'Theoreticism':
    1. NTJ thinkers and sages can have a hyper-focused mental connection (like when they meditate) to a world that's very metaphysical in nature.
    2. The 'systems-builders' will refine completely unprecedented revolutions in understanding the architecture of everything and what can be altered.
    3. NTJ visionaries have powerfully prophetic or perhaps even 'psychic' revelations into a destiny that (within the intuitive 'flow' of events) is immanent.
    For me, it's not so absolute. I believe in God without evidence (that's what faith is). I don't want predictions so that things can be controlled so precisely. I actually like what you put down under Theoreticism more. I like ideas, innovation, new ways of doing things, constantly improving things. I'm open to a lot of perspectives and do spend a fair bit of time thinking what might be likely to happen in the future, with the occasional "inspiration" in that regard. However, all of this in service of practical implementation.

    So for example, while I enjoy learning about about MBTI or Enneagram theory, it is for naught if that knowledge can't be applied in some way. So in that vein, practical examples are always a good way to connect the theory to reality.
    Last edited by highlander; 07-23-2013 at 07:06 PM.

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  9. #9
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    That's one of the most articulate ways I've heard anyone describe what it "feels" like to use Ni. Thanks. It's hard to get something that clear about Ni from an NJ....
    Thanks.

    I think it's perhaps because I'm an Ni-aux. Introverted intuition is more of a tool--something I can choose to tap into or not--than a way of life. I think for the Ni-doms that really walk those paths, asking them what it's like is akin to being made to articulate what's distinctive to the experience of being in their own skin. Everything? Nothing? What the hell are you even asking me to explain?

    Te's pretty skeptical of the most magical parts of Ni, so it will typically yank down the wall to see what are the facts the intuitive wiring's connecting. Understanding the assumptions allows greater manipulation of the system, which in turn permits more efficient execution. Otoh, Te as a tool of dominant Ni seems to be more of a navigational tool, discerning and discriminating the most relevant path in a place where all are interlocked and intersected without time or direction. It's an intimate space, and the less mature ones that navigate more with Fi seem to be the ones that mistake that intimacy as denoting something uniquely theirs and get all hot and bothered about how it's this INCREDIBLE, INFALLIBLE THING THAT NO MERE MORTAL CAN POSSIBLY HOPE TO RELATE TO.

    Between that and the ENTJs who'd deny that space altogether, some of the obscurity around Ni is to an extent deliberate, so I'm kind of going rogue right now.

    (They call it going full Snowden in the hood.)
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
    you are only a troubled guest on the dark earth

  10. #10
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    As an INTJ, I definitely find myself taking a more 'theoretical' approach to issues - when a problem arises, my default response is to think through every possible action/outcome before choosing the solution that I find most appropriate or beneficial.

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