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  1. #41
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-Up Rex View Post
    Gotcha. J vs P communication styles may have just tripped me up. I apologize for launching on you a bit, and hoped I adequately explained the source of my frustration in previous posts.

    I'm interested in what you've said in the bolded. Assuming the lack of "social skills" is not a function of some type of disorder, then it must be attributable to the fact that some other form of reasoning is preferable to that of social or emotional reasoning. The trick then is in translating emotional cues and making them relevant to the subject, which is gonna depend on how the individual prefers to understand the world. If the individual is an INTP, the assumption is that an Fe preference makes the relevance of social rituals less of an issue and translation moreso. They get the why of social interactions, but not necessarily the how. Improving their social skills means gaining a fluency in the symbols of interpersonal relating, and how those symbols interact such that they end up with something like a functioning "social calculus". This is just an idea, but is it along the lines of what you're talking about?
    Yeah, it is. I was thinking just this sort of social calculus, as you put it, is what is needed for both kinds of people. It could be modified a bit for other mbti types. I've done some of this very thing (which is one reason I thought INTP), and even am thinking of writing a book about how to "act normal," which translates as understand and exhibit common social behavior appropriate for one's circumstances (as well as self presentation). Empathy and intuition, as well as emotional intelligence with regard to the self is also necessary in order to become fully functional. So mbti-wise, it is ideal to develop all of one's functions in an order closely resembling the standard (Ti-Ne-Si-Fe-Te, etc.) for each type, but this could correspond to practical advice for people independent of typology.

  2. #42
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    I related to much of the stuff in the original post. When young, I preferred legos to Barbies, had an odd way of playing with toys, cared less about clothes and perfume, etc. I've never gotten an official diagnosis but I did a have a past therapist suggest it as a possibility. I think based on my childhood, it was eerily similar to what many kids with Asperger syndrome experience. Based on self-diagnosis, I'd say I do have a mild form of Aspergers.
    Congratulations. Preferring legos to barbies and not giving two farts about perfume and clothes as a kid has fuck all to do with having Aspergers.

    Jesus Christ on a biscuit.
    It's the people who more closely communicate with me that may pick up subtle clues that something isn't quite right.
    No argument there.
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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by INA View Post
    Congratulations. Preferring legos to barbies and not giving two farts about perfume and clothes as a kid has fuck all to do with having Aspergers.

    Jesus Christ on a biscuit.
    Yeah, I know. Is something wrong?

  4. #44
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    When young, I preferred legos to Barbies
    So did I.
    The future is for the unafraid.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    Yeah, I know. Is something wrong?
    Oh wait I thought you quoted me, because earlier in the thread I said according to this I'd have Asperger's, I just realized someone was actually self-diagnosing.

    Sorry.

  6. #46
    Member Ukon's Avatar
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    Every single thing in that fit both my sister and I correctly. I have honestly been thinking about getting tested for A.S. because my sister was diagnosed with it. My grandma had it, too. It seems a lot of INTPs have it, too. Hmm... There's a good chance I do have it. The only thing that didn't really apply to me nor my sister was not something I saw in that wall of text but something I see a lot on other sites--that we can't pick up sarcasm.

    Uhh, no. I am the most sarcastic person I know, and I know a lot of people.

    Edit: A friend I became acquainted with about 7-8 months ago has A.S. as well. I think they are attracted to me, whether it be because I may have A.S. or because I understand them. My sister always told me I was like a second mother despite being an icy bitch.
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  7. #47
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Are there any other disorders besides autism that might explain the INTP super prevalence for social problems?


    I thought I might be autistic but I don't think I'm hypersensitive to stimuli (if anything I can be completely oblivious to the outside world unless some one points something specific out). Socially though I feel like there's something I'm not tuned in to that most other people seem to get.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Entropic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Sounds kind of like inferior Fe, no?
    Could equally sound like Fi, to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Why? Are you denying a correlation independent of any evidence? I'm not claiming either a correlation or evidence, but I saw a source somewhere that did, and I see similarities (and some other people have posted about similarities), so I'm provoking discussion, and hoping that some evidence either for or against a correlation will come up. Does it personally offend you that there might be a correlation? If so I'm sorry, but I'm just trying to get at the truth. So I'm not that sorry.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-Up Rex View Post
    The association just plays on a fairly knee-jerk stereotype about NTs. Naturally there's a kernel of truth to be found in any stereotype, but that doesn't mean that it's genuinely insightful or worthwhile contribution to dialogue on the group as a whole. I feel this thread was driven more by your desire to feel like you belong somewhere, than actually "provoking discussion". Recognizing that, it's probably unsporting of me to have made my little comment in the first place, but god if I'm not sick of prosaic commentary treated like it's some kind of a revelation. Yes, NTs in general (and INTPs in particular) are socially maladroit. Great. You got anything else?
    Pretty much what Wind-Up Rex said. Could equally have been posted in the Psychology subforum to provoke discussion unrelated to "NT issues" that most likely aren't genuine NT issues to begin. As @Marmotini pointed out, it could as well be caused by HSP. I'm HSP and I relate to this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    Are there any other disorders besides autism that might explain the INTP super prevalence for social problems?
    Because only INTPs have issues with social interaction. Also, Aspberger's Syndrome is a form of autism and falls on the autism spectrum under DSM. I'm a 5w4 and I honestly think most of my interpersonal problems comes from the fact I'm a detached enneatype who practices non-attachment rather than what my MBTI type is.

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  9. #49
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post

    Because only INTPs have issues with social interaction. Also, Aspberger's Syndrome is a form of autism and falls on the autism spectrum under DSM. I'm a 5w4 and I honestly think most of my interpersonal problems comes from the fact I'm a detached enneatype who practices non-attachment rather than what my MBTI type is.
    Never suggested it was only INTPs, just responding to previous comment which specified INTPs.

    I realize aspberger's is a form of autism......that's why I refered to it as autism. I'm pretty sure I saw some where that they might discontinue the use of the term Asperger's. don't really get your confusion.

    So you value ennegram over MBTI. Ok. I still wonder if there is something besides autism (again referring to Asperger's here) that would account for why some people (who may may not be INTPs) experience a feeling of social confusion or misunderstanding.

  10. #50
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    I think it's simply (in INTP's) that introverted thinking is the opposite of social. First being introverted, it is oriented to the inner world, which does not include other people. Second, it is analytical, which is the opposite process of feeling, empathy, connection, interaction, etc. Social things are just not conducive to analysis. Ne and Fe balance it out pretty well in a healthy type, but Fe being last poses problems with integration as it is opposed the dominant function. The function order doesn't of course produce disorders or anything like that, but it does create a disposition which could go in that direction with certain environmental factors which would discourage social interaction.

    I think ISTP's have less of a problem because Se makes them more connected to the outside world via the physical.

    INFP's could experience it because Fi can become very introverted and self focused; however Fi has an advantage over Ti in that it is non-analytical, and so the individual usually at least understands feelings if not social behavior (which is more Fe); so an Fi dominant could probably identify feelings in other people better than the average ITP.

    I'm sure there are other types which have autism spectrum disorders, but I think some types are more prevalent than others simply because of the functions. Just like an EFJ would probably be more represented in a certain disorder than ITP's.

    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post
    Could equally sound like Fi, to me.
    Care to comment on this in this thread? http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...-fe-vs-fi.html
    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post
    Could equally have been posted in the Psychology subforum to provoke discussion unrelated to "NT issues" that most likely aren't genuine NT issues to begin.
    True, somehow I missed that. Sorry to offend people with my misplacement of the thread. My Fe is inferior to other people's apparently, no matter where it is.

    And I don't think it relates equally to all NT's by any means. An extrovert 9 times out of 10 would be far more social, and so would have practice and opportunity for learning appropriate behavior. I could see INTJ's being oblivious as well, but social skills are not specifically listed as an area of weakness as they are with INTP.
    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post
    As @Marmotini pointed out, it could as well be caused by HSP. I'm HSP and I relate to this.
    What's HSP?
    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post
    Because only INTPs have issues with social interaction.
    I never suggested this. But if you believe JCF has any merit, it's just an application. Just like some functions are better suited for math and computer science, others are more suited for social interaction. Some people are better at it than others; what makes us think it's an exception and it's not related at all to type? Yes there are a lot of environmental factors, which are more important, but environmental factors only shape inherent dispositions. If you believe in a balance of nature and nurture, which I do.

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