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Thread: Nihilism

  1. #91
    The elder Holmes Mycroft's Avatar
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    I think Victor's just saying that one of Nihilism's central theses -- that the world and the universe are inherently chaotic -- has been shown not to be the case at the macro level, which is the level at which we exist and go about our day-to-day lives.

    I think that would make good fuel for debate. I don't understand why Victor's simple statements are met with such unjustified derision.
    Dost thou love Life? Then do not squander Time; for that's the Stuff Life is made of.

    -- Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanack, June 1746 --

  2. #92
    Branded with Satan murkrow's Avatar
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    the argument against nihilism by restating a point it denies: that we have a real intersubjectivity

    I'm out of here.
    wails from the crypt.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    I know I'm officially an INTJ and should dig that stuff but actually I have no idea what you are trying to say. Does it really matter if we call it nihilism or quantum mechanics or whether or not it is actually predictable with some branch of mathematics? Nihilism comes down to how one is perceiving their world and generally a world which is perceived as random, unpredictable and and utterly without meaning engenders feelings of despair.
    Sure, we can feel despair at an illusion. We can perceive the world as random, unpredictable and utterly without meaning or we can question our perception and ask does our perception correspond with reality?

    And as we are meaning creating animals who have created the exquisite and deep meaning of quantum mechanics, it may be we are misperceiving the world as meaningless. And we might well look elsewhere, rather than nihilism, to find the cause of our despair.

    For instance, we might look to child rearing practices, or the social relations under which we live, to find the cause of our despair.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't understand why Victor's simple statements are met with such unjustified derision.
    And of course I wonder myself. And I wonder if the derision is justified.

    And I think it is justified in the sense I don't belong.

    And this is threatening for those who come here, quite justifiably, for a sense of belonging.

    Although perhaps I do serve a purpose in that in being derisory I inadvertantly emphasis how worthy are those who belong. After all, those who belong need someone who doesn't belong to define themselves and to feel warm and cosy. And the world's made rosy, warm and cosy, by togetherness.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    Do you really want to debate or just see who can think up the most ridiculous statements?
    I don't want to debate, rather I hope to inspire a creative response.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_priori View Post
    Oh and btw, if you mean we as in me as well you can scratch my off that list.
    Oh I see, you are a literate individual and not part of the etribe in the global village.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_priori View Post
    Who really knows if anything in this world holds a certain significance or meaning?

    In order to know this answer you would have to have some sort of higher power to conform your beliefs, which you do not nor does anyone on here. So, what I am ultimately trying to get at here is that I don't think it's going to matter how many posts or how methodical you try and portray yourself. The fact still remains that Nihilism is just as valid of a philosophical view point as your own, no matter what century it derived from.
    Fortunately the Enlightenment of the 17th and 18th centuries gave us a method for determining which meanings are true and which meanings are false.

    The method is based on evidence and reason and it has given us our social world of equality and freedom, and it has given us our scientific world of fact.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Oh I see, you are a literate individual and not part of the etribe in the global village.
    No just not part of your belief system.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Fortunately the Enlightenment of the 17th and 18th centuries gave us a method for determining which meanings are true and which meanings are false.

    The method is based on evidence and reason and it has given us our social world of equality and freedom, and it has given us our scientific world of fact.
    Which method is that again? By all means please do elaborate on the evidence part?

  10. #100
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    The Scientific Method

    Quote Originally Posted by A_priori View Post
    Which method is that again? By all means please do elaborate on the evidence part?
    The West is based on four pillars - Ancient Greek philosophy, Judaism, Christianity and the Enlightenment. And it was the Enlightenment that gave us the scientific method of evidence and reason.

    Until the Enlightenment we had authority and faith. And the Enlightenment put authority and faith to the test of evidence and reason.

    And evidence and reason have given us science and technology, modern medicine, universal literacy, electronic media, modern economics, liberal democracy, and much of what we take for granted around us.

    The Enlightenment also gave us the values of freedom and equality.

    And so the Enlightenment led to the abolition of institutional slavery for the first time in history by the House of Commons in 1833.

    And the Enlightenment gave us the emancipation of women for the first time in history in Australia and New Zealand in 1904.

    And the Enlightenment gave us the ending of institutional child abuse for the first time in history in Ireland in 2009 with the Judicial Ryan Commission.

    And as you read Australia is following Ireland's example with a National Royal Commission into institutional child abuse.

    So to answer your question, the evidence is scientific evidence to which reason is applied. And this method is called the scientific method.

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