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  1. #21
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    I'm pretty boss at going cold if I need to, especially in front of others, when I'm upset, annoyed or stressed. It's not something I ever learned, it's my default. It's being warm and human when I feel upset/annoyed/stressed that's more difficult for me. I can do it now, of course, but that has not always been the case.

    I would suggest you find an INTJ of your liking, and observe how such a person sees the world and thinks, and how they react to things when under stress/annoyed/upset. And how they deal with their feelings.

  2. #22
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilateral Entry View Post
    I'm pretty boss at going cold if I need to, especially in front of others, when I'm upset, annoyed or stressed. It's not something I ever learned, it's my default. It's being warm and human when I feel upset/annoyed/stressed that's more difficult for me. I can do it now, of course, but that has not always been the case.

    I would suggest you find an INTJ of your liking, and observe how such a person sees the world and thinks, and how they react to things when under stress/annoyed/upset. And how they deal with their feelings.
    I don't think the INTJ approach of being productive would work for me; the problem is that I'm unable to be productive when I'm sad. I just have no energy and feel weak and lack focus. Good suggestion though.

    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    Yep you're wrong about that. I am a highly emotional being I just express it inside out as it were. Which makes me particularly susceptible to depression and mental loops as my frustration, anger what have you doesn't have an external outlet. My freakish ability to not get upset outwardly creeps my coworkers out as they cannot seem to find my resemblence to humanity... The other side of the competence swords is when others think of you as machine-like in your ability to perform and therefore cut you no slack whatsoever when you have less than a stellar day. I am frequently held to higher standards and accountability than my coworkers and actually that pisses me off no-end. I am a fair minded person and I think the standards I am held to should be the same as others so I can exceed them if I wish but am not compelled to. Anyway I digress.

    My trick is always to withdraw when I feel the rage building, find an excuse to have a cup of tea, rail at the universe with my mind and come back fake and competent. I just file it in my 'get that shit done later' inbox and use distraction to do something else. It's not I don't have emotions it's that I have a method of detaching from them momentarily for the sake of convenience. My desire for completion of my rant is still there but I can delegate it to another time slot. But then again, sorting, delegating and pidgeon-holing is how I go about my day anyway. Although I'm constantly driven to completion, the simple act of mentally assigning a time slot to a task is a kind of completion in itself and satisfies in the moment.

    You sound like the way I get when I forget to do my mental sort and delegate. When I've just got a 100 things on my to do list and none of them have been prioritised. I'm allergic to clutter, especially mental clutter and I do experience heightened anxiety and manic states when I've not done my mental house cleaning.
    If I'm wrong about that then people trying to tell me I'm NF based on showing emotion in my posts seems to be invalid. Maybe it's an Fi-Fe thing?

    That's a good point, the need to do mental cleaning so things don't feel overwhelming. I didn't think that had any effect on my emotions, but maybe it does. I'd like to know what your trick is.

    The thing is I react to negative beliefs which seem true at the time, like "I'm not good at anything" or "I'm going to get fired" or "I'm unemployable", or the things I mentioned in my last post. That's really the only thing that makes me cry, and I have to be able to convince myself that those things aren't true in order to stop feeling like crying. I suppose NT's don't have that problem? When I actually find evidence and logic to prove that those things really aren't true, then I stop being upset. My negative emotions seem to not make sense on the surface, but they're really quite rational. I'm not sure what that would correspond to.

    Sometimes distraction works, but only if it's something funny. But the underlying untrue belief doesn't really go away, and then it just resurfaces with the next trigger.

  3. #23
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    The thing is I react to negative beliefs which seem true at the time, like "I'm not good at anything" or "I'm going to get fired" or "I'm unemployable", or the things I mentioned in my last post. That's really the only thing that makes me cry, and I have to be able to convince myself that those things aren't true in order to stop feeling like crying. I suppose NT's don't have that problem? When I actually find evidence and logic to prove that those things really aren't true, then I stop being upset. My negative emotions seem to not make sense on the surface, but they're really quite rational. I'm not sure what that would correspond to.
    Developing competence is extremely important to NTs. Everybody experiences self-doubts. NTs are not immune to these feelings and in fact, NTs are the most self-critical of all the types. When thoughts like the ones you mention arise, those thoughts aren't necessarily dismissed. If the self-criticism is excessive (which it often is), after a while you put things in perspective, just as you describe that you do yourself. Still, the thoughts don't entirely go away because if you felt that way, there has to be a reason. It is translated into something more specific that you can do something about. You can avoid the situation that makes you feel incompetent (maybe you are). You can get better at that thing or take steps to make sure the bad outcomes don't happen. You can work with someone else who compliments you and is good at stuff you are not. Those are the options.

    Please provide feedback on my Nohari and Johari Window by clicking here: Nohari/Johari

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  4. #24
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    Developing competence is extremely important to NTs. Everybody experiences self-doubts. NTs are not immune to these feelings and in fact, NTs are the most self-critical of all the types. When thoughts like the ones you mention arise, those thoughts aren't necessarily dismissed. If the self-criticism is excessive (which it often is), after a while you put things in perspective, just as you describe that you do yourself. Still, the thoughts don't entirely go away because if you felt that way, there has to be a reason. It is translated into something more specific that you can do something about. You can avoid the situation that makes you feel incompetent (maybe you are). You can get better at that thing or take steps to make sure the bad outcomes don't happen. You can work with someone else who compliments you and is good at stuff you are not. Those are the options.
    True. Putting it in perspective is the key, and then taking steps to solve the problem. That's definitely the approach I take in the long run; so maybe I do the INTJ thing after all- I just occasionally need a short term solution.

  5. #25
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    @greenfairy
    Re: meditation:

    If your mind is running away with anxiety when you meditate, then you might need to start with a more strict and focus-based method to equip your mind for it.

    What do you do for mediation?

    I ask because not everyone is prepared to plop down and clear their mind freely. Some people are just too busy up there and need to follow the more constructed methods at first. These things were designed with purpose, after all.

    It takes training for some people because they trick themselves into believing that they can do whatever willy nilly and it will work, which is not always the case, and on the extremes it can even mess you up so that you don't even know what your goals or methods are, and rarely some people experience psychosis from messing with this stuff.

  6. #26
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    deal with the causes of your emotions
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  7. #27
    WhoCares
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    If I'm wrong about that then people trying to tell me I'm NF based on showing emotion in my posts seems to be invalid. Maybe it's an Fi-Fe thing?
    Typology forums are probably the worst place for gaining any kind of objective opinion simply because people tend to project their type in their posts and perhaps wrongly assume that someone's more emotional prose is a projection of NF traits rather than NT traits. I find myself being more stereotypically INTJ here than I am elsewhere. My posts on unrelated forums probably sound a lot more NF than my posts here. Maybe you're immune to that effect and come across less NT to others.

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    That's a good point, the need to do mental cleaning so things don't feel overwhelming. I didn't think that had any effect on my emotions, but maybe it does. I'd like to know what your trick is.

    The thing is I react to negative beliefs which seem true at the time, like "I'm not good at anything" or "I'm going to get fired" or "I'm unemployable", or the things I mentioned in my last post. That's really the only thing that makes me cry, and I have to be able to convince myself that those things aren't true in order to stop feeling like crying. I suppose NT's don't have that problem? When I actually find evidence and logic to prove that those things really aren't true, then I stop being upset. My negative emotions seem to not make sense on the surface, but they're really quite rational. I'm not sure what that would correspond to.

    But the underlying untrue belief doesn't really go away, and then it just resurfaces with the next trigger.
    NTs are not immune to self-doubt and insecurities. I have a very deep insecurity about competence at work particularly when it comes to people skills. Anyone who doesn't immediately think I'm fabulous can set off this deep seated fear in me. Meditation does help in this regard, it clears out the emotional clutter so the triggers have less pulling power when they come. I don't think anyone on the planet no matter how outwardly confident is free of insecurity and these types of triggers. I constantly feel on the knife edge at work, as if I might be fired at any moment even though I'm actually quite good at what I do. What plays with me is the fact I'm politically retarded and workplaces don't generally reward competence they reward charisma, something I don't have in abundance.

    You sound perfectly normal but you also sound like you need to ground and centre yourself more often than you do in order to give those weak moments less sway in your life. Since you're a magic worker I'll recommend you to work with earth energy and if I may suggest that Dong Quai tea would be especially good for you right now. You can find Dong Quai ([I]angelica sinensis in any chinese supermarket in the spice aisle. It's sold as a sliced root and if you steep this in water over low heat for 10mins you'll find it's extremely calming and helpful in settling anxiety. It has a bittersweet taste that you'll quickly develop a hankering for. Dong Quai in a magical context is a be here now herb that will help you to bring your energy back to your core and become more stable. Hope this helps.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    If I'm wrong about that then people trying to tell me I'm NF based on showing emotion in my posts seems to be invalid. Maybe it's an Fi-Fe thing?
    Typology forums are probably the worst place for gaining any kind of objective opinion simply because people tend to project their type in their posts and perhaps wrongly assume that someone's more emotional prose is a projection of NF traits rather than NT traits. I find myself being more stereotypically INTJ here than I am elsewhere. My posts on unrelated forums probably sound a lot more NF than my posts here. Maybe you're immune to that effect and come across less NT to others.

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    That's a good point, the need to do mental cleaning so things don't feel overwhelming. I didn't think that had any effect on my emotions, but maybe it does. I'd like to know what your trick is.

    The thing is I react to negative beliefs which seem true at the time, like "I'm not good at anything" or "I'm going to get fired" or "I'm unemployable", or the things I mentioned in my last post. That's really the only thing that makes me cry, and I have to be able to convince myself that those things aren't true in order to stop feeling like crying. I suppose NT's don't have that problem? When I actually find evidence and logic to prove that those things really aren't true, then I stop being upset. My negative emotions seem to not make sense on the surface, but they're really quite rational. I'm not sure what that would correspond to.

    But the underlying untrue belief doesn't really go away, and then it just resurfaces with the next trigger.
    NTs are not immune to self-doubt and insecurities. I have a very deep insecurity about competence at work particularly when it comes to people skills. Anyone who doesn't immediately think I'm fabulous can set off this deep seated fear in me. Meditation does help in this regard, it clears out the emotional clutter so the triggers have less pulling power when they come. I don't think anyone on the planet no matter how outwardly confident is free of insecurity and these types of triggers. I constantly feel on the knife edge at work, as if I might be fired at any moment even though I'm actually quite good at what I do. What plays with me is the fact I'm politically retarded and workplaces don't generally reward competence they reward charisma, something I don't have in abundance.

    You sound perfectly normal but you also sound like you need to ground and centre yourself more often than you do in order to give those weak moments less sway in your life. Since you're a magic worker I'll recommend you to work with earth energy and if I may suggest that Dong Quai tea would be especially good for you right now. You can find Dong Quai (angelica sinensis) in any chinese supermarket in the spice aisle. It's sold as a sliced root and if you steep this in water over low heat for 10mins you'll find it's extremely calming and helpful in settling anxiety. It has a bittersweet taste that you'll quickly develop a hankering for. Dong Quai in a magical context is a be here now herb that will help you to bring your energy back to your core and become more stable. Hope this helps.

  9. #29
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    @greenfairy
    Re: meditation:

    If your mind is running away with anxiety when you meditate, then you might need to start with a more strict and focus-based method to equip your mind for it.

    What do you do for mediation?

    I ask because not everyone is prepared to plop down and clear their mind freely. Some people are just too busy up there and need to follow the more constructed methods at first. These things were designed with purpose, after all.

    It takes training for some people because they trick themselves into believing that they can do whatever willy nilly and it will work, which is not always the case, and on the extremes it can even mess you up so that you don't even know what your goals or methods are, and rarely some people experience psychosis from messing with this stuff.
    Yeah I just do the clearing my mind thing, but sometimes I listen to music and go to my happy place. Ill look into more structures things, but you know what- I just discovered something. I don't eat factory farmed meat very often, but I think it's bad for me. Last Saturday at work I was super stressed and my stomach hurt, but I had eaten some chicken at someone's house earlier, and I think that had something to do with it. I'm going to give it up entirely and see how it goes. I think if people eat animals who have lived stressful panicked lives, then all that goes into their bodies and affects them, especially if they're energy sensitive. And exercising helps a lot. I used to think I shouldn't exercise if I was really tired because it would be bad for my heart or something, but I think it's ok and that was just an irrational fear. So I'm going to do it as often as possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    deal with the causes of your emotions
    True. It's a bit of a complex process though, because the causes aren't always obvious.

  10. #30
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    Typology forums are probably the worst place for gaining any kind of objective opinion simply because people tend to project their type in their posts and perhaps wrongly assume that someone's more emotional prose is a projection of NF traits rather than NT traits. I find myself being more stereotypically INTJ here than I am elsewhere. My posts on unrelated forums probably sound a lot more NF than my posts here. Maybe you're immune to that effect and come across less NT to others.
    Oh yes, I know this well. Typology forums are educational, but you have to deal with mountains of garbage in order to find the little bits of truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    NTs are not immune to self-doubt and insecurities. I have a very deep insecurity about competence at work particularly when it comes to people skills. Anyone who doesn't immediately think I'm fabulous can set off this deep seated fear in me. Meditation does help in this regard, it clears out the emotional clutter so the triggers have less pulling power when they come. I don't think anyone on the planet no matter how outwardly confident is free of insecurity and these types of triggers. I constantly feel on the knife edge at work, as if I might be fired at any moment even though I'm actually quite good at what I do. What plays with me is the fact I'm politically retarded and workplaces don't generally reward competence they reward charisma, something I don't have in abundance.

    You sound perfectly normal
    I'm glad it's not just me being paranoid.

    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    Since you're a magic worker I'll recommend you to work with earth energy and if I may suggest that Dong Quai tea would be especially good for you right now. You can find Dong Quai ([I]angelica sinensis in any chinese supermarket in the spice aisle. It's sold as a sliced root and if you steep this in water over low heat for 10mins you'll find it's extremely calming and helpful in settling anxiety. It has a bittersweet taste that you'll quickly develop a hankering for. Dong Quai in a magical context is a be here now herb that will help you to bring your energy back to your core and become more stable. Hope this helps.
    Yeah I'm a really strong air element, so more earth is a good thing. I was just thinking last night how it's getting too cold to spend much time outside, and how I didn't take advantage of the warm weather as much as I wanted to. Such is life. I can still go outside and hug trees though.

    I didn't know that about Dong Quai! That's very helpful. I have some, but I've just been using it for female reproductive issues.

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