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  1. #11
    heart on fire
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    INTP seem to value precise word usage and choice more than being sticky over grammar rules or spelling. So they seem to be sticklers for meaning more than form. jmo

  2. #12
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysavior View Post
    Title says it all.

    Why does the typical INTJ tend to be such a prick when it comes to grammar.. why do they hold it in such regard?

    If you are the typical INTJ, or are an INTJ and a stickler for grammar, then some insight would be very helpful to me.

    At this point in time, I think this is just a stupid/annoying pet-peeve that doesn't serve a single purpose, because in most cases when I see an INTJ correct someone's grammar that person had already (effectively) made their point. Also, I'll note that the typical INTJ that also happens to be a prick when it comes to grammar doesn't communicate very well. There word choice, punctuation, and grammar may be solid, but I've tended to notice that the meaning/purpose/point is missing.

    Any insight into any reasoning (are there any) behind this hard on for grammar would be very much appreciated, as I'd prefer not to think of these people as idiots.
    I'm not an INTJ AFAIK (INFJ), but I do often notice and wish to correct grammar, punctuation, and spelling errors. I think that if a person is still making a valid point, I would try to understand it regardless of the post's quality. It's just that errors of that kind are annoying (since I've got the rules in my mind), and sometimes using them incorrectly makes the meaning less clear. I definitely pay as much attention to meaning as I do to grammar, but I believe that sticking to the established standards unless there's a good reason for deviating from them is desirable for clear communication.

    When someone doesn't communicate clearly, I'll usually state back to them all possible interpretations of what they said, give my opinion on each of them, and then ask which one they meant.

    It has occurred to me, because of what someone said to me once, that my occasional desire to correct people's spelling for its own sake (which I have done, but less often) may be nothing more than an example of a Lawful Neutral form of sadism.

  3. #13
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    When someone doesn't communicate clearly, I'll usually state back to them all possible interpretations of what they said, give my opinion on each of them, and then ask which one they meant.
    That is to imply that there is a specific methodology for clear communication?

    If so, is this methodology the same for everyone?

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jae Rae View Post
    Someone who thinks the idea is more important than the way it's phrased or spelled might be correct. But if two papers make the same points, and one is spelled correctly and phrased grammatically while the other isn't, can you see how it might be easier to put the second one aside in favor of the former?
    Yet again, someone has made my point in FAR fewer words than it took me. Guess I have to work on my language skills
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

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  5. #15
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Night View Post
    That is to imply that there is a specific methodology for clear communication?

    If so, is this methodology the same for everyone?
    Not a methodology, but a statement is generally either clear or not clear, specific or ambiguous. Some people maybe better at guessing the meaning of something that isn't clear, but most people can understand something that is clear.

    Generally, clarity means reducing the number of potential ways in which your communication can be interpreted within the context of precedent and convention, and leaving indications as to what context your statement applies to, in order to reduce the likelihood of it being misinterpreted.

    There is a certain degree of overlap in what people consider clear, and what they consider unclear.

  6. #16
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Night View Post
    That is to imply that there is a specific methodology for clear communication?

    If so, is this methodology the same for everyone?
    A methodology that works in one situation is not going to work in another. If you and your friends can understand each other just fine while writing each other with terrible grammar and spelling, then that's just fine. However, when trying to reach a wider audience with different experiences and different approaches than you, good grammar is a good way to ensure that misunderstandings will be about the content rather than about just plain bad writing.

    I know that a lot of people here are claiming that poor grammar makes you look unprofessional, but on top of that it can (and often does) make things very difficult to read. It's not even choosing a grammatically-correct paper over one with mistakes everywhere because it's more professional, but doing it because the grammatically-correct paper is easier to read. Incorrect grammar sounds like a hiccup, a bump in the road, and if you're lucky, it might not seriously alter the meaning of a sentence, but nonetheless it's still annoying as hell. Too many of these jarring bumps in the road just leave me not wanting to read any more.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  7. #17
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    A methodology that works in one situation might not work in another.
    Agreed.

  8. #18
    Free-Rangin' Librarian Jae Rae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    INTP seem to value precise word usage and choice more than being sticky over grammar rules or spelling. So they seem to be sticklers for meaning more than form. jmo
    I've worked many years with INTP rare book dealers who revere Strunk & White and are sticklers for both form and meaning.


    "Precise about their descriptions, INTPs will often correct others (or be sorely tempted to) if the shade of meaning is a bit off. While annoying to the less concise, this fine discrimination ability gives INTPs so inclined a natural advantage as, for example, grammarians and linguists." [Joe Butt, Typelogic.]
    Proud Female Rider in Maverick's Bike Club.

  9. #19
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jae Rae View Post
    I've worked many years with INTP rare book dealers who revere Strunk & White and are sticklers for both form and meaning.


    "Precise about their descriptions, INTPs will often correct others (or be sorely tempted to) if the shade of meaning is a bit off. While annoying to the less concise, this fine discrimination ability gives INTPs so inclined a natural advantage as, for example, grammarians and linguists." [Joe Butt, Typelogic.]
    Typelogic isn't really an offical source. I really don't see INTP's (or any P's, honestly) having this capacity naturally. Skill with language in a verbal, linear sense seems to be the domain of J's. P's tend to be more skilled at exploring and understanding reality itself rather than langauge or communication.

    They seem quite capable of developing this sense (and some do have it), but it doesn't seem like something they're inclined to learn unless it's needed of them. Many of them are quite vague (and although they're likely still intelligent on some level, they can't easily express any of it verbally).

  10. #20
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Typelogic isn't really an offical source. I really don't see INTP's (or any P's, honestly) having this capacity naturally. Skill with language in a verbal, linear sense seems to be the domain of J's. P's tend to be more skilled at exploring and understanding reality itself rather than langauge or communication.

    They seem quite capable of developing this sense (and some do have it), but it doesn't seem like something they're inclined to learn unless it's needed of them. Many of them are quite vague (and although they're likely still intelligent on some level, they can't easily express any of it verbally).
    ...what?

    You think Ps are too vague to verbally express their intellect?

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