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  1. #21
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I thought the "split brain" example was inspired.

    For a long time that's what it felt like. I could deal with simply traced emotions as long as I was apart from others; once i started getting enmeshed in relationships I couldn't just retreat from, then things got very confusing for awhile.

    My approach then was to ignore emotion until I couldn't; then let myself lash out or freak, hopefully to push people away; but if they would not let me off the hook then, I was just such a mess. Couldn't think clearly at all, completely overwhelmed. Realizing that i couldn't just avoid the emotions in the end forced me to wade through them and figure them out and deal much earlier.

    I'm tired. My brain is fuzzy. I probably do not have a lot of unique things to add.

    Except I liked Digest's comments too, about awareness extending beyond the emotions. I am very very aware of expressed or even mostly suppressed emotions (because they give me cues as to what someone else is going to do or what their motivations are) but they aren't the most important thing, just ONE thing, in the conflict to consider. So it's not that I do not see them, it's just that I place less importance on them overall than others might. But those who prioritize them would feel like I was ignoring the feelings. (And maybe earlier in my life I did do that, I was much more dismissive of emotions as "extra baggage" that would ruin the clarity of my and others' thinking... but as I got older, I valued them more and more.)

    NTs also do objectify emotions a great deal. They are things to analyze and explore and look at and figure out, less things to own and wear and identify with. Like Lulah says, it takes some time to also embrace them as well as sift through the nuances of what exactly one is feeling, once one decides to accept their emotions as part of them rather than alien things.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #22
    Senior Member Gen's Avatar
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    I didn't think I had any "emotional problems" before I learned about my INTP label, then after analyzing the hell out of myself within that framework started to think I saw some. I now think that I was just stuck in some crazy Ti-loop trying to define my own emotional processes. Good luck with that by the way.

    I know how I feel, it's whether I allow it that's the question. There are very few things I don't allow anymore, really. That situation is mostly when I think how I feel about something is unfair to someone else. (Jealousy is difficult for me, I try to ignore it, squash it down, deny it. ) Much of the world can act as if you're so unreasonable when you let your emotions be seen, so in the general public I may hide how I'm feeling. I had an ex-husband who caused the same reactions in me, but he's gone now. It helps to have someone that understands; someone that I can discuss it with so I can let it go, rather than let it eat away at me silently.

    I could never become the explosive emotional type, but I'll tell you it is much more relaxing to know you can admit to some of those irrational emotions. You don't have to act on them, just acknowledge them. Otherwise they tie you up.

  3. #23
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    I've gone through periods of "stuffing down" emotions or conflicts and ignoring them, because I don't have the time or energy to deal with them or because they're too awkward or tangled. But that only works for so long. Those past emotions and conflicts can build in the background, leading to higher overall stress levels, irritability, and impulsiveness.

    I imagine NTs do the same sort of "stuffing down", and perhaps even get very effective at finding ways to compensate for the build-up of stress (such as channeling the energy into increased productivity). But even with them, one can see stress building across time. I've seen plenty of NTs seemingly putting up a cool facade but meantime leaking stress and irritability in numerous obvious ways.

    I often feel like I read the emotions of NTs better than they can themselves. It's a blind spot for them, but perceptive outsiders can read it in their face, their body language, their irritability, their passive-aggresiveness, etc. If emotions and conflicts are accumulating quickly, those emotions leak out through the cracks in the facade despite the NT's best effort to pretend they're not there.

  4. #24
    wholly charmed Spartacuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    For a long time that's what it felt like. I could deal with simply traced emotions as long as I was apart from others; once i started getting enmeshed in relationships I couldn't just retreat from, then things got very confusing for awhile.

    Except I liked Digest's comments too, about awareness extending beyond the emotions. I am very very aware of expressed or even mostly suppressed emotions (because they give me cues as to what someone else is going to do or what their motivations are) but they aren't the most important thing, just ONE thing, in the conflict to consider. So it's not that I do not see them, it's just that I place less importance on them overall than others might. But those who prioritize them would feel like I was ignoring the feelings.
    QFT^3
    Feelings are but one input, but others give them elevated priority and get upset if you don't do the same and talk about them constantly, allow them to derail your better intentions, etc.

  5. #25
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    As a self-involved INFP, there were plenty of times in my youth when I was feeling moody or alienated or just uncaring, and I resented people trying to pry into my emotions and get me to open up. So I understand NTs resenting intrusive questions about their emotions.

    OTOH, I think it's important to remember that we all broadcast our moods. It's almost impossible to prevent it.

    So if I'm trying to enlist someone in a project (such as pulling together a team for a work project, or even just inviting a friend on an outing at the county fair) and they're broadcasting moodiness or depression or obstinacy, then I may well ask them how they're feeling and if they're onboard for the project.

    At such times, it would be nice if they were in touch with their emotions enough to provide some basic reassurances or let me know what's on their mind, like "Well, I'm a little out of it because the wife and I were arguing last night, but it'll pass"; or "Well, to be honest, I have some reservations about the project..."

    If NTs are unable to access their own emotions and can't give me any insight into why they're looking and acting skittish, then there's always the fear that they'll be sideswiped by their emotions in the course of the project and that they'll derail the project; i.e., INTPs will get uncommunicative and passive-aggressive, ENTPs will get increasingly obstreperous and argumentative, etc.

    IOW, good intentions don't count for much if people can't monitor and control their moods and they allow them to affect the project.

    OTOH, I'll grant that NTs will hold up under pressure better than NFs. If I'm picking people for a especially difficult work project with a lot of pressure, then I'll often prefer NTs. NFs may come up with better answers at the start, but they may prove unreliable as the pressures increase. By comparison, NTs may be poorer company at the start, but they'll often tune out environmental stresses and keep performing reliably; they may even improve their performance under pressure. In those latter circumstances, I love that NT quality of being able to put aside the personal stuff and just dive wholeheartedly into the task at hand.

    The normal disclaimers: These are raw stereotypes of course. Any one individual can defy expectations; and as people get older there tends to be a moderation and movement toward the middle ground by all types...

  6. #26
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    I've gone through periods of "stuffing down" emotions or conflicts and ignoring them, because I don't have the time or energy to deal with them or because they're too awkward or tangled. But that only works for so long. Those past emotions and conflicts can build in the background, leading to higher overall stress levels, irritability, and impulsiveness.

    I imagine NTs do the same sort of "stuffing down", and perhaps even get very effective at finding ways to compensate for the build-up of stress (such as channeling the energy into increased productivity). But even with them, one can see stress building across time. I've seen plenty of NTs seemingly putting up a cool facade but meantime leaking stress and irritability in numerous obvious ways.

    I often feel like I read the emotions of NTs better than they can themselves. It's a blind spot for them, but perceptive outsiders can read it in their face, their body language, their irritability, their passive-aggresiveness, etc. If emotions and conflicts are accumulating quickly, those emotions leak out through the cracks in the facade despite the NT's best effort to pretend they're not there.
    I don't think it's stuffing down and pretending the problem doesn't exist rather than not wanting to share. This is the NT's OWN problem, you have nothing to do with it, so piss off! Or something along those lines. Leaking stress and irritability is going to happen until the problem is resolved and a side-effect as they're waiting for the opportunity to resolve whatever's bending them so out of shape. It seems to be a common NF mistake that NTs have no idea that they're emotional because that's not the case -- for the NT, the emotion is not at the top of their priority list, usually something to 'handle' rather than an end in and of itself.

    It's not not knowing they're upset, it's not thinking that this is a problem. Then again, if left to stew enough, it can become a serious problem, but it's best not to let it get to that point.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    This is the NT's OWN problem, you have nothing to do with it, so piss off! Or something along those lines.
    Well, as I detailed in my following message, sometimes THEIR problem turns into MY problem.

    As long as they can keep a handle on their mood and can maintain an even disposition (or whatever is required by the circumstances), then fine. I've got no complaint then.

  8. #28
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    Well, as I detailed in my following message, sometimes THEIR problem turns into MY problem.

    As long as they can keep a handle on their mood and can maintain an even disposition (or whatever is required by the circumstances), then fine. I've got no complaint then.
    And that's the problem; keeping other people out of the problem.

    I think all NTs try to do this to some extent, but some are better at it than others.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  9. #29
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    I feel emotions but they always seem "dampened" in comparison to NF's who are dripping with emotion.

  10. #30
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sakuraba View Post
    I feel emotions but they always seem "dampened" in comparison to NF's who are dripping with emotion.
    Eh, "dripping with emotion" isn't exactly all it's cracked up to be. Something in the middle with enough play to feel what's needed and solve what needs to be solved is much better.
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