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Thread: INTP + INFJ

  1. #31
    Junior Member NeverSayNever0304's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiltyred View Post
    Wish I had a nice INTP.
    I wish I had an INTP of my own, too So smart..... ♥sigh♥

  2. #32
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin View Post

    Another BIG problem: he was VERY judgmental of me in some ways. As a matter of principle, I believe in VERY few absolutes: very few things are black and white, and I can almost always find a way to see things from another person's perspective. In my book, something isn't morally wrong unless it definitely harms someone else, or unless it violates someone's ability to live their lives happily. I like the fact that I'm so open-minded and so tolerant, but my INFJ saw that as a sign of weakness, and he sometimes talked to me about how weak-willed I was. He would often found some "flaw" of mine (which was actually perfectly benign and not hurting anyone), and he would do things to try to force me to see my "weakness" and correct it.
    Boner killer.

    I think male INTPs are more willing to put up with this - perhaps because it reminds them of their mothers, perhaps because they just expect women to be this way (it's very FJ) perhaps because they are more desperate. Who knows?

    Anyway, I don't think it works for female INTPs. Perhaps because we've had enough of being told what's wrong with us and want someone broad-minded / tolerant enough to accept us for the marvels we are.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Boner killer.

    I think male INTPs are more willing to put up with this - perhaps because it reminds them of their mothers, perhaps because they just expect women to be this way (it's very FJ) perhaps because they are more desperate. Who knows?

    Anyway, I don't think it works for female INTPs. Perhaps because we've had enough of being told what's wrong with us and want someone broad-minded / tolerant enough to accept us for the marvels we are.

    Yes indeedy. I have an INFJ friend (who asked me out once) who is a writer and writes frequently on male female interactions. He's so traditionally minded I feel like we're from different planets. He'll make very impassioned speeches about how to treat women and to me it always sounds weird/awful. He has sort of a floaty, idealistic high-minded was that sort of irks me because in my humble opinion it ignores reality.

    An example would be when he, and InFP man and a another man I have no idea how to type were hanging out. The untypable generally just talks about how much money he spends on alcholhol, makes the same jokes over and over and casually brags about his business. And tells dumb dirty jokes after which he'll say "excuse me ladies". Of he'll say "I don't know that I can say this in front of ladies". And one time I told the two INFXs how annoying I found that and they didn't get it at all. Had a debate with InFJ about it and he saw is a chivalrous and romantic, I saw it as a way of continually being recognized as being outside of the group and excluded. He couldn't understand why I wasn't flattered and I think now places me in a category of non-woman. He has his theories on women and then and asterisk for *crazypseudo. As if my opinions don't make his theories on women wrong, I'm just the outlier or exception that proves the rule.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Ism's Avatar
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    And one time I told the two INFXs how annoying I found that and they didn't get it at all. Had a debate with InFJ about it and he saw is a chivalrous and romantic, I saw it as a way of continually being recognized as being outside of the group and excluded. He couldn't understand why I wasn't flattered and I think now places me in a category of non-woman. He has his theories on women and then and asterisk for *crazypseudo. As if my opinions don't make his theories on women wrong, I'm just the outlier or exception that proves the rule.
    He sounds kind of dumb.

  5. #35
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    Yes indeedy. I have an INFJ friend (who asked me out once) who is a writer and writes frequently on male female interactions. He's so traditionally minded I feel like we're from different planets. He'll make very impassioned speeches about how to treat women and to me it always sounds weird/awful. He has sort of a floaty, idealistic high-minded was that sort of irks me because in my humble opinion it ignores reality.

    An example would be when he, and InFP man and a another man I have no idea how to type were hanging out. The untypable generally just talks about how much money he spends on alcholhol, makes the same jokes over and over and casually brags about his business. And tells dumb dirty jokes after which he'll say "excuse me ladies". Of he'll say "I don't know that I can say this in front of ladies". And one time I told the two INFXs how annoying I found that and they didn't get it at all. Had a debate with InFJ about it and he saw is a chivalrous and romantic, I saw it as a way of continually being recognized as being outside of the group and excluded. He couldn't understand why I wasn't flattered and I think now places me in a category of non-woman. He has his theories on women and then and asterisk for *crazypseudo. As if my opinions don't make his theories on women wrong, I'm just the outlier or exception that proves the rule.
    "Let's not adjust theories to fit available facts, let's just file all the facts that don't fit in the bin. 'Cos it's neater that way and it means I don't have to rethink my position."

    I've had similar experiences with INFJ men. They think they want you, but what they really want is to "fix" you. Unutterably dull.
    I guess INTP men are masculine enough for INFJ women with traditional leanings. But INTP women are much too unconventional to be accommodated by a traditional mindset... or interested in one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #36
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    It probably would depend upon the individuals but often I cannot see it working.

    But then again im probably just projecting my own lack of confidence in my ability to keep myself from judgement resulting in a more easy-going relationship.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spin View Post
    Most of my INFJ's problems can be found here: http://www.personalitypage.com/html/INFJ_per.html
    Ive read this before and I both like it and rue it. For example an important point is this:

    To grow as an individual, the INFJ needs to focus on applying their judgment to things only after they have gone through their intuition. In other words, the INFJ needs to consciously try not to use their judgment to dismiss ideas prematurely. Rather, they should use their judgment against their own ideas. One cannot effectively judge something that they don't understand. The INFJ needs to take things entirely into their intuition in order to understand them. It may be neccesary to give your intuition enough time to work through the new information so that it can rebuild its global framework of understanding. INFJs need to focus on using their judgment not to dismiss ideas, but rather to support their intuitive framework.
    This is very true and extremely important. Unfortunately we live in a world of people who want quick answers right away and if you are a people pleaser this just plays into this quick-judging issue. I suppose then it is up to the INFJ to aqquire enough will power to turn this judgement inwards without going too far and merely destroying their own self-esteem.

    Distinguishing between helpful judgement and unhelpful judgement can present a difficulty though, especially when one comes in the guise of bearing gifts.....and only afterwards do you find that the apple is poisoned...but then it is too late.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  7. #37
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    i just met this INFJ(tested INFJ and seemed like an INFJ) yesterday, who i had been talking online dating site for about 1.5 weeks. she contacted me and first talking to her online i was like "well she seems decent and talks to me, so i might just as well talk to he back" and she seemed to be really into my insightful, smart and bla bla bla thing. when i saw her i was like "she seems more than just decent", but got friendzoned. i dont get it, she said what she wanted(and thought that what she wanted was too much to ask) and im pretty sure i was that(and more), but she said that there was no chemistry. wtf is this chemistry thing to INFJs? (also similar thing happened with another INFJ this summer, but we met irl, not online)
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  8. #38
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    i just met this INFJ(tested INFJ and seemed like an INFJ) yesterday, who i had been talking online dating site for about 1.5 weeks. she contacted me and first talking to her online i was like "well she seems decent and talks to me, so i might just as well talk to he back" and she seemed to be really into my insightful, smart and bla bla bla thing. when i saw her i was like "she seems more than just decent", but got friendzoned. i dont get it, she said what she wanted(and thought that what she wanted was too much to ask) and im pretty sure i was that(and more), but she said that there was no chemistry. wtf is this chemistry thing to INFJs? (also similar thing happened with another INFJ this summer, but we met irl, not online)
    I always knew whether I felt romantically attracted to someone or not fairly quickly. If I was pretty sure there wasn't going to be anything there, I felt it was unethical to waste someone's time that they could be investing in finding someone that did feel romantically attracted to them. Other types are probably more likely to give it more time before they give it a thumbs down. I dunno.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  9. #39
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    @cafe

    i think i figured it out(at least partially). INFJs seem to be bit hard to approach, they behave in this weird way, like creating some walls by being distant(especially physically) in many ways at the beginning(dunno if they do it consciously or unconsciously). but yet, they seem to want someone who is more proactive(which ENTPs and ENFPs usually are) and can get past these obstacles that they create. and well, i cant do that because i see the obstacles, am pretty hypersensitive about peoples boundaries in general and just can find my way through them. so, because they create these obstacles which i cant get through, there cant really be any sort of intimacy happening, hence lack of sparks, even tho they like my mind and i like theirs -> friends. also i think the thing you mentioned about judging quick just makes it worse, i mean im pretty sure that i could navigate my way through the obstacles, if i had more time to do so..
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  10. #40
    Senior Member sulfit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    i think i figured it out(at least partially). INFJs seem to be bit hard to approach, they behave in this weird way, like creating some walls by being distant(especially physically) in many ways at the beginning(dunno if they do it consciously or unconsciously). but yet, they seem to want someone who is more proactive(which ENTPs and ENFPs usually are) and can get past these obstacles that they create. and well, i cant do that because i see the obstacles, am pretty hypersensitive about peoples boundaries in general and just can find my way through them. so, because they create these obstacles which i cant get through, there cant really be any sort of intimacy happening, hence lack of sparks, even tho they like my mind and i like theirs -> friends. also i think the thing you mentioned about judging quick just makes it worse, i mean im pretty sure that i could navigate my way through the obstacles, if i had more time to do so..
    I'll add one more thing. Their thought process seems disorderly. I think they enjoy the company of INTP or ENTP to help them structure their thoughts. Some of the most interesting debates I've had was with INFJ. I seemed to have helped him think better.

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