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[INTP] INTP mistrust

KLessard

Aspiring Troens Ridder
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
595
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
1w2
To INTPs out there:

I have an INTP friend, and when I first met her, I had this strong impression she was mistrustful of everything and everyone, but only from something in her face, not her words or general attitude. Also, I had friends and family seeing her on photographs, and they all asked: "What's wrong with her ? She looks sad !" My sister even thought she was suicidal. I always had this weird compassion and love for her, feeling that she was carrying deep pains inside, but turns out she has a wonderful family, loves her siblings and had a very normal life.
When I told her about those impressions from people, she didn't say anything nor contradicted in any way. But she isn't generally melancholic or anything. Indifference is more her thing.

Here is a portrait I've painted of her so you can tell for yourself. The expression is quite natural. Those who mourn by ~KetsiaLessard on deviantART

What am I getting wrong or what is real about this ?
 

Colors

The Destroyer
Joined
Apr 24, 2007
Messages
1,276
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
Don't you think there's something incredibly presumptuous about assuming she must be a hurt soul and that you must save/be nice to her? Lots of people have somewhat morose-looking neutral expressions.

Not that I know. Maybe she does have "deep pains", maybe she doesn't. Why don't you be a nice friend and hang out and enjoy her company without worrying about it? (If it's truly something she wants to share- something she finds it your business to know about- if there is anything to hide, that is, it'll come up of her own accord.)
 

BookLady

New member
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
52
MBTI Type
ENFP
I think she looks like an INFJ..

She has the mournful face of one who has deep suffering or depression. Perhaps she had something very traumatic happen in her childhood which she refuses to mention but it has permeated her being.

I would suspect she is INFJ if you hadn't said INTP.
 

BookLady

New member
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
52
MBTI Type
ENFP
Don't you think there's something incredibly presumptuous about assuming she must be a hurt soul and that you must save/be nice to her? Lots of people have somewhat morose-looking neutral expressions.

Not that I know. Maybe she does have "deep pains", maybe she doesn't. Why don't you be a nice friend and hang out and enjoy her company without worrying about it? (If it's truly something she wants to share- something she finds it your business to know about- if there is anything to hide, that is, it'll come up of her own accord.)

Um...because INFJ's HAVE TO CARE more deeply than that! I am sure she can just be nice and hang out with her but the INFJ's I know FEEL EMPATHY and have to do "more".
 

Haphazard

Don't Judge Me!
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Messages
6,704
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Some people get very funny expressions when they're thinking very hard, and NTs generally think very hard a lot, and INTs are more likely to be unaware about the world around them when they're thinking very hard and unaware of the expression (and therefore impression) they give to the world.

I've been asked multiple times "what's wrong?" when I'm just planning a project. Though I can get very upset, I'm not usually upset when people think I am. If I'm demanding more intimacy than usual (hugging, being close, etc.) that usually means that there's something wrong, but most people just think that this is normal or means that I'm doing better than I usually am -- as in, being more confident around other people, even though that's certainly not the case.

People can be strange sometimes.
 

Firelie

Magical
Joined
Apr 18, 2008
Messages
836
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5
I know it's not helpful for the question, but I love your art. I hope you don't mind me adding you on DA...:)
 

KLessard

Aspiring Troens Ridder
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
595
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
1w2
She has the mournful face of one who has deep suffering or depression. Perhaps she had something very traumatic happen in her childhood which she refuses to mention but it has permeated her being.

I would suspect she is INFJ if you hadn't said INTP.

I am INFJ, and I've often misinterpreted things about her, thinking she is more like me than she actually is. If it had only been me finding her sad-looking, I wouldn't say, but other people have seen this in her, so...

She certainly is an INTP being generally cold and unemotional and a computer engineer on the making. She studied mathematics in college (you know what I mean) and has very little skills for empathy and social stuff, without being malevolent at all. If you give her a hug, it's the weirdest thing ever. I don't know if you ever gave a hug to a plank (she's really thin on the top of that), but that's about what it feels like. But afterwards, she'll say something nice as to compensate for her natural clumsiness with affection.
 

Priam

New member
Joined
Dec 20, 2007
Messages
272
MBTI Type
INTP
I wouldn't say that I'm mistrustful in many ways, just very reserved. That thought causes me to bring up the fact that a happy, loving home and good life means very little in certain circumstances. For the INTP (and, indeed, some other types) the sense of overwhelming isolation from the happiness around you can be pain in itself. It's not an emo statement, just the truth as I've seen: we're not built for simple happiness. Enthusiasm? Yes. Naivete? On occassion. Contentment? Rarely.

Happiness? Just isn't often in the cards. I'm rarely anguished... rarely much of anything too intense emotionally, but that sheer even keel can feel like a burden over time.
 

Spartacuss

wholly charmed
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
677
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w4
Some people get very funny expressions when they're thinking very hard, and NTs generally think very hard a lot, and INTs are more likely to be unaware about the world around them when they're thinking very hard and unaware of the expression (and therefore impression) they give to the world.

I've been asked multiple times "what's wrong?" when I'm just planning a project. Though I can get very upset, I'm not usually upset when people think I am. If I'm demanding more intimacy than usual (hugging, being close, etc.) that usually means that there's something wrong, but most people just think that this is normal or means that I'm doing better than I usually am -- as in, being more confident around other people, even though that's certainly not the case.

People can be strange sometimes.

Well said. It's internal concentration + obliviousness to how it looks outside. To this day, people think I'm upset or in a serious mood when I'm just thinking.
As for the mistrust... there is that, for sure. An INTP may not be as expressive, so s/he may meet this trait in others with an attempt at objective scrutiny (for motivations, intentions, etc.). The scrutiny can seem like mistrust if it is in lieu of the responsiveness generally expected from humanoids.
 

KLessard

Aspiring Troens Ridder
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
595
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
1w2
Don't you think there's something incredibly presumptuous about assuming she must be a hurt soul and that you must save/be nice to her? Lots of people have somewhat morose-looking neutral expressions.

Not that I know. Maybe she does have "deep pains", maybe she doesn't. Why don't you be a nice friend and hang out and enjoy her company without worrying about it? (If it's truly something she wants to share- something she finds it your business to know about- if there is anything to hide, that is, it'll come up of her own accord.)

Wow, that's harsh. I never bother her about it, the questions are all being asked inside of me. I never insist on anything she doesn't want to talk about.
And I don't pity her at all, if that's what you mean. I admire her greatly and I love her very deeply.
 

Cypocalypse

New member
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
252
MBTI Type
eNtP
Enneagram
4w5/
I think, of all the MBTI archetypes, it's the INTP who values greater understanding of anything.

The same can be said of an xNTJs but usually, their desire to know is usually just a tool for their agenda, unlike us INTPs who value understanding per se.

It can be thus frustrating when we try to exert understanding on anything, and yet the rest of the world view us or things into something that we may sometimes find limited or insufficient. If it's not their J function (prejudice) that hinders it, it's their S value (face value) that do. It even gets more annoying if it's an SJ.

We INTPs don't like to be put in a box, yet the rest of the world do, so we put really strong respect to those who see where our perspective is coming. Usually, aside from our fellow INTPs, the INFPs are really good at seeing us. I guess that has something to do with their flexibility.
 

spirilis

Senior Membrane
Joined
Jul 5, 2007
Messages
2,687
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
I can agree with most here in that I portray a rather morose, even pissed-off expression on my face when I am feeling "neutral" or analyzing something hard. It sometimes makes me wonder if it has something to do with the Fe "shadow"--like if there is a shadow mind inside making the expression when I'm not paying attention, attempting to show its distaste for its lack of functional attention (which is given to dominant Thinking instead). While I've not received any external confirmation of this, I find that when I sit back and listen to my whole mind--giving attention to everything I can sense that I am thinking about (more or less allowing my mind to distract itself freely without imposed sequence or structure), I find myself smiling a bit.
 

elfinchilde

a white iris
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
1,465
MBTI Type
type
concur with capocalyse.

another point to add on: it's that INTPs only seek to understand, but rarely want to impose control on others/the world, even if mastery has been achieved of that system. But very few types can understand this, and instead question why the intp doesn't want to act/is so 'lazy'. (notably, xSTJs.)
 

sandwich

New member
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
103
MBTI Type
INTP
If she acts indifferent then it's best to leave it at that. Either you're reading into something that isn't there or she's not ready to talk about it. I don't think this is "mistrusting," but I know that I wouldn't just tell people about something I'm going through until after I've dealt with it. It's a part of my desire for self-sufficiency/independence and partly my own stubbornness. That is, if I'm actually dealing with something. She looks more like she's concentrating.
 

KLessard

Aspiring Troens Ridder
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
595
MBTI Type
INFJ
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1w2
She looks more like she's concentrating.

Oh, definitely concentrating.
Is it true NTs are extremely focused when they focus ? I think it is from my experience. Whenever I talk to my friend and I have good reasons to believe she might be focusing on something in her head, she sort of pushes me aside, refusing any conversation. It can be quite painful to me, because I always perceive it as rejection.
 

Haphazard

Don't Judge Me!
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Messages
6,704
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Oh, definitely concentrating.
Is it true NTs are extremely focused when they focus ? I think it is from my experience. Whenever I talk to my friend and I have good reasons to believe she might be focusing on something in her head, she sort of pushes me aside, refusing any conversation. It can be quite painful to me, because I always perceive it as rejection.

Yes, that's the problem with NTs and most people, especially INTs. Usually what they're coming up with in their heads is more interesting than the human interaction offered to them, so they shrug you off.

We don't want you to take it personally, but everyone does.
 

quietgirl

New member
Joined
Sep 29, 2007
Messages
401
MBTI Type
INFJ
Back on the topic of mistrust...

I find one of the things my INTP best friend (and an INTP ex boyfriend) have in common with SJ's I know is a sense of mistrust. I feel the two INFP's I know have this quality as well. It makes me think that it's stemming from Si - especially since in each instance of mistrust, it seems to be stemming from a past experience. Maybe a Si/Ne cycle where the options of what could happen based on what has happened turns into a mistrust of the unknown?

Thoughts?
 

KLessard

Aspiring Troens Ridder
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
595
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
1w2
Back on the topic of mistrust...
It seems to be stemming from a past experience.

Thoughts?

See, that's what I saw in her. But then again, INFJs are naturally "authors," and they make stories out of people. I keep seeing a novel character in my INTP friend, and so I give her a secret, tragic past that probably doesn't exist.
 

Cypocalypse

New member
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
252
MBTI Type
eNtP
Enneagram
4w5/
Klessard,

Seeing that you're an INFP, here's what I can suggest:

1. Never go around the bush and never interact with your INTP friend in the form of a chit chat. INTPs don't really give a damn about chit chats--the more trivial it is and the more it doesn't fit into the bigger picture of anything, the more likely that what you'd say will be ignored. My girlfriend is an ISFJ and she has a knack of seeing me getting bored if she tells stories about the tiny details of her everyday life that doesn't really matter that much (e.g., her interaction with her fellow employees, etc.)

2. Use your intuition (Ni) to get her attention. INTPs are suckers for intuitive knowledge. They like reading between the lines like it's a drug addiction of some sort. Since you have a strong Fe, you can tell her things about social dynamics. Social dynamics, for example would seem to be a bigger body of knowledge, than let's say, some specific person's hairstyle for the day. The larger the idea and the more it fits into the bigger picture, the more interesting it becomes.

3. INTPs are suckers for knowledge but these knowledge are in the form of insights or wisdom (Ti), not really that much on knowledge that's catered to specialization and rigorous implementation (Te), or things that seem to be needlessly intellectual. Again, don't go into the specifics. Broaden things up.

4. INTPs know that they have a weak Fe and they've already accepted that they're not suited for big social situations. The more proactive INTPs thus try to offset this by looking for those they deem knowledgeable enough in understanding them. They need deeper ties and they really value those that seem to have a good understanding of them.

5. They appear to be melancholic because sometimes, they enjoy being in such disposition. For one, they know that they can't be realistically depressed because their thinking function dissipates the feeling function before it gets out of control. INTPs don't really become significantly depressed, at all.
 
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