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  1. #11
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Working on your appearance helps as well (tho I dont know if you need to, I am just giving an idea). People are bought by the cheapest tricks. So get yourself some nice clothing, something modern or hip or professional and let your hair be made so your face looks nicer. If you tell to the barber "make me look nicer" they usually know what to do.

    Its all about cheap tricks, cause reason and rationality wont help you with people.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  2. #12
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    here's what I do when someone says something stupid answer politely than in my head add a snarky comment, it makes me feel better and the other person isn't offending
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  3. #13
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    Working on your appearance helps as well (tho I dont know if you need to, I am just giving an idea). People are bought by the cheapest tricks. So get yourself some nice clothing, something modern or hip or professional and let your hair be made so your face looks nicer. If you tell to the barber "make me look nicer" they usually know what to do.

    Its all about cheap tricks, cause reason and rationality wont help you with people.
    Which is why ENTPs seem to be working on some trick or another.

    Good grooming remains good advice, in general. It doesn't necessarily make others think well of you, but it almost certainly will help to keep them from being repulsed by, for example, unbrushed teeth accompanied by the delightful odor of halitosis.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  4. #14
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    What I found useful was saying - I understand what you are saying/I can see your point...but....<insert my view>. Bigoted remarks - you're entitled to your opinion/any view you want but that doesn't mean others share it. Family, hang it up right now. I guarantee, them learning about MBTI, which they don't care about, is NOT going to add depth to your relationship. I never bring it up to anyone. It's a tool for me to use to understand people, in general, better. Why let them in on it, they can do their own homework if they wish.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  5. #15
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    Bolded is the big one. Pay more attention to the general point and idea when someone is trying to tell you something, if people are using improper/imprecise terms simply translate them in your head as they go along, and use the "right" ones in your response.
    Being on the receiving end of this, I'd say you're totally right. NTs are some of the coolest conversationalists for me because they can actually understand what I'm saying sometimes deeper than I'm comprehending (thoughts more in the ID), or it's to a level of depth that I didn't think anyone could really perceive so I don't bother trying to go there. But they're some of the most annoying when they just focus on semantics and not the bigger picture.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  6. #16
    Senior Member pv255's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    you're entitled to your opinion/any view you want but that doesn't mean others share it.
    Everyone always say that. I agree if the issue is subjective, but many issues are objective. I see so many objective decisions that are made on a subjective basis thinking they are being objective. I sort of feel obligated to point out their error in logic, and I do when I have energy. The bigot part just gives me extra motivation. I pick my battles, because I have limits. In general though, I think negligence is unacceptable. (that statement is subjective )

    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    I never bring it up to anyone. It's a tool for me to use to understand people, in general, better. Why let them in on it, they can do their own homework if they wish.
    Ne/Ni difference. or maybe it is Fe/Fi. who knows...

  7. #17
    wholly charmed Spartacuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    Its all about cheap tricks, cause reason and rationality wont help you with people.
    Troof.
    Ti (43); Ne (41.8); Te (33.7); Fi (30.5); Ni (27.5); Se (24.7); Si (21.5); Fe (17.3)
    The More You Know the Less You Need. - Aboriginal Saying

  8. #18
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    If you want an easier way, you can use what you have to your advantage. There is always a niche for this. Find it and forget the rest.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
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    People might find this behaviour pointless and a waste of time, instead of cutting straight to the point. But I personally think it's a pretty good tactic that works well with Ti based communication.

    Step 1) Repeat back their point of view, showing that you understand how they reached that conclusion.
    Step 2) Then play the devil's advocate, even if it's your real view point. Make them enquiry about a potentially different view point.

    Guess what could be seen as the "manipulative" part here is that it's not 100% clear whether you are revealing your own view point.

    Reasoning. 1) Direct confrontations usually make people more stubborn about their view points. This affects most people regardless of type. Really, the only time this doesn't really play out is when people have adopted a mentor-student dynamic. 2) You aren't viewed as an opponent, merely someone facilitating thought-discussions. 3) People assimilating information, or making their own enquiries-research are much more likely to adopt a position than when being told.

    Result.Even if you don't get an exact switch in attitude. You'll find this approach often softens their own view points and overtime is more susceptible to change (Assuming your reasoning is sound). Only problem is, this might take effort as opposed to straight up saying "Your approach is rubbish." which is how I feel when I can't be bothered to reason with people.

    Writing this all out makes me sound like some schemer. But honestly, this is naturally how I communicate because I don't really like clashes, and more importantly realised that if I truly want to pass on information, clashing is the most rubbish method to correct/informing someone. Arguments are more about reinforcing your own view points and how well they can survive against examination. Discussion is more about passing on information to others. The former can be fun exercise, but it makes you appear more like a bigot. Worse case scenario in the latter is that you'll come across like a teacher. This is often the vibe I get when I see other FJs, or balanced TPs (in terms of feeling and awareness) discuss things.

    Which one are you more interested in is the real question. Are you truly interested in correcting individuals for them to learn, or are you merely asserting your own personality and desire for things to be logical?

  10. #20
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    The truth is always nicer than charisma. If people cannot except truth then you do not need to be liked by them.

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