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  1. #11
    The elder Holmes Mycroft's Avatar
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    Well, INTJ was the result that cognitive functions test gave me

    Also I stand by my assertion that emotions are not a means of arriving at truth, so we're just going to have to agree to disagree on that one I guess!

    Jennifer: that makes a lot of sense, actually. I do have to wonder, though, the extent to which we can realistically expect to develop functions that are in their operations opposed without going nutty, though...
    Dost thou love Life? Then do not squander Time; for that's the Stuff Life is made of.

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  2. #12
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    No doubt. But it's in the wrong forum.
    How is this the wrong forum? It's all about NTs and it's in the NT forum. Unless it was already moved before I asked this question.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  3. #13

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    As far as the OP, I certainly believe it to be true that INTJs can be more intellectual than INTPs. I think any type can be intellectual, and that the development of intellect comes chiefly from the product of interest and pedagogy over time. (I have this opinion pretty much about most things that people call "talent" or other such thing.)

    Also, there are many different types of intellect. That is part of what makes intellectual discourse work. With too much "inbreeding" among intellectual circles, intellectual discourse can easily run into an impasse, because everyone is essentially thinking the same way.

    I'm not sure, how it came up, but I believe emotions are an important part of intellectual growth.

    A lot of people believe that time spent being emotional takes time away from "rational" thought and so will lead to less development intellectually. You used the analogy to physical training. Imagine what would happen if someone developed their muscles in a very unbalanced manner? Overdeveloped quads and underdeveloped hamstrings for instance.

    It may be true that certain functions require mainly the use of certain faculties more so than others. But those faculties reside in a person, and if a certain balance is not maintained, the health of the person, and then the effectiveness of the faculty can be lost.

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  4. #14
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Imo INTJs seem to quite likely to gather shitloads of information that is made up by intelligent people, if they learn to use this info they have gathered in smart ways, they can come up with really extraordinary discoveries and be very intellectual. Its just that quite often INTJs arent able to use this info correctly and think that they are smart because they have read about smart things and this usually comes with high ego and "im the smartest kid in the world" attitude..

    INTPs on the other hand are quite different, INTPs(and ENTPs) can gather shitloads of information from the area of their interest(and most likely skim over other stuff), but put more weight on logical deduction with less trusting on learned stuff, we need to see the logic in the info we gather, so if some info doesent seem logical, its most likely false and is disgarded(INTJs build trust/distrust to the source of information, then either blindly take in the info or disregard it without thinking it at all, depending on introverted feeling judgment about the source, which is quite often quite undeveloped). Where INTPs are prone to fail is to make too big leaps with intuition and too much deduction with too little info.

    I dunno if this is common with INTJs, but my INTJ friend claimed that new truths cannot be discovered via deduction, which i think is X over 9000..

    When it comes to smart INTJ vs smart INTP, the INTJ will most likely shine on knowledge and INTP will most likely shine with deduction skills.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    (INTJs build trust/distrust to the source of information, then either blindly take in the info or disregard it without thinking it at all, depending on introverted feeling judgment about the source...)
    This is false.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    I dunno if this is common with INTJs, but my INTJ friend claimed that new truths cannot be discovered via deduction
    I used to think something like this back in college, but I've advanced beyond that perspective since. I now know that new truths can be discovered by deduction. The reason he's thinking this is probably because while differentiating Ni and Te, there might be some implicit rejection of Ne and Ti (and this holds true for differentiation of all function-attitudes wrt their opposite-attitude function-attitude -- hence your own spite for Te). The truth is that NTJ and NTP thinking are just creative in different ways.

    Ti seems to work within confines of previously accepted first principles, and seems to be creative and discover new truths by discovering the deductive implications of those first principles. Ni is far more suspicious of first principles, and works kind of in the opposite direction, by revealing how tacit/subconscious/unrecognized first principles are inadequate in a particular situation. By doing so, Ni develops the ability to "metaperspectivize", which allows for an openness and creation of new first principles, some of which might lie outside the realm of purely objective affairs and are more just new and different ways of thinking about subjective things, some of which might be novel and accurate ways of approaching objective matters, and some of which might just be utter nonsense (these are new ways of looking at objective things that aren't properly fact/reality-checked by Te and Se).

    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    When it comes to smart INTJ vs smart INTP, the INTJ will most likely shine on knowledge and INTP will most likely shine with deduction skills.
    I agree on the deduction skills, cuz that's Ti's strength, but I'm not sure whether "knowledge" is the best term for what INTJs shine at. I think what you're pointing to is the more empirical approach of our Te, as opposed to the more rationalistic (i.e., deductive) approach of Te. But I think you're missing out on the more inductive approach of our Ni, which is where I would argue our greatest strength lies (you also never mentioned the strength of yours guys' Ne, which makes it look like you're giving a preference to T functions over N functions; seeing as how Ni is our dominant function, I think it's a pretty big thing to have missing from your thinking).
    Last edited by Zarathustra; 01-30-2012 at 05:43 PM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member FunnyDigestion's Avatar
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    none of yall are the true intellectuals, someone's going to turn your brains into a brainrod & use it as a crowbar. Guess what, they work for the government.
    RCUAI
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    "Man is free, but his freedom ceases when he has no faith in it."

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by FunnyDigestion View Post
    none of yall are the true intellectuals, someone's going to turn your brains into a brainrod & use it as a crowbar. Guess what, they work for the government.
    Example 2 of mistaking your Fi for Te.

    Go back to your thread on how dating "inherently" sucks.

    Until you came in here, this thread was actually reasonably intelligent.

    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    Also, there are many different types of intellect. That is part of what makes intellectual discourse work. With too much "inbreeding" among intellectual circles, intellectual discourse can easily run into an impasse, because everyone is essentially thinking the same way.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    I'm not sure, how it came up, but I believe emotions are an important part of intellectual growth.

    A lot of people believe that time spent being emotional takes time away from "rational" thought and so will lead to less development intellectually. You used the analogy to physical training. Imagine what would happen if someone developed their muscles in a very unbalanced manner? Overdeveloped quads and underdeveloped hamstrings for instance.

    It may be true that certain functions require mainly the use of certain faculties more so than others. But those faculties reside in a person, and if a certain balance is not maintained, the health of the person, and then the effectiveness of the faculty can be lost.
    +1

    Check the link I posted above.

    This is the same thing I argued to Mycroft almost two years ago.

    You and I are right, but, for whatever reason (lack of emotional development?), he feels the need to be wrong.

  8. #18
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FunnyDigestion View Post
    none of yall are the true intellectuals, someone's going to turn your brains into a brainrod & use it as a crowbar. Guess what, they work for the government.

    Pshh, let us intellectuals (aka INTXs) discuss.
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    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


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  9. #19
    The elder Holmes Mycroft's Avatar
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    You and I are right, but, for whatever reason (lack of emotional development?), he feels the need to be wrong.
    Oh, this is flagrant baiting and you know it. One Lark is enough on this board. You're smarter than that.
    Dost thou love Life? Then do not squander Time; for that's the Stuff Life is made of.

    -- Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanack, June 1746 --

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Oh, this is flagrant bating and you know it. One Lark is enough on this board. You're smarter than that.
    Haha, you got me.


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