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[INTP] INTP Flirt?

V

violaine

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What I'd really like to know is, is it possible for the INTP to EVER let go of that cynicism and wit? Will they ever allow themselves to be vulnerable or understand the value in demonstrating raw emotion and affection?

Absolutely. I've chanced upon it a couple of times in two friendships and in a romantic relationship. Greatly surprised me. I started to notice that the INTPs I know take the softer feelings of someone they like pretty seriously. Even in friendships. e.g. the INTP is bantering, being acerbic and the other party softly remarks that they went too far... INTPs I've known respect that and back it off.

I've asked specifically about how strong emotions are received in a relationship. The three INTPs I've known (BF, guy friend, girl buddy <--- all super sarcastic) all say that they are very fond of strong, positive emotions. And that they really want to see it from their partners in a relationship. And when they have that, they've been the most open and true-hearted people about their softer feelings. I like seeing an INTP in that mode. <3

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And INTPs can be very able flirts, even for sport. Perhaps a shy INTP might find it hard but being INTP doesn't preclude sport flirting. Esp on the internet. And esp if it's reciprocated. I think it's obvious when an INTP crosses over to serious pursuit though. They can be very direct. I suspect they need to feel strongly about the person, that there is relationship potential and that the interest is mutual.
 

xisnotx

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Do INTP's flirst with people for long periods of time without ever having any real intention of it progressing?

Just curious =)

Well, at least one does.

Sometimes, when I fall for a girl, I'll flirt with her best friend as a kind of way of "keeping my distance" while at the same time "getting to know her". I fall hard sometimes, and it can be misconstrued as creepy so one way of "easing into things" is by innocently flirting with her friend. It's good practice plus sometimes you end up falling for the girl you were flirting with in the first place..

I've been doing this, off and on, for around 6 months with one girl in particular. I don't want to make a move yet because she is the type of girl you marry, and we are too young to get married, so starting anything now would be akin to "lovers suicide" lol. Keeping this in mind, I'll probably flirt with her friend for another 2/3 years before I finally drop the act and make a move...assuming of course me and this girl are compatible..(but I get to evaluate this while this "friendly flirting stage" is going on with her friend)
 

Santosha

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Wow. Have you considered that this flirting up the friend strategy might be a tad risky? While I can see the benefits of keeping ones distance and observing them in a more unaffected manner, I would think that this behavior might really deter your true object of desire.

INTP's be carazy!
 

Tallulah

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I don't flirt to lead people on, but I sometimes flirt when I'm feeling "on." Like, without romantic intent, but feeling more confident and wanting to interact with others and be charming and engaging instead of standoffish. I've been told I've misled people that way, so I've become hyperaware of not leading people on.

When I was younger, I wouldn't have been aware enough to care. I wouldn't have understood how it would affect others' feelings.

INTPs can be very earnest and very gushy when we feel safe and the feelings are mutual. But I, for one, will NOT get gushy unless I know the other person is a safe place and likes me back and is not just seeing where he can get with me. I can't do dating for "fun." I think my F-tardedness makes me always wonder about the other person's intentions in the beginning, so I have to get my bearings first.
 

INTPness

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When I see an INTP flirt, what I am referring to is more of a coming out of their cave and showing a marked interest in someone with various comments of subtle endearment masked through cynacism and wit. Again, just a guess *shrugs*.

To me, this isn't necessarily flirting. And I've had it mistaken for that IRL. It can be one of three things: (a) an honest attempt to get out of our shell and get to know someone better/make a friend (e.g., "Hi folks, welcome to the San Diego Zoo. On your left you will see an INTP actually making an effort to be social and make a friend. Please be quiet, don't stare too much, and don't laugh. Just watch and observe. It may be a while before you see this again." (b) You've become a really good friend and they're beginning to trust you - as a friend. They really like hanging out with you. (c) They "like" you.

Cynacism, wit, and endearment - that's just our normal mode of communication (when we feel like communicating). Ne + Fe. That's just INTP's being INTP's. When it becomes more pronounced, more confident, more open/transparent, etc, that just means that they've put trust in you. They trust that they can be themselves around you. They trust your friendship, they're comfortable with you.


What I'd really like to know is, is it possible for the INTP to EVER let go of that cynicism and wit? Will they ever allow themselves to be vulnerable or understand the value in demonstrating raw emotion and affection?

Yeah, definitely. I'm not "going there" though, unless I know for certain that I want to progress with that person. I'm not going to get all "vulnerable" and comfy/cozy and talking about feelings unless I know I'm ready to move forward. Why would I do that? To confuse someone? Play with their emotions? Love isn't a game.*

Once "we" (as a couple) make the mutual decision to "move forward" - become an exclusive couple, date, etc, then everything becomes fair game. All my emotions, all of who I am becomes available to you. I still may be slow/cautious/observant in certain areas as the relationship unfolds, but for the most part, if I've made that decision, then it's game on.

*In regards to the above, it has been the times that I have shown my vulnerable side and been very open (with girls who I didn't see myself with romantically, but only as good friends) that ended up in disaster. By me being open and vulnerable, they thought it meant something more than it did. So, I try not to do it anymore unless I know I'd like to move forward with them, otherwise they may get hurt and hate me for it. You have to be very careful with these kinds of things. School of hard knocks.
 

JocktheMotie

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I don't flirt to lead people on, but I sometimes flirt when I'm feeling "on." Like, without romantic intent, but feeling more confident and wanting to interact with others and be charming and engaging instead of standoffish. I've been told I've misled people that way, so I've become hyperaware of not leading people on.

When I was younger, I wouldn't have been aware enough to care. I wouldn't have understood how it would affect others' feelings.

I relate to a lot of this, I won't really consider the interpretations of my behavior towards others that I like to have fun and joke with, so I could very well be flirty with people [if that's how the other person describes it] for extended periods of time. I take a particular interaction style that emerges naturally between the two of us and just roll with it. Like Huxley says, this will usually take the form of sarcasm, dry wit, and copious insults.
 

jimrckhnd

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INTPs can be very earnest and very gushy when we feel safe and the feelings are mutual. But I, for one, will NOT get gushy unless I know the other person is a safe place and likes me back and is not just seeing where he can get with me.

"Safe" is a very big word here.

Most of the time my mode is to mistrust emotions in general and really not trusting my own emotions (little bastards are always up to some kind of mischief). As a result, probably like a lot of my type I have the reputation of being a pretty hard person: not suffering fools gladly, stoic, yadda, yadda. I have trouble with insecurity with relationships - esp. in the beginning. So its a struggle to not hold back and frankly I need a steady slow drip of affirmation and affection - not clingy per se - even a quick text will suffice.

But when I start to feel safe and secure with someone - that hard facade collapses and I'm about gushy as warm honey and almost absurdly earnest - heart on sleeve, letting all the feelings hang out. It's kind of exhilarating but oh jeez... does it leave you open to have your teeth kicked in. On the other hand its so relaxing not to have to exert control all the time.
 

INTPness

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"Safe" is a very big word here.

Most of the time my mode is to mistrust emotions in general and really not trusting my own emotions (little bastards are always up to some kind of mischief). As a result, probably like a lot of my type I have the reputation of being a pretty hard person: not suffering fools gladly, stoic, yadda, yadda. I have trouble with insecurity with relationships - esp. in the beginning. So its a struggle to not hold back and frankly I need a steady slow drip of affirmation and affection - not clingy per se - even a quick text will suffice.

But when I start to feel safe and secure with someone - that hard facade collapses and I'm about gushy as warm honey and almost absurdly earnest - heart on sleeve, letting all the feelings hang out. It's kind of exhilarating but oh jeez... does it leave you open to have your teeth kicked in. On the other hand its so relaxing not to have to exert control all the time.

:yes:
 

jimrckhnd

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What I'd really like to know is, is it possible for the INTP to EVER let go of that cynicism and wit? Will they ever allow themselves to be vulnerable or understand the value in demonstrating raw emotion and affection?

Cynicism and our tribes slightly off center sense of humor is part of our mental "armor" that we use to keep the world at a safe distance. Cynicism is the way we (or at least I) brace for the worst and humor is a way to 1) reduce tension and 2) lower the stakes of the emotional game. A joke at the end of a statement allows you to mentally at least "walk it back" because "see, here is a joke - so I'm not totally serious here".

But it is possible to let both go - esp. the cynicism. The humor is always bubbling around in the background ready to come out because, for all of our seriousness, INTPs very often value and enjoy humor. However, the type of humor can change - less biting, more playful. However, for that to happen I'd hazard a guess the average INTP has to feel he/she is in a very safe place with someone - both emotionally as well as physically too I think: you want to see an INTP at their very warmest get them in a private setting - from what I can tell most of them are not as open to displaying emotion in a public or semi-public setting.
 

Xyk

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Most of the time my mode is to mistrust emotions in general and really not trusting my own emotions (little bastards are always up to some kind of mischief).

I have said this, verbatim, on several occasions. Emotions are demons created by Loki, the trickster god, to deceive us and make our lives more complicated.

As for flirting: when I feel really serious about a girl, I'm usually pretty direct. Instead of flirting, I'll say something like "You're cute. I like you.". Sometime much later, I'll ask her out.

I would not recommend my method. It doesn't work at all.
 

INTP

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Emotions are demons created by Loki, the trickster god, to deceive us and make our lives more complicated.

nah, you just need to listen them more carefully and not repress them, or you end up experiencing pnly the really bad feelings that your unconscious thinks that you absolutely have to feel. not to mention that then they have control over you
 

Jessica

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nah, you just need to listen them more carefully and not repress them, or you end up experiencing pnly the really bad feelings that your unconscious thinks that you absolutely have to feel. not to mention that then they have control over you
How do you just turn them off entirely?
 

Santosha

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all say that they are very fond of strong, positive emotions. And that they really want to see it from their partners in a relationship. And when they have that, they've been the most open and true-hearted people about their softer feelings.

I really like this nugget of insight and have often noticed that INTP's seem especially drawn when I display very positive, authentic emotions in a confidant manner. But then I've also seen them get really cranky or sarcastic in responce, too.

INTP's.. do you find yourself drawn to emotional people? Do you just pretend to be disturbed by what some might deem irrational mumbo-jumbo while secretly eating it up? And what is your emotional state usually like in that rich inner world? Flat? Underlying? *pokes INTP robot with stick* I've seen more than a few INTP's come across as rather apathetic, and wonder if you really DO like people that can invoke strong emotions.. but am I wrong? Is it always uncomfortable for you?
 

INTP

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*pokes INTP robot with stick*

800px-Bsod_w2k.png
 

Jessica

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I said turn them off. I tried suicide a few times. It didn't work very well.

I really like this nugget of insight and have often noticed that INTP's seem especially drawn when I display very positive, authentic emotions in a confidant manner. But then I've also seen them get really cranky or sarcastic in responce, too.

INTP's.. do you find yourself drawn to emotional people? Do you just pretend to be disturbed by what some might deem irrational mumbo-jumbo while secretly eating it up? And what is your emotional state usually like in that rich inner world? Flat? Underlying? *pokes INTP robot with stick* I've seen more than a few INTP's come across as rather apathetic, and wonder if you really DO like people that can invoke strong emotions.. but am I wrong? Is it always uncomfortable for you?

1) Drawn to emotional people: it depends on how you define emotional people. My romantic interests are usually F types. INFx, most frequently. I prefer people who can be of average mentality most of the time but be emotional when it's warranted. What I like about the INFx types in specific is how they have a rich emotional inner world, but they tend to keep this emotional world to themselves unless they consider you ready for it. Even then, it comes out in ordered bits in pieces as opposed to the undirected emotional projectile vomit ESFJs are sometimes capable of. INFx types understand how to draw positive emotions out of me as a balance to my negative, and I tend to draw their rational sides out (sometimes just "more", depending on how rational they are to begin with). It's a nice balance, but I do detest undirected emotional projectile vomit. (As a side note, ESFJs aren't the only type capable of it. I would assume every type is, but ESFJs are the most frequent I've observed it in due to having a great level of experience with ESFJs. I know ENFx types are capable of it as well, but the ENFx types I've known are a lot better at restraining it, even the really emotional ones.)
2) Irrational mumbo-jumbo: on one hand, there are many occasions in life where I can 'enjoy' a very deep cringe at something someone is saying. Especially when someone I've considered smart says something incomprehensibly retarded. (i.e. George W. Bush is smarter than Barack Obama... I'll admit neither are geniuses, but goddamn.) There are times when I get enjoyment out of irrational mumbo-jumbo. When I went to the Creation Museum in 2009 with over 250 atheists and agnostics, I ran around taking pictures like a kid with an all you can eat ticket in the world's largest candy store. Certain types of ridiculous statements are cringe-worthy and make me take a step back (being ill-informed, for instance), whereas other types of ridiculous statements amuse me to a great degree on an overall level, but make me desperate to explain things.
3) Emotional state: approximately zero. People readily assume me to be depressed, angry, or a whole plethora of other things that I'm just not feeling. Aside from moments of intense despair or mild happiness, over 90% of my time is spent at a state of emotional nothingness. Even things I 'enjoy', I 'enjoy' from an intellectual basis rather than an emotional one. Listening to Entombed or Dismember makes me 'happy', but only so far as I enjoy the technicality of the music, the high level of patterns and structure, the unique sounds present, and the insane sounds of the vocals. That is to say, when I listen to music, I'm analyzing it, not so much listening to it. My enjoyment, then, is quite a bit different than someone else's enjoyment. I've heard people say "this song makes me happy" and they start to smile, get dreamy eyes, and seem to get lost in themselves. When I think "this song makes me happy" what I'm really saying is, "this song has a good structure, nice instrumentals, passing vocals or above average vocals, and deserves some form of respect." Most of the time, even when 'enjoying' myself, I feel the same thing I do when I'm sitting alone in a dark room doing nothing: nothing!
4) Apathetic: we may show no interest, enthusiasm, or concern, but we often feel them. I rarely feel anything near "concern" because I don't have any reason to care. Interest is frequent. I can be interested in a lot of things. I am interested in a lot of things. I could never just focus on a few things in specific... jack of all trades, master of none? As for enthusiasm, even if I'm enthusiastic, I'm fairly good at keeping it to myself. I can occasionally feel this rising feeling that makes me want to smile, but I just keep my average devil may care expression plastered on. I'm very much afraid to show anything similar to 'enthusiasm', because I view it as a sign of weakness. Even more so than 'fear' itself. I also keep my fears to myself, generally, in part because I have very few.
5) Invoking emotions: look, I don't know about anyone else here, but if I were around someone and they constantly evoked a strong emotional response, or anywhere near constantly, I would get very unnerved and probably try to distance myself or back off as soon as possible. I'm OK with feeling things as long as they don't impact analysis, but feelings very often impact analysis and cause various forms of bias. In case you were wondering, yes, bias is a bad thing when trying to do objective analysis. I have distanced myself from my parents over the years specifically because they attempt to evoke strong emotions in me. The things they say can't, but I still don't want to be subjected to it.

Anyways, this is all me and may not apply for anyone else. So yeah, take it as whatever.

(As a side note, I would suppose the counterpoint to 'emotional vomit' would be 'intellectual dribble'. Extreme ESFs like my mom and dad have no need for any form of intellectual pursuit and – honestly, not even making fun of them – they don't. I hear 'emotional vomit' from them, and they hear, in what I would imagine to be a counterpoint, 'intellectual dribble' from me. It's all about perspective, I have fallen in love with emotional people, it's just the emotional vomit that goes beyond the point of semi-rational emotions which bothers me...)
 

Xyk

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I said turn them off. I tried suicide a few times. It didn't work very well.



1) Drawn to emotional people: it depends on how you define emotional people. My romantic interests are usually F types. INFx, most frequently. I prefer people who can be of average mentality most of the time but be emotional when it's warranted. What I like about the INFx types in specific is how they have a rich emotional inner world, but they tend to keep this emotional world to themselves unless they consider you ready for it. Even then, it comes out in ordered bits in pieces as opposed to the undirected emotional projectile vomit ESFJs are sometimes capable of. INFx types understand how to draw positive emotions out of me as a balance to my negative, and I tend to draw their rational sides out (sometimes just "more", depending on how rational they are to begin with). It's a nice balance, but I do detest undirected emotional projectile vomit. (As a side note, ESFJs aren't the only type capable of it. I would assume every type is, but ESFJs are the most frequent I've observed it in due to having a great level of experience with ESFJs. I know ENFx types are capable of it as well, but the ENFx types I've known are a lot better at restraining it, even the really emotional ones.)
2) Irrational mumbo-jumbo: on one hand, there are many occasions in life where I can 'enjoy' a very deep cringe at something someone is saying. Especially when someone I've considered smart says something incomprehensibly retarded. (i.e. George W. Bush is smarter than Barack Obama... I'll admit neither are geniuses, but goddamn.) There are times when I get enjoyment out of irrational mumbo-jumbo. When I went to the Creation Museum in 2009 with over 250 atheists and agnostics, I ran around taking pictures like a kid with an all you can eat ticket in the world's largest candy store. Certain types of ridiculous statements are cringe-worthy and make me take a step back (being ill-informed, for instance), whereas other types of ridiculous statements amuse me to a great degree on an overall level, but make me desperate to explain things.
3) Emotional state: approximately zero. People readily assume me to be depressed, angry, or a whole plethora of other things that I'm just not feeling. Aside from moments of intense despair or mild happiness, over 90% of my time is spent at a state of emotional nothingness. Even things I 'enjoy', I 'enjoy' from an intellectual basis rather than an emotional one. Listening to Entombed or Dismember makes me 'happy', but only so far as I enjoy the technicality of the music, the high level of patterns and structure, the unique sounds present, and the insane sounds of the vocals. That is to say, when I listen to music, I'm analyzing it, not so much listening to it. My enjoyment, then, is quite a bit different than someone else's enjoyment. I've heard people say "this song makes me happy" and they start to smile, get dreamy eyes, and seem to get lost in themselves. When I think "this song makes me happy" what I'm really saying is, "this song has a good structure, nice instrumentals, passing vocals or above average vocals, and deserves some form of respect." Most of the time, even when 'enjoying' myself, I feel the same thing I do when I'm sitting alone in a dark room doing nothing: nothing!
4) Apathetic: we may show no interest, enthusiasm, or concern, but we often feel them. I rarely feel anything near "concern" because I don't have any reason to care. Interest is frequent. I can be interested in a lot of things. I am interested in a lot of things. I could never just focus on a few things in specific... jack of all trades, master of none? As for enthusiasm, even if I'm enthusiastic, I'm fairly good at keeping it to myself. I can occasionally feel this rising feeling that makes me want to smile, but I just keep my average devil may care expression plastered on. I'm very much afraid to show anything similar to 'enthusiasm', because I view it as a sign of weakness. Even more so than 'fear' itself. I also keep my fears to myself, generally, in part because I have very few.
5) Invoking emotions: look, I don't know about anyone else here, but if I were around someone and they constantly evoked a strong emotional response, or anywhere near constantly, I would get very unnerved and probably try to distance myself or back off as soon as possible. I'm OK with feeling things as long as they don't impact analysis, but feelings very often impact analysis and cause various forms of bias. In case you were wondering, yes, bias is a bad thing when trying to do objective analysis. I have distanced myself from my parents over the years specifically because they attempt to evoke strong emotions in me. The things they say can't, but I still don't want to be subjected to it.

Anyways, this is all me and may not apply for anyone else. So yeah, take it as whatever.

(As a side note, I would suppose the counterpoint to 'emotional vomit' would be 'intellectual dribble'. Extreme ESFs like my mom and dad have no need for any form of intellectual pursuit and – honestly, not even making fun of them – they don't. I hear 'emotional vomit' from them, and they hear, in what I would imagine to be a counterpoint, 'intellectual dribble' from me. It's all about perspective, I have fallen in love with emotional people, it's just the emotional vomit that goes beyond the point of semi-rational emotions which bothers me...)

You sound like someone I know... Are you me? Did I unwittingly set up and post from a second account named Jessica?

With the exception of suicide attempts, and effort put into posting, you and I are on the same wavelength. It's like there are 16 types of people and we are of the same type.
 

Jessica

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You sound like someone I know... Are you me? Did I unwittingly set up and post from a second account named Jessica?

With the exception of suicide attempts, and effort put into posting, you and I are on the same wavelength. It's like there are 16 types of people and we are of the same type.

You might have.
 
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