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[ENTP] How should an ENTP choose a career?

SillySapienne

`~~Philosoflying~~`
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
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I have dreams (literally, reoccurring ones while I'm asleep) that I'm some kind of doctor in something like Doctors Without Boarders training local medical students in some remote village in Africa, lol.
:huh:

My ex has been involved with Engineers Without Borders in a village in Rwanda, and has been doing it for almost four years now, and he enjoys it thoroughly, it's kinda hardcore.

:ninja:
 

white

~dangerous curves ahead~
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Nov 15, 2007
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ENTP
Yes, I agree with both of these statements, I'd think I'd want to teach younger kids though, because the potential for impact is stronger, *weird* but true, I owe my life to a few awesome teachers I happened to have in both elementary and high school.

Yes, with younger kids, the minds are more open (not for us to fill with trash, but then again, *resists temptation* :D )

Yes to owing great teachers. I have good memories of a few. A lot to thank them for. Sometimes, I think if I could make a real impact like that on just a few, it'd be enough.
 

Grayscale

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Dec 20, 2007
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if you plan on spending a large portion of your life on something (and you will with most careers... literally ~1/4 of your working years) it should be something that has long-term potential to stimulate you with the things that you will end up doing most of the day, most days.

a lot of people try to approach jobs and careers by making a list of criteria that are examples of things that satisfy them, only to find the careers that seem to match do not comprise of the same underlying stimuli behind their criteria.


myself for example: i love to take things apart and put them back together, tinker, improve, etc. basically, i love to create and manipulate things with what i have at hand. the type of job i need is one where i can apply my ingenuity to a great extent.

right now, i work as a network architect... i ended up with this job because the above lead me to become interested in computers, and inevitably i became good enough with them that i was able to tack on a bit of industry focused self-study and get paid for my knowledge.

my job does not allow me to apply my ingenuity nearly enough and not in the hands-on fashion that i would like. a good portion of what i do is high-tier technology management and representing the technology to the major business units... much different than why i got into computers. this reality is why i am going back to school to study something that will allow me to do what i find stimulating on a day to day basis, not one that is merely on the subject of something that does. just because someone likes racing cars doesnt mean they will be happy writing about them... that same person would probably enjoy flying an airplane, though.


with that said, some of your reasons are what i consider to be poor examples of why someone should pursue a certain career. lifetime is the real currency here and a career is a big purchase... choose something that you will be satisfied doing, the rest wont seem so unbearable.
 

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
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Jul 11, 2007
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Thank you! What do you do now? I'm Ne/Ti, but have tested as an I a fair bit, so I seem to be very close to borderline. I lean towards ENTP though it seems. Once I become a bit more sure, I'll change it, which should be fairly soon. ^.^

I have thought that teaching the same thing over and over again would get positively tedious, as would excessive specialization, but it seems that everything is quite specialized. I like history, science, and math. They are rather hard to combine, which is why I've considered law focusing on science (that, and if I tire of it, it's not as hard to switch as it would be with other areas). Do you have any ideas of how to combine that for an ENTP? It's rare to like all it seems, but not always easy to find a use for it.

I want to clarify some things about being a professor, because I realized that I didn't give the whole picture. There are basically three parts to the job: teaching, service, and research. (At least these are the three parts in the mathematics field and is probably true of sciences, but I can't say about humanities.)

Teaching is a big part of the job and ENTP's and INTP's view this part similarly, although if anything ENTP's would enjoy this part of the job more. In general professors don't care for teaching lower level (especially gen. ed.) classes, while they enjoy teaching classes where most of the students are majoring in the field that the professor is teaching. The majority of the classes that you teach will be the gen. ed. variety (especially starting out). And I want to restate that my experience is with math where this sort of dynamic is skewed even further. There are tons of gen. ed. math courses but relatively few math majors. Teaching gen. ed. courses does get fairly repetitive after a few semesters. I can't really speak about upper level courses since I only have an MS, so I never taught them. I can only say that in general as the course material grew more difficult, the quality and interest level of the students improved and made the course more interesting to teach. Also among professors it's generally known that the upper level courses is what they are all aiming to teach, while teaching gen. ed. is viewed as "paying your dues". (The majority of math professors are INTP's from my experience.)

The second part of the job is service, which is basically serving on a couple different committees (curriculum comittee, technology comittee, faculty/student relations, etc...). The details of this part of the job can vary greatly and most spend less time with this part than teaching and research, so I won't go into it much.

The third part is research, and (at least for math) I think this is the part that suits INTP's much more than ENTP's. This is because the large majority of math research is done with pure (theoretical) math. The majority of math research is done towards subjects which have no application whatsoever. In my grad school the only significant applied math program was Math Ecology. I did my thesis in this area, because (while I don't find Ecology particularly interesting) it was the most interesting subject I studied in grad school. It had some application unlike the rest. But after my experience in grad school I realized I didn't want a PhD after all, and I basically taught for several years while doing some soul searching to figure out a better career.

My overall point is not that professor is a bad career for ENTP, but that if you do go that route look into some subjects to see if they have potential ways that you could apply your research. Overall I think an ENTP with talents in math and science would enjoy some type of inventor or R&D role over being a professor, or they might enjoy professor a lot if they could aid in R&D in some way on the side. There were a couple of ENTP math professors where I worked and their projects were always more practical than the rest of the faculty (e.g. developing software or partnering with local schools to develop a coherent link between curricula).

What do I do right now? Right now I'm an actuarial assistant (working toward being an full actuary). At the moment I don't particularly enjoy it any more than I did teaching since it's a job for introverts. However most jobs are kind of crappy starting out, but I've picked a career that looks like I'd enjoy it more after a few years into it. Even if I don't like a few years down the road though, it pays a lot more. The pay is important because I'm also trying to save a lot of money so that I can easily start my own business or maybe just work for myself if I've decided that I don't care for the job anymore. Overall I think ENTP's are most satisfied either working for themselves or heading their own business, so I'm setting myself up to do that in the long run.
 

edel weiss

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Mar 31, 2008
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I'm currently studying law, and I enjoy it. I've always wanted study these kind of subjects, like Politics, Sociology, Psychology, etc. But not just those subjects. Law touches all of these fields, and a lot, lot more.

And Law allows you to pick and choose from various spheres of life. Some of the laws are so ambiguous that it's a lot of fun interpreting them in many different ways. And going through old cases that were solved in ingenious ways is very rewarding. Litigation, of course, is ideal for someone who is articulate and enjoys playing with ideas.
 

Argus

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i'm in one of those situations where there just seems to be too much to do, but too scared to commit to one of them because of a possible regret of not taking another rout.

philosophy, psychology, sociology, anthropology, theology, biology, photography, music...
the logy's are endless.
 

entropie

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I am really to old to think about what exact career I should choose, from now on it is more like: what do I do with my life, next ?

The career I choose in Engineering is more a way to finance my life. That does not mean that I am unhappy with what am I doing, but I have come to the knwoledge that indipendent from what it is I am doing, I am going to be unhappy with it at a certain time. So there is nothing in this world that ever can bound me myself to one thing 100%, but what can sustain me to be who I am.

I am intrested in sciences, from psychology to engineering and I started studying engineering, cause this was the tougher one and I could not yield the challenge. I am currently working in projectmanagment and development as an university assistant, because I am still working on my Master. My dream would be to have my own company, but I know that it must be run by profis or I will endager its existence :).

This entp guy here, you all know, is one of my mentors. I quoted the best part of the speech. The whole speech is great but in this clip the first minute can suffice to watch :).


"Remembering that all could be dead soon, is the most important tool I have ever encountered to make the big choices in life. Because almost everything, all external expectations, or pride, or fear of embarassment of failure; these things just fall apart in the face of death, leaving only what is truly important. Remembering that you are going to die, is the best way to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to loose, you are already naked, there is no reason not to follow your heart."

YouTube - Steve Jobs Stanford Speech P2
(be careful the tone is very loud)
 

sandbeige

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I am currently looking for a job and find it a little difficult to define myself. But, as I did some long thinking on that issue, and have some little experience, I can recommend business analysis, investment banking, e-commerce and photography, and definitely can not reccomend audit and accountancy.
 

INTJMom

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i'm in one of those situations where there just seems to be too much to do, but too scared to commit to one of them because of a possible regret of not taking another rout.

philosophy, psychology, sociology, anthropology, theology, biology, photography, music...
the logy's are endless.

There are many times I have envied ENTPs for all their gifts and talents, but this problem is definitely not one of those things I desire. It must be so frustrating. I struggle with this fear but to a much smaller degree, so I feel your pain.
 
Joined
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Must... settle... down...

finishing a liberal arts B.A.... but am trying to build up my sciences to a point where I could technically apply to grad school in either linguistics, philosophy, physics, or neuroscience.

I think my best bet is to be a professor and write books. If I hit it big with books and make money, I'm going to Brazil and having loads of the shtickity. Otherwise, I guess I'll just enjoy the fact that as a professor, I get to interact with hundreds of smart people... students, teachers... artists... writers... scientists... one or two politicians here and there, but not really...
 

mollyowens

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Jul 9, 2008
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As an entrepreneur ENTP I can say that the stereotype about their being natural business people is very true! I love that as a business owner I can take on many different roles, depending on how I feel that day--writer, marketer, salesperson, web designer, consultant, educator etc. If I get tired of doing one thing I just leave it for a bit and work on something else.

You can incorporate your other interests into entrepreneurship as well. Since writing is an interest for you, you might look for a business where you can incorporate some writing--maybe one where you get the word out about your product or company with articles and publications. As an example, I have a MBTI consulting business but spend a lot of time writing about type for internet publications. Businesspeople who make themselves experts by writing about their business area generally command higher respect in their field.

I also considered becoming a doctor but realized that, like you, one of my main criteria was not getting stuck within a system, and doctors are absolutely stuck and constrained by the health care system. Lawyers too have to work within a tight web of regulations. Another major downside to both those careers is that after training for so many years, you can't really change careers midlife. I think for many ENTPs, no career is lifelong. We get bored quickly and want move on to new challenges, so a career with a ton of startup cost and time is maybe not the best choice.
 

Fiver

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I am an ENTP in my mid-forties and can add some perspective. I started out as a CPA; I loved studying accounting because it seemed like fun puzzle solving. The actual career is very repetitive. I slugged through for six years. What a waste.

Run away as fast as you can from careers like medicine, law and accounting which, believe it or not, are 95% routine. A cardiologist friend once told me that 98% of his work life was routine -- only 2% of his time must he innovate using everything he has ever learned or experienced. That is not the life for an ENTP.

Personally, I love marketing because it allows me to use my process skills and my creativity. My next job, I would love to be a marketing consultant and flit from gig to gig.

I love being the president of an organization; it gives me a meaningful way to be involved in everything the organization does at a very high level -- no tedium. I always make sure I have "implementers" and "empathic" members on my team to help me in those weak or blind spots. I love working with people -- but in visioning, creative ways. I may not have great people -to-people skills -- but I am able to easily see the patterns of who will do what when, how they will react.

I agree with the person who wrote that owning your own business allows you to play a different role every day. A business degree can be a great, but maybe not necessary, foundation.

The most important thing I would tell an ENTPer is don't ingnore your need to be creative and innovative. Don't underestimate your desire to be autonomous or experience frequent radical change. You don't need to limit yourself to obvious career choices.

Here's what I would do, if I could do it all over:

Beginning as early as college (if not high school), pick a few areas of intense interest, like say, photography, French food, high-school math teaching techniques, whatever.

Plan to spend a year (or two or three) diving as deep and wide into each one as you can. Let yourself completely obsess. Actually work in this area if you can. If not, volunteer or work for free in your spare time; you will love the flexibility of volunteering.

A great first job is a sales job with a quota. You may not want to be in sales, but it will give you training you will be glad you have -- especially if you end up with your own business. The sales training will come in handy no matter what.

At the end of 5 to 8 years, apply your visioning skills (seriously, you have them and not every one does) to what you can do with this truly unique background that you have been building. Think of ways you can leverage your varied, but deep experiences into your own business or consulting gigs. Keep in mind that you are great with systems and can see processes and patterns where others cannot. Just like Steve Jobs said in his address, "Connect the dots" of your own life. If you do the above, you will have some pretty interesting dots to connect.

It's a good idea to begin working now toward leading your own business; you will love the flexibility and the autonomy and you can motivate and inspire other people easily.
 

substitute

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Absolutely Fiver. And also, don't talk yourself into settling down just because other people say you should. Perfectly healthy adventurousness and curiosity are often put down as unhealthy restlessness; the two are not the same thing. If you have the first one, don't let others persuade you to repress it on the basis that they think it's the second.

I've learned that trying to force myself to settle down means that I just end up sticking with something purely to try to prove people wrong about me being restless or unable to stick at things - even when this thing is harmful to my psyche and there's no logical reason to continue with it. It causes me to end up putting up with a feeling of repressedness and boredom that causes me to actually BECOME restless, so that I eventually just can't take it any more end end up just having to break the fuck out and just create total upheaval to just GET OUT OF HERE!!

I've learned to embrace my need for changes of scene, for adventure and changes of direction, for refreshment and renewal. And that these things are perfectly valid parts of my personality that are not problems or flaws, but only become seen as problems when I'm forced into a situation where they're not able to be expressed. I do not have problems with commitment and I am not a person who wants to run away from their problems. When I explore it's not escapism.

Therefore, I've learned to make sure that whatever I do, whatever job I'm engaged in, either the job itself must contain the possibility to discover new things, new places, or it must leave me with enough leisure time and resources to do so in my spare time. It doesn't mean you have to run off to different countries and blow off your responsibilities. I've lived in the same town for 10 years now (a personal best lol), but the way that I can stay sane with all this sameness is by having a) different groups of people to socialize with, in different scences, b) going out to explore randomly a lot, from long distance vacations to driving to a village I've just spotted on the local map and just rambling around it, checking everything out and talking to the people I find. And then after I've done that, I come back home. And c) my work has always entailed a high level of unpredictability and, when I'm there, high pressure. And it's always been something I've believed in, something I'm passionate about.

Working in the charity/humanitarian sector satisfies all three needs: making a difference/improving the world; variety and challenges that require creative thinking; frontlining it, getting my hands dirty (being there amongst the people). It also often entails travel to different areas and frequently working with new teams, different people.

Your need for adventure, challenge and new scenes is an integral part of your personality and is valid, valid, valid. Don't ever let anyone persuade you otherwise, or you'll end up committed to a lifestyle that kills who you are slowly from the inside.
 

Jack Flak

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The career of "eccentric musician" worked well for Trent Reznor.
 

Fiver

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Thanks, Substitute. You're right. I find that as an ENTP I am perfect for jobs which end or that you must turn over to someone else. I can be so intensely involved in a project or job and then easily hand off my "baby" to someone else. That is a natural ability that many people don't have. Some people really struggle, for example, after a promotion wiht not being able to let go.
 

substitute

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Actually, my brother (ENFP) has described the Ne primary condition like this: it's like being bisexual. You have the capacity to be attracted to both males and females. If you settle down with one person, you are effectively denying expression and life to the other half of your sexuality. The part of you that is attracted to the other gender, who can have relationships with them, must remain repressed. And yet if you don't settle down, then neither of the sides of you are going to be fulfilled. Whatever you do, you remain unfulfilled, because the world says to you "pick one!"

Being Ne primary means you're fascinated by pretty much everything. And you're also usually, potentially good at everything too. If you settle in one thing, you deny life to all the other parts of your potential. Whatever you do, the parts of you that could be doing something else and pwning it just as much, are being denied expression. Because so much time and resources are necessary to work your way to success in any one career, effectively the world's saying to you, "Pick one!"

But you just can't. :cry:

:laugh:
 

Kora

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Actually, my brother (ENFP) has described the Ne primary condition like this: it's like being bisexual. You have the capacity to be attracted to both males and females. If you settle down with one person, you are effectively denying expression and life to the other half of your sexuality. The part of you that is attracted to the other gender, who can have relationships with them, must remain repressed. And yet if you don't settle down, then neither of the sides of you are going to be fulfilled. Whatever you do, you remain unfulfilled, because the world says to you "pick one!"

Being Ne primary means you're fascinated by pretty much everything. And you're also usually, potentially good at everything too. If you settle in one thing, you deny life to all the other parts of your potential. Whatever you do, the parts of you that could be doing something else and pwning it just as much, are being denied expression. Because so much time and resources are necessary to work your way to success in any one career, effectively the world's saying to you, "Pick one!"

But you just can't. :cry:

:laugh:

Lol that was precisely why I thought I could be an Ne primary user.
And the only ENTP that I know is bisexual, curiously.
 

Nonsensical

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Seems like all of my ENTP friends, which makes up a lot of them, seem to be very very liberal activists..and most are going, or in, literature, art, or science.
 
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