[ENTP] Wiki project - entp description

[garbage]

a little bonus challenge.. The PersonalityPage ISFJ profile

As an ISFJ, your primary mode of living is focused internally, where you takes things in via your five senses in a literal, concrete fashion. Your secondary mode is external, where you deal with things according to how you feel about them, or how they fit into your personal value system.

ISFJs live in a world that is concrete and kind. They are truly warm and kind-hearted, and want to believe the best of people. They value harmony and cooperation, and are likely to be very sensitive to other people's feelings. People value the ISFJ for their consideration and awareness, and their ability to bring out the best in others by their firm desire to believe the best.

ISFJs have a rich inner world that is not usually obvious to observers. They constantly take in information about people and situations that is personally important to them, and store it away. This tremendous store of information is usually startlingly accurate, because the ISFJ has an exceptional memory about things that are important to their value systems. It would not be uncommon for the ISFJ to remember a particular facial expression or conversation in precise detail years after the event occured, if the situation made an impression on the ISFJ.

ISFJs have a very clear idea of the way things should be, which they strive to attain. They value security and kindness, and respect traditions and laws. They tend to believe that existing systems are there because they work. Therefore, they're not likely to buy into doing things in a new way, unless they're shown in a concrete way why its better than the established method.

ISFJs learn best by doing, rather than by reading about something in a book, or applying theory. For this reason, they are not likely to be found in fields which require a lot of conceptual analysis or theory. They value practical application. Traditional methods of higher education, which require a lot of theorizing and abstraction, are likely to be a chore for the ISFJ. The ISFJ learns a task best by being shown its practical application. Once the task is learned, and its practical importance is understood, the ISFJ will faithfully and tirelessly carry through the task to completion. The ISFJ is extremely dependable.

The ISFJ has an extremely well-developed sense of space, function, and aesthetic appeal. For that reason, they're likely to have beautifully furnished, functional homes. They make extremely good interior decorators. This special ability, combined with their sensitivity to other's feelings and desires, makes them very likely to be great gift-givers - finding the right gift which will be truly appreciated by the recipient.

More so than other types, ISFJs are extremely aware of their own internal feelings, as well as other people's feelings. They do not usually express their own feelings, keeping things inside. If they are negative feelings, they may build up inside the ISFJ until they turn into firm judgments against individuals which are difficult to unseed, once set. Many ISFJs learn to express themselves, and find outlets for their powerful emotions.

Just as the ISFJ is not likely to express their feelings, they are also not likely to let on that they know how others are feeling. However, they will speak up when they feel another individual really needs help, and in such cases they can truly help others become aware of their feelings.

The ISFJ feels a strong sense of responsibility and duty. They take their responsibilities very seriously, and can be counted on to follow through. For this reason, people naturally tend to rely on them. The ISFJ has a difficult time saying "no" when asked to do something, and may become over-burdened. In such cases, the ISFJ does not usually express their difficulties to others, because they intensely dislike conflict, and because they tend to place other people's needs over their own. The ISFJ needs to learn to identify, value, and express their own needs, if they wish to avoid becoming over-worked and taken for granted.

ISFJs need positive feedback from others. In the absence of positive feedback, or in the face of criticism, the ISFJ gets discouraged, and may even become depressed. When down on themselves or under great stress, the ISFJ begins to imagine all of the things that might go critically wrong in their life. They have strong feelings of inadequacy, and become convinced that "everything is all wrong", or "I can't do anything right".

The ISFJ is warm, generous, and dependable. They have many special gifts to offer, in their sensitivity to others, and their strong ability to keep things running smoothly. They need to remember to not be overly critical of themselves, and to give themselves some of the warmth and love which they freely dispense to others.

 

[guesswho]

I vote changing the name of the ENTP type to wikipedia type. It's more suitable.

 

[guesswho]

removed.

 

[A window to the soul]

thanks for your work

My pleasure.

a little bonus challenge.. The PersonalityPage ISFJ profile

Hey man, we're not working for peanuts here to feed the elephants. :1377:

Would any of you identify with "handles lizards"?

Handles daddy long legs.

removed.

What, what happened?

 

[Qre:us]

Would any of you identify with "handles lizards"?

In one's pocket?

 

[Qre:us]

a little bonus challenge.. The PersonalityPage ISFJ profile

Nice excercise.

* clarifiers
As an ISFJ, your primary mode of living is focused internally (someTimes)) where you takes things in via your five senses in a literal, concrete fashion. Your secondary mode is external, where you deal with things according to how you feel about them, or how they fit into your personal value system [colo="red"]]("fit", as in, internal consistency of morality/value/ethics/goodness/minimixing harm, maximizing potential -the collective and the individual; what it sums up to, does it make sense for alll concerned, connected, affected?[/color]

ISFJs live in a world that is concrete and kind. They are truly warm and kind-hearted, and want to believe the best of people. They value harmony (that's why I get attracted to chaos...due to a wish to make order, out of....) and cooperation, and are likely to be very sensitive to other people's feelings (but, paradoxically, or because of it, not as quickly to my own, I revolve around the 3rd person perspective, often, too frequently sometimes). People value [...] for their consideration and awareness, and their ability to bring out the best in others by their firm desire to believe the best. (optimism is the name of the head game)


[...] have a rich inner world that is not usually obvious to observers. They constantly take in information about people and situations that is personally important to them, and store it away. (important, as in, important to my curiosity, too, in addition to deeping my own understanding of my core values/ethics...how best I should navigate this world)

This tremendous store of information is usually startlingly accurate, because the [...] has an exceptional memory about things that are important to their value systems. It would not be uncommon for the [...] to remember a particular facial expression or conversation in precise detail years after the event occured, if the situation made an impression on the [...] (if you tickle my curiosity, in any depth, good, bad or ugly, I will remember you)


ISFJs have a very clear idea of the way things should be, which they strive to attain. They value security and kindness, and respect traditions and laws. They tend to believe that existing systems are there because they work. (to a degree, as reliability testing is informative and valuable, but there must always be room for progress, to maximize potential while minimizing collective harm...looking to the future as a reason to know what of the past to hang on to and what of the past to learn from and thus, let go, and move on....)

Therefore, they're not likely to buy into doing things in a new way, unless they're shown in a concrete way why its better than the established method. YES!! The benefit must > the cost, as a reason to put in the effort in the first place, unless it's solely curiosity-driven, but, even still, I'm very practically oriented....what does it do? how will it realistically help/improve/teach us something more?

ISFJs learn best by doing, rather than by reading about something in a book, or applying theory. For this reason, they are not likely to be found in fields which require a lot of conceptual analysis or theory. They value practical application. Traditional methods of higher education, which require a lot of theorizing and abstraction, are likely to be a chore for the ISFJ. The ISFJ learns a task best by being shown its practical application. Once the task is learned, and its practical importance is understood, the ISFJ will faithfully and tirelessly carry through the task to completion. The ISFJ is extremely dependable.

The ISFJ has an extremely well-developed sense of space, function, and aesthetic appeal. For that reason, they're likely to have beautifully furnished, functional homes. They make extremely good interior decorators. (or maybe, just me ) This special ability, combined with their sensitivity to other's feelings and desires, makes them very likely to be great gift-givers - finding the right gift which will be truly appreciated by the recipient. ( I'm often told that I give great gifts )

More so than other types, ISFJs are extremely aware of their own internal feelings, as well as other people's feelings. They do not usually express their own feelings, keeping things inside. (it takes times for me to formulate into words what I'm feeling, personally. A battle to logically rationalize it away versus figuring out the language of my emotions)

If they are negative feelings, they may build up inside the ISFJ until they turn into firm judgments against individuals which are difficult to unseed, once set. Many ISFJs learn to express themselves, and find outlets for their powerful emotions.

Just as the ISFJ is not likely to express their feelings, they are also not likely to let on that they know how others are feeling. However, they will speak up when they feel another individual really needs help, and in such cases they can truly help others become aware of their feelings.(i'm very much of the belief in minimum/non-interference, unless [potential for] harm is being done

The [...] feels a strong sense of responsibility and duty. They take their responsibilities very seriously, and can be counted on to follow through. For this reason, people naturally tend to rely on them. The ISFJ has a difficult time saying "no" when asked to do something, and may become over-burdened. In such cases, the ISFJ does not usually express their difficulties to others, because they intensely dislike conflict, and because they tend to place other people's needs over their own. The ISFJ needs to learn to identify, value, and express their own needs, if they wish to avoid becoming over-worked and taken for granted.

ISFJs need positive feedback from others. In the absence of positive feedback, or in the face of criticism, the [...] gets discouraged, and may even become depressed. When down on themselves or under great stress, the ISFJ begins to imagine all of the things that might go critically wrong in their life. They have strong feelings of inadequacy, and become convinced that "everything is all wrong", or "I can't do anything right". (when, in those extreme cases, optimism is blown out, pessimism is darker than the pitched black in myself, so melodramatic)


The [...] is warm (? - depends), generous, (to a point, I also like to be fair, to the other AND myself, both) and dependable. They have many special gifts to offer, in their sensitivity to others, and their strong ability to keep things running smoothly. They need to remember to not be overly critical of themselves, (I can be my own worst critic and I can be too-harsh a judge on myself...very internally driven, no one ever really knows, is aware, how twistedly I can berate myself) and to give themselves some of the warmth and love which they freely dispense to others.

 

[entropie]

entp's writing isfj type profiles sounds a bit like "how to bake your perfect partner"

 

[lunalum]

(just to clarify) This is about wiki'ing the ISFJ profile as the ENTP relates to it, not about rewriting it for the ISFJs, right?

I also agree with entropie in that this is looking a bit suspicious

 

[Qre:us]

(just to clarify) This is about wiki'ing the ISFJ profile as the ENTP relates to it, not about rewriting it for the ISFJs, right?

No idea.

I also agree with entropie in that this is looking a bit suspicious

Exactly! Which should raise the question of the validity of Type Profiles as descriptions of simply manifested behaviours, in accurately deciphering an ENTP from its complete opposite, ISFJ.

It's rife with social desirability bias, to start off with....

This is why, in my aim, I took off ISFJ and subbed with [...] within that profile - to indicate that a lot of types can find resonance with that ISFJ profile, not just ENTP. I.e., sub in ANY type within [...].

I do not prescribe to looking at behaviours = Type (imo, it's ridiculous), but if we wanna do a cognitive-behaviour analysis in aiming to describe a type, I'm game. We haven't done that yet, btw. And, I'm too lazy to start.

 

[funkadelik]

I do not prescribe to looking at behaviours = Type (imo, it's ridiculous), but if we wanna do a cognitive-behaviour analysis in aiming to describe a type, I'm game. We haven't done that yet, btw. And, I'm too lazy to start.

I agree. The behaviour = type descriptions tend to have a "horoscope" aura to me. Yeah, of course you're gonna relate to it cause it's just so vague and general. But aren't some of them put together based on how the preferences for cognitive functions relate to one another? I'm not sure. If not, there should be.

Or is that what you were getting at with "we haven't done that yet, btw. And I'm too lazy to start?" Cause I'm too lazy, too...

 

[entropie]

I agree with you Q (she's omnipotent anyways ), I am only wondering: the type profiles are of course written so a majority of people could identify with them. Since all profiles are written that way, I think it's ok so far because then you really would have to choose your preference. If you tho would start to write a detailed profile with everybody bringing in his own ideas, I think the outcome will be a kinda soulless pragmatic if not mathematical personality that doesnt really fit for anyone.

So I think maybe it is even the best way to keep all profiles as general as possible, we could just try to add some more reality to them so normal people who are not crazy rocket scientist can identify with them aswell (tho I doubt there are entps who havent at least entertained the thought to build rockets )

 

[garbage]

(just to clarify) This is about wiki'ing the ISFJ profile as the ENTP relates to it

This. The thread has always been about how each particular poster personally relates to a particular type description, in an effort to see what the "core essence" of "ENTP" is.

I choose the ISFJ profile because I wanted to see how much of a "horoscope" aura there actually was in the descriptions.

But aren't some of them put together based on how the preferences for cognitive functions relate to one another? I'm not sure. If not, there should be.

There's always "A Functional Analysis" on this page for starters. And entropie will bludgeon me with a large stick for mentioning this (), but the wikisocion descriptions provide a good template for what a function-based profile might look like.

 

[guesswho]

They've got all those symbols it makes it look so scientific

 

[funkadelik]

They've got all those symbols it makes it look so scientific

Scientific and suitable for kindergarten children.

 

[Qre:us]

I agree with you Q (she's omnipotent anyways ), I am only wondering: the type profiles are of course written so a majority of people could identify with them. Since all profiles are written that way, I think it's ok so far because then you really would have to choose your preference. If you tho would start to write a detailed profile with everybody bringing in his own ideas, I think the outcome will be a kinda soulless pragmatic if not mathematical personality that doesnt really fit for anyone.

So I think maybe it is even the best way to keep all profiles as general as possible, we could just try to add some more reality to them so normal people who are not crazy rocket scientist can identify with them aswell (tho I doubt there are entps who havent at least entertained the thought to build rockets )

Nah, we don't have to make it all "weird, scientific, rocket science" language for it to be understood. Just talk in terms of analyzing your own thought process, not just what your final manifested behaviours were. But, the thought process that led you to that behaviour.

But aren't some of them put together based on how the preferences for cognitive functions relate to one another? I'm not sure. If not, there should be.

It's not about what you can do/be, but why you may be prone to doing/being, the way you are - i.e., an understanding of the cognitive processes and their interactions in how it finally led to a manifested behaviour.

Or is that what you were getting at with "we haven't done that yet, btw. And I'm too lazy to start?" Cause I'm too lazy, too...

E.g., Procrastination. It's not only an ENTP trait.

But, what is uniquely "ENTP" about it, let's just stick to NeTi interacting - perceiving then judging/action (= of procrastination) - is the common way it is cognitively rationalized, perhaps.

This if off my head, so take it with a grain of salt:

PROCRASTINATION
NeTi - huge preference for perceiving externally, beyond the moment, to its possibilities, so Ti is always trying to play "catch up" with Ne's influx, and tailing behind, often......which leads to seeking more and more external input versus saying "enough is enough, let's get this shit started and done!" A struggle with internal motivation because Ne's motivation to get constantly fed may be trumping one's motivation "TO DO" versus "want to do" (Ne curious enough to find out what will happen next, to actually do, to find out). NeFi is eerily similar, I'd guess, in this way.

NiTe- a preference for perceiving, without direct data, the essence of an idea, perhaps even going as far as seeing how its final outcomes could possibly end up being, and Te trying to figure out how best to externally implement in order to get the optimal outcome given all the envisioned possible scenarios/outcomes, but the reality/environment not being optimal at that moment, so delaying implementing until "it's just right". Delaying, and delaying and delaying....

= both give us the same manifested behaviour, procrastination, but through vastly different cognitive thought processes and motivations, therein.

edit: both those ^ are NxTx loops, I didn't account for any other functions but those two - to keep it "simple".

 

[yenom]

I think it'd be better to say what we think is true about us rather than our type. Because people tend to associate themselves with their types too much.
Then you can just look at the data you get and see what's the general tendency.

My personal description

Disorganized
Takes suicidal risks
adaptable
Prefers to be my own boss
hates deadlines
Symapthetic to some people, but mostly indifferent
want to know everything and learn information from all sources
driven by curiousity
scheming and calculating (don't know whether this is true for other people who shares my type)
loyal to certain people, absolutely ruthless and merciless to my enemies
hide my feelings, I am not particularly open
can be sentimental, but can also be cold blooded
between introverted and extroverted
Experience-driven
believe in ideas, even if they seem outrageous and unconventional
sees the big picture
often contradictory
no common sense
opportunist
amoral

Actually the character Sylar from Heroes pretty much describe me.

 

[guesswho]

Ur a serial baby killer?

 

[yenom]

Ur a serial baby killer?

 

[garbage]

My personal description

A little list I whipped up..

• Emotionally calm
• Relatively outgoing
  
• Well-organized
• Analytical
• Prepared and planned
• Conscientious
• Curious
• Not routinized
  
  
• Self-sacrificing
• Sympahetic
• Respectful
• Friendly
• Holds grudges
• Conflict-avoidant
• "Charming" (as I've been told )
• Image/self-conscious (for good and for bad)
• Mirrors other people in social settings, work functions, and one-on-one interactions
  
• Continually on the search for new and better methods, ideas, and enterprises; for a deeper and more meaningful explanation of phenomena

 

[guesswho]

Takes suicidal risks

I also take risks. Ridiculous risks.