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  1. #21
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    INTPs are not affected by their upbringing. No matter where they come from or what race, religion or culture, we all look exactly like this.

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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  2. #22
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    Oh, but with more zits.
    JiNe
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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  3. #23
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    Agree with the zits. But he dresses too neatly. And really, who has time to comb and gel their hair with such a stylish center part?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by lets eat pie View Post
    Agree with the zits. But he dresses too neatly. And really, who has time to comb and gel their hair with such a stylish center part?
    True. I guess that's what we look like once you put us through the wash.
    JiNe
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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Sherlock Holmes View Post
    Oh, but with more zits.
    Black people are much less prone to getting bad acne, and the fact that out culture is so unacceptable of geeky nerdiness means the number of visibly geeky/nerdy types proportionately lower. I've never seen a Steve Urkel among us.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    ...and the fact that out culture is so unacceptable of geeky nerdiness means the number of visibly geeky/nerdy types proportionately lower. I've never seen a Steve Urkel among us.
    I think that's precisely the topic of this thread: of people having to blend in with their social environment even if it goes against their nature.

  7. #27
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lets eat pie View Post
    I think that's precisely the topic of this thread: of people having to blend in with their social environment even if it goes against their nature.
    I think it's a little bit more nuanced than that. I just randomly googled "high school cliques" and this is a list I got:
    1. preps
    2. goths
    3. geeks
    4. band geeks
    5. book worms
    6. math geeks
    7. nerds
    8. punks
    9. skaters
    10. drama people
    11. choir people
    12. "special" people
    13. non-conformists
    14. gangster-type people
    15. tomboys
    16. jocks
    17. grade repeaters
    18. cheerleaders


    All these groups of people simply do not exist at a typical predominantly black high school. You'll always have athletes/jocks, attractive people, and criminals everywhere so those are staple. But the diversity of groups for you to "join" wasn't there, there was very little social stratification. Look at it like this, think of The Breakfast Club that had characters that represent common high school archetypes. I'm not saying these kinds of people didn't exist but they often not distinct and cohesive enough to represent an actual group, to become a clique.

    So for example at my high school, if you wanted to be both black, goth, and listen to death metal, whatever else...that was almost unheard of. I saw and see black goths, but they tend to be in areas where I know the high schools are more mixed race. I was friend's with one black goth kid at my school and he withstood a lot, but he could fight and people left him alone by junior year. It's like you already stand out, but you stand out even more when you do that in a predominantly black environment.

    The fact that that person can exist in a predominantly white high school and that character is popular enough to be recognized as a universal high school social group is a liberty and freedom of expression that is rare in a predominantly black environment. Even if they're fringe, even if they're an outsider, there's a niche that exists for them and the culture is elastic enough to support a group of people who identify. That's what made Steve Urkel so odd and remarkable, because you don't typically see a person like him represented.

    Surprisingly though, my high school was very tolerant towards gay and transgendered teens. Outside of Atlanta, DC is a gay black mecca so I can understand why. I remember we had three F2M trans kids in my class alone. There was a definite gay clique that was immensely popular with everyone. I'm also noticing skateboarding is becoming immensely popular with black kids in my area, I see them all on the subway and hanging out in DC so I guess that's a change.

    We did have an unofficial Baby Mama Club that was quite active. You had to be under 18, have at least two kids by different fathers and one of them had to be in jail. Stringent requirements indeed and yet membership grew every year!
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
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    Social Penetration Theory 2
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  8. #28
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    LOL, someone mentioned Black Urkel. You know who I always thought had it rough? Black LARPers. You know, the ones who dress up for Renaissance Fair.

    So much more I want to reply to in this thread but I keep rambling. So that's all for now.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

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  9. #29
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Black people are much less prone to getting bad acne, and the fact that out culture is so unacceptable of geeky nerdiness means the number of visibly geeky/nerdy types proportionately lower. I've never seen a Steve Urkel among us.
    'Twas a joke. Obviously not al INTPs are male either, or have eyesight problems.
    JiNe
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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  10. #30
    Junior Member jadine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I think it's a little bit more nuanced than that. I just randomly googled "high school cliques" and this is a list I got:
    1. preps
    2. goths
    3. geeks
    4. band geeks
    5. book worms
    6. math geeks
    7. nerds
    8. punks
    9. skaters
    10. drama people
    11. choir people
    12. "special" people
    13. non-conformists
    14. gangster-type people
    15. tomboys
    16. jocks
    17. grade repeaters
    18. cheerleaders


    All these groups of people simply do not exist at a typical predominantly black high school. You'll always have athletes/jocks, attractive people, and criminals everywhere so those are staple. But the diversity of groups for you to "join" wasn't there, there was very little social stratification. Look at it like this, think of The Breakfast Club that had characters that represent common high school archetypes. I'm not saying these kinds of people didn't exist but they often not distinct and cohesive enough to represent an actual group, to become a clique.

    So for example at my high school, if you wanted to be both black, goth, and listen to death metal, whatever else...that was almost unheard of. I saw and see black goths, but they tend to be in areas where I know the high schools are more mixed race. I was friend's with one black goth kid at my school and he withstood a lot, but he could fight and people left him alone by junior year. It's like you already stand out, but you stand out even more when you do that in a predominantly black environment.

    The fact that that person can exist in a predominantly white high school and that character is popular enough to be recognized as a universal high school social group is a liberty and freedom of expression that is rare in a predominantly black environment. Even if they're fringe, even if they're an outsider, there's a niche that exists for them and the culture is elastic enough to support a group of people who identify. That's what made Steve Urkel so odd and remarkable, because you don't typically see a person like him represented.

    Surprisingly though, my high school was very tolerant towards gay and transgendered teens. Outside of Atlanta, DC is a gay black mecca so I can understand why. I remember we had three F2M trans kids in my class alone. There was a definite gay clique that was immensely popular with everyone. I'm also noticing skateboarding is becoming immensely popular with black kids in my area, I see them all on the subway and hanging out in DC so I guess that's a change.

    We did have an unofficial Baby Mama Club that was quite active. You had to be under 18, have at least two kids by different fathers and one of them had to be in jail. Stringent requirements indeed and yet membership grew every year!
    This is my first time posting but I agree with this. I went to a predominantly white high school and they had all the cliques mentioned and then there was the black kids clique. It was difficult to choose between the black kids clique or those in the nerdier spectrum who I could relate to more. It got better as I got older and working in a tech field I do get to meet more black intp's (well i've met one). But when I was younger it was hard. I struggled to relate, black people do seem more SJ especially the girls who were hard on each other. I also think my SJ is more developed than it would have been because of my race.

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