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[NT] INTx and unhealthy Se/Fe

Malcontent

New member
Joined
May 18, 2009
Messages
258
MBTI Type
abcd
I would like to know the intx behaviour when struggled in unhealthy Se/Fe function.

For INTJs, I've read they can have an "animal instinct" due to unhealthy Se. For example Light Yagami's angry outburst or even more the Daniel Plainview's angry violence in "There will be blood".
I would like a confirm about this, and if unhealthy Se can have also different display, because it seems mainly a display of anger.

For INTPs, I've not understood yet what unhealthy Fe does.
I've read INTPs can have emotional outburst, but what it is? They become whiners, dramatical, hysterical puppies? What they do stereotipically? How unhealthy Fe is visible by others? It's more sadness and confusion instead of the intj's anger against the world?

Thanks.
 

Nicodemus

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Aug 2, 2010
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9,756
For INTJs, I've read they can have an "animal instinct" due to unhealthy Se. For example Light Yagami's angry outburst or even more the Daniel Plainview's angry violence in "There will be blood".
I would like a confirm about this, and if unhealthy Se can have also different display, because it seems mainly a display of anger.
I have had such outbursts maybe five times in my entire life. I remember one time in elementary school, I was about seven years old, when two older boys who hardly knew me teased me after school on the way to the bicycle stand. They did not leave me alone until I began to cry and get really furious. Then they ran away. It never happened again. Another time, my younger sister lied to me about something I do not remember now, straight in the face, in spite of my serious insistence that she tell the truth. That made me so angry that I beat her leg blue. If all mental means are exhausted and it is crucial to reach a goal, violence becomes an option, I guess.

I am suspicious of the function theory, so I refrain from commenting on how my behavior might be related to Se.
 

thescientist

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Jul 23, 2009
Messages
254
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w4
Another time, my younger sister lied to me about something I do not remember now, straight in the face, in spite of my serious insistence that she tell the truth. That made me so angry that I beat her leg blue. If all mental means are exhausted and it is crucial to reach a goal, violence becomes an option, I guess.
LOL and this is the very reason why you should NEVER lie to an INTJ. :angry:
 

thescientist

New member
Joined
Jul 23, 2009
Messages
254
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w4
Another time, my younger sister lied to me about something I do not remember now, straight in the face, in spite of my serious insistence that she tell the truth. That made me so angry that I beat her leg blue. If all mental means are exhausted and it is crucial to reach a goal, violence becomes an option, I guess.
LOL and this is the very reason why you should NEVER lie to an INTJ. :angry:
 

Uytuun

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Joined
Apr 19, 2008
Messages
1,633
MBTI Type
nnnn
animal instinct, yeah, hedonism, violence, trance, danger, ecstasy, seduction - it's definitely not just anger, it also needn't be unhealthy :evil:
 

Mr. Sherlock Holmes

Consulting Detective
Joined
Aug 10, 2010
Messages
1,450
MBTI Type
JiNe
Enneagram
5W4
When I am unhealthy and am taken over by my Fe, I become all mushy and sentimental, very anxious, jittery and nervous and blind to obvious logical truths. I may also be very needy. Though I tend to be rather mushy and sentimental in general. Maybe I'm always unhealthy.

I think when I am using unhealthy Fe, I seem to have these two disorders at once, or at least the symptoms thereof.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avoidant_personality_disorder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dependent_personality_disorder

Which is never easy to deal with. I'm glad I am mostly in control with my Ti right now.
 

Andy

Supreme High Commander
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
1,211
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w6
An unhealthy inferior usually shows itself as either a complete distain for the function in question, or bouts of overindulgence in it.

For Se that can mean excesive austerity, refusing all decoration, fine foods and like. Almost a desire to rid oneself of all of all trappings of the material world and instead exist in a state of pure thought. It can't be done, of course, but that's a different discusion. It can also mean over indulgence in physical pleasures, particularly when the person is trying to relax after stress. INTJs are over represented amongst substance abusers, for example.

A third example is simple impulsiveness. THis is often the hardest the spot, as INJs often look under control even when they are tottering o the blink of oblivion. It is often seen as some patient, long term project to achieve some result that makes no sense at all. Hannibal Lecture shows this sort of inferior function, with his carefully planned crimes that serve no function except top fuel his need to experience new things. They aren't always so extreme of course. As a child I used to build card houses just so that I could knock them down again. I'd expreiment with different designs to see which were the toughest and demolish them by throwing rubbers a them, but watching them hit the ground was definitely part of the pleasure!
 

Mephistopheles

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Sep 29, 2010
Messages
160
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
6w5
As someone with borderline personality disorder, Fe can make me doing extremely different things (usually only for a short amount of time);
- get depressed/get self-esteem issues because of very slight issues (f.e., somebody is laughing near me and I didn't heard WHY, so I automatically assume he/ she laughed about me ; I know, it sounds ridiculous( in fact, it IS ridiculous^^), but that's why it's called UNHEALTHY Fe) or even completely out of the blue
- get extremely outgoing, party-loving
-liking/loving people I usually don't really recognize or even hate
-hating people I usually like
-being blunt, flashy, etc.
-writing extremely personal informations in an internet forum although I barely know anyone and it's pretty probably that they will just react irritated/baffled
-showing risky or even suicidal behaviour(running on a balustrade multiple storeys high; staying on a railroad and going down only a few seconds before the train comes, while grining insane etc.)
-manipulate other people
-extreme nervousness
-Loud aggressiveness
-megalomania

and some other things that just don't come to my mind in the moment.

I usually jump between exactly opposite moods. Important is that I never do such things when I'm alone; I always have to interact with people in any way to behave like this.
 

Andy

Supreme High Commander
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
1,211
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w6
As someone with borderline personality disorder, Fe can make me doing extremely different things (usually only for a short amount of time);
- get depressed/get self-esteem issues because of very slight issues (f.e., somebody is laughing near me and I didn't heard WHY, so I automatically assume he/ she laughed about me ; I know, it sounds ridiculous( in fact, it IS ridiculous^^), but that's why it's called UNHEALTHY Fe) or even completely out of the blue
- get extremely outgoing, party-loving
-liking/loving people I usually don't really recognize or even hate
-hating people I usually like
-being blunt, flashy, etc.
-writing extremely personal informations in an internet forum although I barely know anyone and it's pretty probably that they will just react irritated/baffled
-showing risky or even suicidal behaviour(running on a balustrade multiple storeys high; staying on a railroad and going down only a few seconds before the train comes, while grining insane etc.)
-manipulate other people
-extreme nervousness
-Loud aggressiveness
-megalomania

and some other things that just don't come to my mind in the moment.

I usually jump between exactly opposite moods. Important is that I never do such things when I'm alone; I always have to interact with people in any way to behave like this.

I've seen ITPs do obsesiveness as well, were they get fixated on some unfortunate soul. It was an unlucky girl inthe case I saw.
 

JocktheMotie

Habitual Fi LineStepper
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
8,491
Inferior Fe tends to manifest itself as having problems assimilating and finding where one fits into groups, poor awareness of how one is socially perceived, an inability to change that perception in a way that's desired, poor ability to express emotion and "how to make them work for you," and an inability to accept ethical considerations as adequate criteria for decision making. Can emerge as poorly controlled outbursts of defensive emotion [often w4s], or passive indifference to the emotional needs of others and the environment [often w6s].
 

hilo

New member
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Messages
186
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9 sx
Inferior Fe tends to manifest itself as having problems assimilating and finding where one fits into groups, poor awareness of how one is socially perceived, an inability to change that perception in a way that's desired, poor ability to express emotion and "how to make them work for you," and an inability to accept ethical considerations as adequate criteria for decision making. Can emerge as poorly controlled outbursts of defensive emotion [often w4s], or passive indifference to the emotional needs of others and the environment [often w6s].

I wonder how much this is colored by E-type? Or maybe I'm having trouble recognizing this because it is, after all, my inferior.
Poor ability to express emotion seems more like what happens when Fe gets blocked, but maybe that qualifies under the "overindulgence/extreme neglect" rule.

I can get into a bad Ne-Fe combination sometimes and imagine all kinds of things about emotional states of others that is basically amplified noise.

I don't think I've ever had an emotional "outburst", but I have cried a lot after breakups, I guess that is closest.

When angry I get... tactical. I will destroy you. The angrier I get the more serious, quiet, and intent I get. I think this could be an E-9 thing, being pushed to the point of finally a) acknowledging anger and b) acting on it.
 

Nicodemus

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Aug 2, 2010
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LOL and this is the very reason why you should NEVER lie to an INTJ. :angry:
Only don't tell me that you're innocent. Because it insults my intelligence and it makes me very angry. Now, who approached you first? Barzini or Tattalgia?
 

Mephistopheles

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Sep 29, 2010
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160
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ENTP
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6w5
I've seen ITPs do obsesiveness as well, were they get fixated on some unfortunate soul. It was an unlucky girl inthe case I saw.

Yeah, a friend of mine was still in love 3 years after breakup although they didn't talked or made anything together this time and although he were only 16 years old and tried to get together with her again. He immediately got the mitten. Imho, it's very unfortunate for both. But I don't think he is a INT, rather IST(he is a pretty good artist). It's imho one of the worst social malfunctions. It can turn your whole life depressive.
 
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