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[INTP] INTP Breakdown's

R

ReflecTcelfeR

Guest
I think INTPs can give themselves the illusion that everything is a system to be figured out. That if we work at something from just the right angle, we'll crack the code, and figure out how everything works. This mindset serves us well in many areas, but it doesn't serve us very well in our interactions or in our growth as people. People, including ourselves, aren't problems to fix. It's exhausting to take on the world as a system we have the responsibility of streamlining. Never needing or asking for help or emotional support, because we seldom recognize that we need it. Hence the semi-regular breakdowns. I definitely have them every few years, and rarely see them coming. It's a lesson I have to learn and re-learn, but I'm getting better at realizing I can't do everything, and that it's okay to need help and to lean on others. It's even okay to talk about *gasp* feelings. I'm going to pretend I didn't just say that. :-D

Yes. This. Though this creates a seperate (though not completely unrelated to this topic) situation. Not many people understand this (your above statement) because of how 'unemotional' I am and so when I do struggle they believe that I'll find my way out of it... even though that is the very problem I'm having. I suppose I just need to give up that pride and ask for it, help that is. I guess my problem is finding that embarrasing :shrug:.

It may be the feeling. "If I can't do what I'm suppose to be able to do best i.e. understanding and solving, then what can I do?" Hm, that sounds like an aspect of depression doesn't it?
 

Tallulah

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Feb 19, 2008
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6,009
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Yes. This. Though this creates a seperate (though not completely unrelated to this topic) situation. Not many people understand this (your above statement) because of how 'unemotional' I am and so when I do struggle they believe that I'll find my way out of it... even though that is the very problem I'm having. I suppose I just need to give up that pride and ask for it, help that is. I guess my problem is finding that embarrasing :shrug:.

It may be the feeling. "If I can't do what I'm suppose to be able to do best i.e. understanding and solving, then what can I do?" Hm, that sounds like an aspect of depression doesn't it?

Yeah, I find in my case it does create a depression cycle, and when it gets bad enough, the need for help trumps the need to appear like I don't need it. It kind of humbles me enough to reach out. I wish it didn't have to get to that point, though. I'm working on that.

I think part of it is being a little more understanding with yourself, too, and realizing that you're not a failure if you do need help. That there is literally no one in the world that is able to do everything perfectly on their own. We sometimes have unrealistic expectations of ourselves.
 
R

ReflecTcelfeR

Guest
Indeed! Interestingly enough I watched a movie today about Hinduism. And a famous (recent as well) Guru named Amma. It was insightful. When I wasn't trying to reason the miracles that occured away. I was struck by her speaking about the 'ego' that keeps us (humans) away from enlightenment. To most this idea of giving up individuality is completely backwards in our thinking. The individuality is what keeps us in our pits of circular depression though, and so, in my opinion, that is a good ultimate goal to have.
 

Salomé

meh
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Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,527
MBTI Type
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Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I'm burning the candle at both ends, or rather I'm just sticking the whole thing into the fire. So. I will pick just a few things/people and focus me energies. I appreciate the insight.
Get some sleep. Seriously, sleep is the answer to all of life's problems. :)

It's hard for me to see the point in putting all of this effort into something so superfical. I just want to be able to walk up to a girl and say "Hey, you wanna do somethin'?" and her say "That's fine." The simplicity of the scenario makes me smile.
Relationships are only superficial with superficial people.
Everything worthwhile takes effort and that includes putting aside your (the INTP) default dismissive attitude towards others.

Yeah, I find in my case it does create a depression cycle, and when it gets bad enough, the need for help trumps the need to appear like I don't need it. It kind of humbles me enough to reach out. I wish it didn't have to get to that point, though. I'm working on that.
Perhaps depression is the way we teach ourselves this most important lesson?
 
R

ReflecTcelfeR

Guest
Get some sleep. Seriously, sleep is the answer to all of life's problems. :)

Relationships are only superficial with superficial people.
Everything worthwhile takes effort and that includes putting aside your (the INTP) default dismissive attitude towards others.


Perhaps depression is the way we teach ourselves this most important lesson?

I suppose I have been starting to use this as a tool for/of pity. I said I never would... In review I used a word I never should have. Thank you.

P.S. I did sleep wonderful last night. :D
 

JDG26

New member
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Messages
47
MBTI Type
INTP
I think INTPs can give themselves the illusion that everything is a system to be figured out. That if we work at something from just the right angle, we'll crack the code, and figure out how everything works. This mindset serves us well in many areas, but it doesn't serve us very well in our interactions or in our growth as people. People, including ourselves, aren't problems to fix. It's exhausting to take on the world as a system we have the responsibility of streamlining. Never needing or asking for help or emotional support, because we seldom recognize that we need it. Hence the semi-regular breakdowns. I definitely have them every few years, and rarely see them coming. It's a lesson I have to learn and re-learn, but I'm getting better at realizing I can't do everything, and that it's okay to need help and to lean on others. It's even okay to talk about *gasp* feelings. I'm going to pretend I didn't just say that. :-D

Well stated! INTPs tend to internalize emotion and we can break when we are not in a supportive, intellectually stimulating, environment.
 

Redbone

Orisha
Joined
Apr 27, 2010
Messages
2,882
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I think INTPs can give themselves the illusion that everything is a system to be figured out. That if we work at something from just the right angle, we'll crack the code, and figure out how everything works. This mindset serves us well in many areas, but it doesn't serve us very well in our interactions or in our growth as people. People, including ourselves, aren't problems to fix. It's exhausting to take on the world as a system we have the responsibility of streamlining. Never needing or asking for help or emotional support, because we seldom recognize that we need it. Hence the semi-regular breakdowns. I definitely have them every few years, and rarely see them coming. It's a lesson I have to learn and re-learn, but I'm getting better at realizing I can't do everything, and that it's okay to need help and to lean on others. It's even okay to talk about *gasp* feelings. I'm going to pretend I didn't just say that. :-D

I think this is one of the most beneficial things I've ever read on this forum.
 

INTPness

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Jan 22, 2009
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This thread reminds me of a biblical Scipture. The first part of Proverbs 29:18 says, "Where there is no vision, the people perish..."

Without something to tend to, or put one's energy into, or set out to accomplish with all of one's efforts - a vision of "what it is you are to accomplish in this life", then the "will" dies. The "fight" inside of you, the zest, fades away because there is nothing to go after, nothing to do with one's time but float around aimlessly.
 

Tecla

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Jan 10, 2010
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43
MBTI Type
INTP
I had a complete breakdown about 7 months ago. It was a combination of not properly dealing with being stabbed , thinking I've figured out the world( and being depressed about what I saw), and feeling absolutely trapped by being in the military. I allowed myself to become so miserable for months on end that I eventually became suicidal. Of course I didn't express this to anyone. It wasn't until I planned and intended to actually do it before I sought help. It ended up with a nice week in a psychiatric ward, which turned out to be a good experience. I was lucky enough to find a therapist that I instantly clicked with and he helped me immensely.

I guess my point to this is don't allow yourself to spiral down into deep depression. A few days won't hurt, but going unchecked for months can lead to a nasty state of mind. Don't be afraid to ask for help, sometimes a reality check and different perspective can make a huge difference.
 

ScorpioINTP

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346
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6-5
I don't know exactly what I'm experiencing right now, only that it does not seem 'right'. I just feel like shutting the entire world out so I don't have to care anymore, or pretend to care. I'm cracking under the pressures that this society has created. Have any INTP's felt this way? What did you find it meaning, and how did you fix it? Perhaps this is explained better through enneagram?

I know this is an old post, but I am new...so My $.02. I know how you feel. I Feel this way often.

I think and analyze too much for my own good. I feel like I don't fit into society's roles and norms (despite looking/acting fairly normal). The petty and shallow ways in which we all judge each other is sickening. I feel discriminated against for being different, for being introverted, for not being married, for not having kids etc. I don't fit into any one "type" or genre. I generally get along with most people, but I don't click with many on a deeper level and often when I do that person shuts themself off from me or cuts off communication due to their own issues in life (I am going through that recently). It only serves to make you feel more alone...finding real true friends is futile it seems....I guess that was one of my wishes for coming here...unrealistic as it may be.

When you look at the political, banking, monetary systems (and inherent corruption) and our unsustainable way of living in the US you just wonder when it is all going to implode and wonder to yourself "why bother?". Or perhaps the inevitable asteroid impact or other cataclysm. Well that is definitely irrational I know, but you can't help wondering that the end is getting close. Especially when you click the channel and every other channel is talking about 1)Justin Bieber, 2) Kim Kardashian 3)Sarah Palin like any of them are relevant...meanwhile wealth/power is being consolidated into fewer and fewer hands behind the charade.

The deeper you analyze our social structure and who is in control and how little control you have over anything the darker it looks and more helpless you feel.

I feel very alone lately. I feel like no one I care about wants anything to do with me, save for my dogs. The only person who does (my father) merely wants to control and manipulate me while I am down and I want nothing to do with him for the most part. I can't figure out what to do with my life and it pisses me off. I have no one to support me in that either who is objective. I moved to a new city with my GF and 3 mos later (after buying a house together) she wants to split up. So not only am I alone, but alone in a new place and without a job and a mortgage. See, it could be worse!

Well I need to shut up....This is stupid. Sorry for the rant.
 

stormyapril

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Mar 17, 2008
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8
The deeper you analyze our social structure and who is in control and how little control you have over anything the darker it looks and more helpless you feel.

Ti is so inherently lonely - I know I can spend too much time analyzing to this point above as well. I have many INTP friends and this thread has helped me understand much better how to be helpful to them.

I understand the Ti and the darkness it can create - but I also know that I am not tied to it as strongly - I have felt like like i throw my INTP freinds a lifeline frequently by reminding them that people systems are usually broken and likely to cause chaos and havoc, but never understood why this helped. I usually start with this truth (most singular I have found for humans) and start making fun of it and trot happly into NE land via sarcasm.

It is bizarre for me to see the INTP i know who are so capable and amazing at analysis get stuck - from what I have observed of INTP externally - it truly is the blind spot of not understanding how connections with people can be beneficial and counter this Ti paralysis

We E's must seem flippant most of the time - now I know to tone it down a bit on during times like this
 

ScorpioINTP

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Someone posted eloquently elsewhere recently...but some of it I think stems from us INTPs being afraid or not knowing how to ask for support or help. I can't decide what to do with my life and finding a job without networking is futile and never leads to something rewarding. I analyze the whole networking thing to death and feel like I am just playing a transparent game and people would see right through it....well that and I don't fucking know anyone anymore. I lost connections with everyone I ever knew basically. Often through moves (by choice or famiily).

I/we have this stubbornness to prove we can be independent and succeed on our own merit in a just world (that doesn't actually exist). I truly do treasure human connections, but I've lost everyone who I was ever close to and the cycle keeps repeating itself. I somehow drive people away or just choose poorly. Trying to start over in your 40s and make those life long friends when you are single and childless is very frustrating. My family (whats left) are absolute complete opposites of me and drive me nuts. The ones I was close to have passed.
 

stormyapril

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Well, even i am in a huge cluster of a system where I work that really does drive people to counseling/psychotherapeutic drugs to survive (especially the tortured ENFP). The best thing I did is that ever time I felt the Ti reminding me that ass kissing and broken systems were going to make the place fail, I would get online and submit my resume.

Here is what happed today - My Ti blew up/warped into Fi:

HTML:
http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31759&page=97

Yeah - when you are always different AND outspoken AND usually able to easily identify what is broken (ENTP/INTP/ENFP/INFJ) - turns out most folks in charge/or afraid of change get annoyed with the animals on the farm who remember what the last set of rules were and why.

To counter this behavior concerning systems/leadership/unhealthy situations - I decided that we (all people minus the staid and reliable ISTJ) need a change every 2-3 years. A complete reset would be best (new system, environment). If nothing else for those of us with a lot of TI - it gives a new beast to tear apart. I am still too young to be completely jaded by how wrong most people usually are to stop suggesting better ways to improve how life works (Ne-ti). Until I am not so idealistic (jaded enough) I have decided to "tour" other systems and learn at a meta level what works/doesn't work and build this uber structure. Someday, I hope(?), this uber structure will yield enough data to know which lever to pull if I ever am and willing to be officially in charge...

After working for a crazy (but fun) ENFP, i have realized that while it makes no sense that an idiot can be seen as competent, it happens all the time and the biggest difference between us (Ti) and them (Te) is their willingness to make bold statements of how convicted they are of being 1) right (even if proven wrong in the next second) 2)In charge - because someone should be 3)because they have the ability to make blanket statements of their rightness (see 1) they are the people in charge (see 2).

OK - enough rambling - That last paragraph is so circular (but painfully real) that I start laughing automatically now. Spent 1 yr being pissed - Didn't do a thing so now here I go - La La La - off to new horizons. At some point, I am pretty sure we all (ENTP and INTP) develop enough Fe to be bearable and our sarcasm fades from being pointed to funny - so I am betting on this and until I am not SO WEIRD - running away to learn more and be entertained by lunacy!
 

stormyapril

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63
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ENTP
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8
As a follow up - competency will always speak for itself. It is hard for me to "boast/brag" - probably not typical for an E, but that is what networking truly is. I think that one strength the INTP have above all else is their personal (usually validated through real deliverables) awareness of their capability. In the end - the job is about trading money for skills and INTP have no shortage of skills.

If that is enough Ti proof, then networking based on talking about your strengths should come easily. Not sure what field you are in, but i have met many INTP science/engineer that were hired because that is all that needs to be proven -

company - are you good at what you do?

for INTP, this is not usually an issue

I have read the EQ (emotional intelligence) stuff a lot, but I have not bought in EQ is as important as they want it to be, especially in technical fields. Some people DONT need to know how to smooze and give eloquent presentations

We are not all robots to be finely tuned to the same polished type of gem. There is a reason we end up in different fields. I Just wish this was seen as the strength that it is for groups and not something to be normalized away

-Clarification - I don't think that all INTP fall into the low EQ end of the scale - I do think that it takes a lot of energy to do this though
 
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