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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    I have one question:

    So far, I only saw INTPs using irony one way, I mean, only to inflate their already vastly overrated egos... Just like a 12 years old child would do.

    But could it be possible that mature INTPs would learn to use irony the other way, I mean self-deprecating humor, TRUE irony, made to deflate their heads and face the real world instead?

    ---

    Anyway. Here is my impression of my two days vacation on INTP central:

    YouTube - Monty Python - Job Interview

    But I have to confess, I secretly enjoyed their attemps to humiliate me or any foreigner. Does that make me a pervert?
    Whip and handcuffs, please...
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    Maybe it's self-deprecating irony after all...

    The INTPs will never know how it feels to be chronically happy and at peace with yourself, so that makes the ENFPs the paragon of everything they'd aspire to be, one day...
    How tragic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    And I don't think you INTP's have a "wacky" sense of humor.

    British nonsense, cold sophisticated humor rather look ENTP. Check the Monty Pythons, for instance...

    IMHO, the way INTP's express themselves rather looks close to South Park: crude, puerile, childish, and sometimes genuinely hilarious (But I could be wrong...).
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    No. The immature teens who are rampaging INTP-central are victims somehow, it's not their fault. Everybody hate them (sometimes with good reasons, alas... ), and they hugely suffer in daily life because of their social awkwardness. They are mean because people are mean with them, it's a defensive response. And the vocal minority on INTP-central is not very clever nor subtle, they would be banned everywhere else (they are very young). Indeed, their kind of humor is very close to South Park, very gremlin-like, very primitive.

    No, what I would really enjoy, would be to find healthy INTPs instead, INTPs who would have grown-up and really trained their intelligence and knowledges. INTPs who would prove how deeply interesting this type can be.

    Some of my close friends are like that, so I know this is possible. We all know INTPs like that (whether friends, lovers, siblings or parents), so let's offer them a space to socially interact!
    I shall quote my friend the Mad Rabbit: Shut The Fuck Up.

  2. #242
    Junior Member BrianBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skip View Post
    I also like Conan O'Brien, and even Eric McCormack (in the W&G outtakes). They're both intelligent people with impressively quick wits.
    I also really like Conan O'Brien.

  3. #243
    Senior Member Oso Mocoso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    But I have to confess, I secretly enjoyed their attemps to humiliate me or any foreigner. Does that make me a pervert?
    Maybe, but it was definitely kind of creepy. And it showed that you massively misunderstood what was happening.

    What you perceived as an attempt to humiliate you was anything but ... at first. You just reacted wrong in the beginning. What you saw as an attack was more an invitation to play. If you'd reacted like you understood the playful nature of the jibes, people would have continued playing with you and grown to like you. But instead, you reacted like you were taking things at face value. Which just means you did not understand the culture you were interacting with.

    All I can really offer you is the notion that INTPc has a somewhat high context culture. You seemed to expect people to mean precisely what they were saying, and to spell everything out to you. That's not going to work over there.

    I'd like to recommend an author to you. Geert Hofstede. He did a study of culture within IBM, and his take on cultural context might make sense to you.
    You seem like a decent person, but your reaction to people at INTPc was all wrong, and the conclusions you drew from your time there are incredibly inaccurate from the point of view of someone who is "native" to that forum.

    There were a couple of times I tried to throw you a lifeline, but you didn't grab hold. You seemed to comprehend that I was joking with you, but you didn't change your reaction to the forum in general.

  4. #244
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seanan View Post
    Very odd indeed. Irl, I'm seen as cerebral and rather harshly criticized for it. People get really creative coming up with ways to attack "who" I am.... and yet they want to be like me? I'm not sure this is the reason. So maybe you're saying they don't really want to be like me... just appear to be. I have found it amazing how many INTPs there appear to be on the pertinent groups when their numbers in the population is supposed to be so small.... so still mulling this over. I was interested when someone said a mature INTP is the hardest to guess the type of. Maybe if there were more of those the picture would become clearer.
    Zing!

    What Are you trying to say?

    Agreed though. Mind you I also find INTPs, mature or otherwise, the hardest to figure out especially when thinking of motives. I've often misread an INTPs intentions.. basically it seems the type is want to not give out enough information.

    Perhaps that should go in the advice thread? "Try, on occasion, being straight forward in speech and motivation."
    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I don't know what type Cleese is, but I think the Python humor definitely appeals to the INTP personality, as does Blackadder. It's silly, yet extremely clever.

    I think MST3K is very INTP-like humor. I'd be surprised if those guys weren't mostly INTPs.
    I'm not so sure myself. Sure the humour is intelligent but it always seems to be too silly. I prefer not to make a show of myself and may well wince even if it's someone else making an ass of themselves. There again, thinking about it, I did enjoy 'Bevis and Butthead Do America', which is hardly high brow or particularly dry.

    I guess it's like music, I never like all of the stuff by one artist. I prefer a mix.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oso Mocoso View Post
    Maybe, but it was definitely kind of creepy. And it showed that you massively misunderstood what was happening.

    What you perceived as an attempt to humiliate you was anything but ... at first. You just reacted wrong in the beginning. What you saw as an attack was more an invitation to play. If you'd reacted like you understood the playful nature of the jibes, people would have continued playing with you and grown to like you. But instead, you reacted like you were taking things at face value. Which just means you did not understand the culture you were interacting with.

    All I can really offer you is the notion that INTPc has a somewhat high context culture. You seemed to expect people to mean precisely what they were saying, and to spell everything out to you. That's not going to work over there.

    I'd like to recommend an author to you. Geert Hofstede. He did a study of culture within IBM, and his take on cultural context might make sense to you.
    You seem like a decent person, but your reaction to people at INTPc was all wrong, and the conclusions you drew from your time there are incredibly inaccurate from the point of view of someone who is "native" to that forum.

    There were a couple of times I tried to throw you a lifeline, but you didn't grab hold. You seemed to comprehend that I was joking with you, but you didn't change your reaction to the forum in general.
    Okay this is taking one piece out of context but I recall bemusement at people who thought that INTPc was closed off to people.

    Btw, it's not really highly contextual when it requires you to have foreknowledge of the place on first contact.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  5. #245
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oso Mocoso View Post
    There were a couple of times I tried to throw you a lifeline, but you didn't grab hold. You seemed to comprehend that I was joking with you, but you didn't change your reaction to the forum in general.
    Well, I fear this is not the topic to answer that, but I'll try to make it short.

    You said I obviously comprehended, but why did I not change? There is a contradiction, isn't it?

    I was tempted to mirror the attitude I saw on INTP-c, I could have done that quite easily. But instead, I chose another way, since most of you were rather predictable. I tried something you weren't accustomed at all, just to create some variety, some new flavor. I like paradoxes or contradictory sentences, remember?

    It seems you didn't understand what I was doing. Only a few managed to guess it, and it was quite a surprise for them when they fully realized it (Take Tiamat, for instance).

    The clues were there, right in front of you, right below your nose. It's a bit like Kiekergaard's anecdote about the philosopher who was looking for his glasses everywhere, when in fact he was wearing them.
    Yet however obvious, it's quite subtle.

    Love and Hate, it sounds so similar
    I only try to understand my dark side.
    But let's say I deserved it anyway.
    I prefer self-humiliation.
    (the divine pleasure of self-humiliation...)
    -He'll come again with his chronically happy grin...-
    I decided to play it fair. It's even funnier that way, isn't it?
    My true goal is to stay as boring as possible.
    I'm not here only to play your games (even if I enjoy them), you are also here to play mines.
    Ambiguity.
    This is even funnier to see unbelievers when you're simply telling them the truth, and observe their confused reactions.


    And eventually, the link I provided you.
    Master-slave dialectic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    There was no possible winners, I was "anti-competitive".

    And here is somebody who was quite close close to understand something, but couldn't make the jump: "so, for you, the viewer, i'd like to point out that i, an NT, would not feel the need to go around saying shit like this and the things said by this person on this forum. why? because it's stupid as hell, not to mention completely unproductive. there's a reason why the fox doesn't send a heads-up telegram saying, "i have a reputation of fooling you! stop. i'll be there at dusk. stop." before he goes charging in. "

    It's always fun to meta-trick the trickters.


    ---

    PS: I'm aware of Hofstede's works, but I do not agree with many of his theories.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  6. #246
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Of course. We just didn't get you. You were far too clever for us.

    Also, we're getting our senses of humor criticized by the guy from France?

  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post

    Agreed though. Mind you I also find INTPs, mature or otherwise, the hardest to figure out especially when thinking of motives. I've often misread an INTPs intentions.. basically it seems the type is want to not give out enough information.

    Perhaps that should go in the advice thread? "Try, on occasion, being straight forward in speech and motivation."
    Surely you jest! Moi? Not enough info? Last time I checked, I gave too much. I'm gonna give you so much sheit, fillin, backup, on and on... in an "awe, please understand me".... that you'll be scratching right down to your bare skull.

    But, you have, in fact, enlightened me... okay, I'll try to just spit it out and then cover the questions later instead of predetermining them.

  8. #248
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    Of course. We just didn't get you. You were far too clever for us.
    I didn't say that. I never pretended to be cleverer than you are, or else it wouldn't be "self-humiliating" irony, right?

    It's not the place to discuss that, anyway. This topic is called "The INTP appreciation thread", not "Blackmail's trollbox".
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

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  9. #249
    Senior Member edel weiss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    It's not the place to discuss that, anyway. This topic is called "The INTP appreciation thread", not "Blackmail's trollbox".
    True, true.

    I like INTP's. They're dark, cynical, brooding, and they 'get' my humour. They write funny things. They either indulge in egoistic humour or self deprecating humour, depending on their mood. Rather pessimistic.

    I'm very fond of INTP's, but I wouldn't want to be one.

  10. #250
    Senior Member Oso Mocoso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    I tried something you weren't accustomed at all, just to create some variety, some new flavor. I like paradoxes or contradictory sentences, remember?
    See, new flavor is welcome, but there's a caveat - it needs to be an interesting or good new flavor.

    It seems you didn't understand what I was doing. Only a few managed to guess it, and it was quite a surprise for them when they fully realized it (Take Tiamat, for instance).
    Just because I thought what you were doing was annoying and I wished you would stop doing it, you assumed I didn't understand? There is a flaw in your reasoning.

    <snip>

    And eventually, the link I provided you.
    Master-slave dialectic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Yes, that's awful. Please stop. Really, really awful. Please stop. I'm serious.
    I'd like to have a conversation with you, but it's not going to be that conversation.

    There was no possible winners, I was "anti-competitive".
    Oh, I think there was a loser.

    PS: I'm aware of Hofstede's works, but I do not agree with many of his theories.
    That's too bad. If you wanted to get along over there, you might learn something from Hofstede. You said stuff about wishing you could discuss philosophy with SolitaryWalker on INTPC, and now I think any thread you enter over there will just be all about your reputation following you. Maybe if you give it some time.

    Oh, and to get back on topic. Some of my best friends are INTPs.

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