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View Poll Results: Who's more close-minded?

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  • NTJs?

    73 83.91%
  • NTPs?

    14 16.09%
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  1. #101
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    I'm obviously biased being a hardcore NP myself, but I honestly don't know how to answer this question.

    *thinks*

    I've been more acquainted with NTPs than NTJs in my life.

    I know I tend to feel more comfortable with Ps, in general.

    Ne is such an open, expansive function, it seeks out new stimuli to store in its proverbial Ti/Si or Fi/Si bank, so I would surmise that ENTPs are the most open-minded of the the NTs.

    Now, with NTJs, they've got Ni + Te, or Te+ Ni, plus the Fi, I think that INTJs tend to think they are always right, that they know better than all, or most, although the mature ones will quietly acquire new information that they previously did not know.

    Ti, my my, Ti, what a linear labyrinth of a function, Ti + Ne, I dunno, Ti doms have a focus, or focuses, and they like to well, focus on what they care about, but I've found when you discuss new "outside" (to them) information with them, that they will gladly, if they find it interesting, soak it in, but, I dunno, what you tell them either needs to be simply factual, or in the case of when it's a theory in order for them to "accept" it, it needs to make sense to them, if something seems/sounds fishy to them, they will stop you in your tracks and lacerate whatever you're trying to tell them and illuminate all the holes that are missing to the theory.

    One thing I know about Ti as a function is this...

    Goddamn, is it THOROUGH, painstakingly so.

    I have benefited a lot by being "trained" by Ti friends/teachers, I'm comfortable with gaps, they aren't, I'm comfortable with loose strings, I don't think they are, I could be wrong, though. :confused:

    Now, regarding NTJs, I think that they can be INCREDIBLY open-minded when they've reached a level of intellectual and personal maturity where they understand that they do not know all, that others have insights and info to offer, that this doesn't threaten their intellect but rather facilitates it and fosters it to GROW.



    I know a lovely ENTJ.

    We talk about a lot of things, granted, objectively, like IQ-wise, I am significantly smarter than he is, not by a landslide but still, and he seems to have NO PROBLEM AT ALL with my intellect, my offerings of opinions, insights, ideas, he actually loves to hear them.

    One of the better male listeners I've ever known.

    But, he's special in that, despite the fact he is an ETJ, he is constantly yearning to learn new things, gain more experience, understand life better. He's lovely.

    However, oy vey, he DOES NOT LIKE, rather, HE HATES when I give him advice regarding his non-existent love life.



    At this point, I've just accepted it's a sore subject for him so I don't even bring it up anymore.

    Actually, now that I think about it, NTJs don't respond well to advice, at least in my experience.

    Is it an "I don't need you help thing?"

    I dunno, it could also be a guy thing, but Js especially, just don't seem to like being in the position for having to be "mentored" or simply want or think they can figure out their problems themselves, I dunno.

    NPs, or Ps, in general, however, respond pretty damn well to advice, eh, ITPs can be some stubborn ass mofos though, but all in all, I have found that NPs, NTPs included, seem to respond better to advice, I don't know if that correlates with open-mindedness, but it's certainly an observation I've noticed/experienced.

    `
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  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    But, he's special in that, despite the fact he is a ETJ, he is constantly yearning to learn new things, gain more experience, understand life better.
    That's an awfully presumptuous and downtrodden view of ETJs...

    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    However, oy vey, he DOES NOT LIKE, rather, HE HATES when I give him advice regarding his non-existent love life.



    At this point, I've just accepted it's a sore subject for him so I don't even bring it up anymore.

    Actually, now that I think about it, NTJs don't respond well to advice, at least in my experience.

    Is it an "I don't need you help thing?"

    I dunno, it could also be a guy thing, but Js especially, just don't seem to like being in the position for having to be "mentored" or simply want or think they can figure out their problems themselves, I dunno.

    NPs, or Ps, in general, however, respond pretty damn well to advice, eh, ITPs can be some stubborn ass mofos though, but all in all, I have found that NPs, NTPs included, seem to respond better to advice, I don't know if that correlates with open-mindedness, but it's certainly an observation I've noticed/experienced.
    Perhaps, as an NP yourself, your advice is more applicable to NPs...

    NP advice for an NJ might just not be that useful...

  3. #103
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    That's an awfully presumptuous and downtrodden view of ETJs...
    I guess I was thinking of ESTJs, in general, but you are right, it was presumptuous and insulting for me to state that, my bad.

    Sorry ETJs.



    (My sis is an ESTJ and she's well, we don't get along :P)


    Perhaps, as an NP yourself, your advice is more applicable to NPs...
    That would make sense.



    NP advice for an NJ might just not be that useful...
    Elaborate, preeze.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

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  4. #104
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Maybe that's it, you mentioned advice not being *useful*

    That's very Te, no?

    I think that getting different perspectives from intelligent folks is "useful" as it lends for personal growth.

    Hmm, I wonder if Ps are more prone to willingly go to therapy than Js.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  5. #105
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    FJs would be different, I think of all the types, Fs would be the most likely to seek and approve and like therapy.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Maybe that's it, you mentioned advice not being *useful*

    That's very Te, no?
    Not my point.

    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    I think that getting different perspectives from intelligent folks is "useful" as it lends for personal growth.
    True but...

    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Elaborate, preeze.

    Seeing as how you don't necessarily understand things from the J's perspective, your advice really just might not be helpful, useful, or applicable to their situation, as, you don't really know how it is they function, what it is they go through, and, thus, what it is they need.

    In other words, your advice might be much more helpful, useful, and applicable for a P, as you are more similar to them.

    But for a J, well, it just might not be.

    I'm not saying this is necessarily the case, but it is one possible explanation.

  7. #107
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    NPs, or Ps, in general, however, respond pretty damn well to advice, eh, ITPs can be some stubborn ass mofos though, but all in all, I have found that NPs, NTPs included, seem to respond better to advice, I don't know if that correlates with open-mindedness, but it's certainly an observation I've noticed/experienced.

    my infp friend hates when i(or someone else) try to give him advice on how to get his life together, even tho he knows that im right and he has no idea.. only thing that seems to work(atleast for a while) is when our entp friend makes him cry by saying that he will have and heart attack in two years and making bets about that with our intj friend in a rather rude way in front of the poor guy.
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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Not sure if you read these two posts earlier...

    So then how about the fact that INTPs under the MBTI definition of "judging" are in fact Socionic's INTjs?

    If you take both methodologies into account, the labeling would look something like this:

    ENTJj
    INTJp
    INTPj
    ENTPp

    I think, based on this "combined" labeling system, that incorporates both Socionic's and MBTI's methodology for labeling "judging" and "perceiving", the more J/j one has, the more one would generally be considered "close-minded" by his or her peers.
    That sounds about right, though I dislike thinking about commie MBTI. /INTP

  9. #109
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    So then how about the fact that INTPs under the MBTI definition of "judging" are in fact Socionic's INTjs?
    socionics labels J/P based on the first function, not how person deals with the external world like mbti. so socionics intj wouldnt be as judging towards others and their ideas like mbti intj would, thats why the socionics labeling on t/j is totally retarded imo
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  10. #110
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    Why is this thrad still open?

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