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  1. #51
    Senior Member Oeufa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robopop View Post
    Why all the introvert hate? Are introverts inferior, introverts can't be confident, BS.
    Agreed. I'm definitely an I but I am very chatty and confident when I'm interested in the matter at hand.
    Ti>Ne>Si>Te>Fi>Ni>Se=Fe

    And yes, there are such things as INTPs who overuse emoticons

  2. #52
    ReflecTcelfeR
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    I was extremely undecisive, then I realized that I wasn't and now I'm an ENTP. It just comes with interaction with your environment. You can try to analyze yourself alone, but the environment is the ultimate tester.

  3. #53
    Senior Member copperfish17's Avatar
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    Hey, I wasn't sure either, until I realized I only left the house for the purpose of hanging out with some friends only ONCE this entire summer.
    Enneagram: 5w4 5-9-2 (5w4 9w1 2w1) sp/so

    "Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience." - Greg King
    The worst mistake people make in political arguments is assuming that the other side is not trying to do the right thing. This simple oversight makes productive conversation nearly impossible.

  4. #54
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    - do you, generally, throw ideas out there, while it is still forming in your head, to flesh it out more, through say, dialogue with others [external input]? Or do you think through you ideas on your own, reaching a conclusion you're satisfied with, then release it to the world? INTPs also like to bounce ideas off others too, but, comparatively speaking, and ENTP woud do it, even before they've truly got a handle on the idea themselves, while an INTP would likely want some kind of a "hold" on the idea, before throwing it out there.

    - does the "answer" come to you before you can even truly understand how and why the answer is what it is? And then you work on figuring out exactly what led to the answer? Or are you more likely to have the idea reveal itself through a thorough analysis? [leading with Ne versus leading with Ti]

    * Ne-Ti [conclusion is first to be reached....then you work backwards] - it's more instinctual/gut.

    ~ I often can "see" patterns in things and people very quickly and "know" things, but ask me to explain how I reached it, I will be stumped unless I really sit down and think about how the "answer just popped up" in me. I'm like an audience to myself then, along with others, with all of us [myself included] seeing how I reached the conclusion that I initially did. Seeing the thought-process unfold, after the fact.

    * Ti-Ne [first you work forwards...then you reach conclusion] - it's more rational

    - is your thinking process more linear [sequential], with each node along the path painstakingly evaluated, and analyzed for its logical relevance before moving on to the next? And do you not mind such "laborious" process of thinking?
    Or is it more web-like? And, if it is web-like, with many simultaneous nodes of relevance flashing inside you all at once, asking to be tackled, brought into a coherent WHOLE, does that irritate you, or stimulate you?

    - when you process information, again, is it done rather quickly or with more time, to really think on the information [more depth]? Does it irritate you or excite you when more information are coming from every which angle while you are trying to process the current one? Jumping around a lot, or staying the course? ENTPs are idea jugglers, the more idea balls that's up in the air for us, the more excited we get. We thrive on such chaos, because it's a challenge to see if we can still keep juggling, if more balls are randomly, and unexpectedly thrown into the mix. The word unexpected makes me smirk.

    - this may depend on the type of xNTP and your ease of use of Fe - but generally, an ENTP would be better at social networking/people-moving, working through social interactions, working people, than an INTP.
    You present Ne/Ti as a dichotomy but it doesn't work like that. According to this I would be ENTP and I'm certain I'm not.
    Ne feeds Ti, it's impossible to come to conclusions without any input. Also there are Ne-dom INTPs. Function order isn't hard and fast.


    I think the best way of evaluating E/I is to go back to Jung's original definition about how one is energized - by external interaction, or internal reflection. Introverts require much less stimulation from their environment because they are more sensitive to stimuli and can be overwhelmed by the amounts that extroverts need in order to achieve the same level of arousal. There are biological underpinnings; this isn't something you can change by "downloading some books", or working to become more sociable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    You present Ne/Ti as a dichotomy but it doesn't work like that. According to this I would be ENTP and I'm certain I'm not.
    Ne feeds Ti, it's impossible to come to conclusions without any input. Also there are Ne-dom INTPs. Function order isn't hard and fast.


    I think the best way of evaluating E/I is to go back to Jung's original definition about how one is energized - by external interaction, or internal reflection. Introverts require much less stimulation from their environment because they are more sensitive to stimuli and can be overwhelmed by the amounts that extroverts need in order to achieve the same level of arousal. There are biological underpinnings; this isn't something you can change by "downloading some books", or working to become more sociable.
    Exactly.

  6. #56
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    According to this discussion and a childhood friend, I'm mostly ENTP.

    (Now when I think of it, I've always been accused of being a closet extrovert.)

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post

    I think the best way of evaluating E/I is to go back to Jung's original definition about how one is energized - by external interaction, or internal reflection. Introverts require much less stimulation from their environment because they are more sensitive to stimuli and can be overwhelmed by the amounts that extroverts need in order to achieve the same level of arousal. There are biological underpinnings; this isn't something you can change by "downloading some books", or working to become more sociable.
    I really can't tell which way i get more "energized" though. I enjoy both being alone AND being with people. It's like balanced for me...

  8. #58
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    I think the best way of evaluating E/I is to go back to Jung's original definition about how one is energized - by external interaction, or internal reflection. Introverts require much less stimulation from their environment because they are more sensitive to stimuli and can be overwhelmed by the amounts that extroverts need in order to achieve the same level of arousal. There are biological underpinnings; this isn't something you can change by "downloading some books", or working to become more sociable.
    This too is a simplified dichotomy that, as others in this thread have already pointed out, limits rather than answers the E/I question.

    E/I is along a continuum; it is hard to distinguish where I ends and E categorization begins if one is not clearly near either of the extreme ends. Can you give a hard and fast rule for distinguishing this for those on either side of the middle? [free online tests are a joke]

    What is "more sensitive"? How will a person who is evaluating their type understand "more sensitive" - more compared to what? Whom?

    You present Ne/Ti as a dichotomy but it doesn't work like that. According to this I would be ENTP and I'm certain I'm not.
    No, it's not presented as a dichotomy, but rather each function is highlighted when it is leading. Otherwise, I wouldn't have referred to Ne-Ti or Ti-Ne. I.e., Ti feeding Ne or Ne feeding Ti.

    Ne feeds Ti, it's impossible to come to conclusions without any input.
    ?

    Never said otherwise

    * I also don't know what Ne-dom INTPs mean (?) - from my interpretation, if one is introverted, which means that they lean towards gaining their energy internally, they cannot lead with a function that is external.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTPthinker View Post
    I really can't tell which way i get more "energized" though. I enjoy both being alone AND being with people. It's like balanced for me...

    It's not about enjoying being with people - this is a common error in understanding extraversion/introversion. E simply means you gain energy from external stimulation, while I means you gain energy from internal [self]. The external stimulation can be other people, but it doesn't always have to be the case. There are misanthropic extraverts. Also, there are a lot more in the outside world than people. Anything external [beyond your own self] - not just other people.

  9. #59
    Member metasapiens's Avatar
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    It's also hard to tell which NT am I, INTPthinker, as far as dynamic is considered. I prefer to rely on (what I guess is) the concept core (how people use their mental tools to build an useable inner world through reasoning and restore harmony with their perception of reality) :

    Mainly focused on (/aware of) my inner world
    + widely driven by strong intuitions (/my own imagination)
    + easily judging them and my inner-world with pure logic
    + more likely to adapt them/myself to the outer world than the opposite process
    _______________________
    It's ok to call myself INTP


    Beware of the MBTI dynamics .. it may look like a desperate way to structure an intuitive concept.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post

    It's not about enjoying being with people - this is a common error in understanding extraversion/introversion. E simply means you gain energy from external stimulation, while I means you gain energy from internal [self]. The external stimulation can be other people, but it doesn't always have to be the case. There are misanthropic extraverts. Also, there are a lot more in the outside world than people. Anything external [beyond your own self] - not just other people.
    I see what you're saying. Can you give me some examples of ways i could enjoy being stimulated externally other than people?

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