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  1. #1
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Default ENTJ achilles heel?

    I have a good ENTJ friend and I noticed something yesterday. He and I were asked to help someone move some large household items. He had a "meeting" planned at a certain time and so he couldn't stay and help as long as I could. Well, as time drew closer to his meeting, he became consumed by his pre-planned schedule. He was looking at his watch every 30 seconds. He literally could not get it off of his mind. It was to the point to where I wanted to just say, "Just leave. You're basically being ineffective NOW because you're thinking so much about 1 hour from now. You're really just getting in the way." I found it rather childish to be honest.

    People bemoan the P function, saying that it's lazy and can't keep a schedule and it's flaky, etc, etc. I don't disagree that we can sometimes (if left unchecked) fall into these habits. But, one of the strengths of P, is that it is flexible. It goes with the flow. When life throws a curveball of sorts or when events/schedules change (which they do every single day), we don't panic or freak out. We just calmly go with the flow and play with the hand that is being dealt.

    So, this isn't a rant on why P's are better than J's. I have a couple ENTJ friends who I think are great. I'm just wondering from the ENTJ perspective if this type of thing is something that you struggle with or get easily frustrated with. I've also had an ISTP tell me about a different ENTJ that, "he has everything planned out perfectly, and if things don't go according to his plan, then he freaks out and doesn't know what to do." That doesn't mean it's true, but it does mean that this is the way the ISTP is perceiving his reactions.

    Thoughts?
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  2. #2
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    By the way, I'm not saying that he shouldn't have gone to his meeting. By all means, work up until it's time to leave and then dismiss yourself and go to the meeting. I'm talking about the stress level that it was creating for him. The incessant watch-checking, and the "ZOMG, what am I gonna do?" look that he seemed to have, leaving him pretty ineffective in the moment.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  3. #3
    Pose! Salt n' pepper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post
    I'm just wondering from the ENTJ perspective if this type of thing is something that you struggle with or get easily frustrated with. I've also had an ISTP tell me about a different ENTJ that, "he has everything planned out perfectly, and if things don't go according to his plan, then he freaks out and doesn't know what to do." That doesn't mean it's true, but it does mean that this is the way the ISTP is perceiving his reactions.

    Thoughts?
    For me it's true.

    I can become very down, inflexible and rather kill the whole plan instead of trying to get it to work, according to the new conditions. This usually happens when I have everything perfectly planed and I've got something personal, on the line, that I really want to achieve. Like I've planed to meet someone, and for that to happen, everything else needs to fall in line, according to plan. And if something, one details, fucks that up, it feels like a got a gun-shot in my stomach.

    I think it's also a little bit because I'm so used to getting my way, that I get somewhat shocked when things don't. I can become unreasonable and childish.

  4. #4
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Yeah, I could see myself doing something like that. I don't like to have a really tight schedule exactly for that reason: I'd always be panicking about leaving on time for the next task. Perhaps that meeting was particularly important, but actually if I was somewhat stressed I could do that even with a relatively minor event.

    Although, I think it's not true that "I (We ENTJs, maybe I can generalize) don't know what to do" - it's easy to know what to do, just do what you had planned later, or cancel...I think it's just that "I'd prefer to do as I thought I would have done".
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  5. #5
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    ENTJs have no achilles heel.

    That sounds like a time management thing and priorities rather than a type issue. Slavish adherence to preplanned or scheduled things isnt necessarily ENTJ it could be a compulsive or adult anxiety thing, more other psychology, perhaps he's not really ENTJ but is trying hard to conform to ENTJness and struggling with it.

  6. #6
    He who laughs
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ENTJs have no achilles heel.

    That sounds like a time management thing and priorities rather than a type issue. Slavish adherence to preplanned or scheduled things isnt necessarily ENTJ it could be a compulsive or adult anxiety thing, more other psychology, perhaps he's not really ENTJ but is trying hard to conform to ENTJness and struggling with it.
    Interesting. So you go with the flow when you are met with a new situation? Do you put other interests that may come in the moment higher than what you have planned out?

    I do agree that its something all types can do, but what is the frequency of said. I personally am structured in my inner world, but the outside world is a big mess. And I think thats more the ENTJ achilles heal. That they want structure in both places and cant priorities well because of that.

  7. #7
    Pumpernickel
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post

    But, one of the strengths of P, is that it is flexible. It goes with the flow. When life throws a curveball of sorts or when events/schedules change (which they do every single day), we don't panic or freak out.
    It's not exactly characteristic of J types to freak out either.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post
    I'm talking about the stress level that it was creating for him. The incessant watch-checking, and the "ZOMG, what am I gonna do?" look that he seemed to have, leaving him pretty ineffective in the moment.
    Why do you assume he was stressed?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ENTJs have no achilles heel.

    That sounds like a time management thing and priorities rather than a type issue. Slavish adherence to preplanned or scheduled things isnt necessarily ENTJ it could be a compulsive or adult anxiety thing, more other psychology, perhaps he's not really ENTJ but is trying hard to conform to ENTJness and struggling with it.
    Only a fool doesnt see his weaknesses.

    Type-based or personal. No one is perfect, and if one are, they wouldnt waste time on a forum.

  9. #9
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    That only time I could see this happening is when I have my day perfectly planned out then get suckered into incorporating a favor for someone. I will be there, but also make it known that I had other things to do which are more important.

    Usually I have no priority in the favor at hand and can become annoyed by the fact I am doing something I don't consider important or necessary rather than getting ready for something I do.

  10. #10
    Senior Member JHBowden's Avatar
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    Lark has it right. I rarely expect events to unfold according to preconceived ideas, and am ready and comfortable with improvising if need be. There is an infinity of possible futures, some more probable than others, and the very fact that they're probable means there are no guarantees for anything.

    Uncertainty is not only part of life, but desirable part of it. A sweatshop worker in a third-world country works 14 hour days, day in and day out, though many of us would go mad under such a predictable scheme. I need unstable conditions dammit!

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