[NT] NT explanation of Se + Fi

[2XtremeENFP]

Hey I cant for the life of my understand how Fi works with someone leading with Se (ESFP), and I learn best from NTs, so can someone explain it to me

 

[murkrow]

"I love how this feels!"

 

[INTPness]

"I love how this feels!"

Yeah, something like that. My brother is ESFP. He's a daredevil and a risk taker - lives life to the extreme (extreme sports, bungee jumping, and all that kind of stuff). That's the Se. He puts up a pretty tough front too, but deep down he's got a soft heart and is very capable of being hurt. He is easily affected by others wrongdoings and gets upset when he is wronged (although he keeps it inside). He plays tough because he's a guy, but I've seen him be devastated after a meaningful relationship went sour. It affected him deeply for many months (actually over a year). And I've seen him feel very betrayed when someone does something that goes against his values. He's maturing, but when he was younger, he would get himself into trouble because he would act like a tough guy and get himself into some difficult situations (fist fights with friends, etc.) and then he'd come home and be really hurt inside. He's very sensitive, but tries not to show it.

I see a lot of similarities with his Fi and the Fi I've seen in other types. Sure, it varies a little bit from type to type but, at its core, Fi is still Fi.

They look like ESTP's on the surface, but those close to them know that they are really sensitive on the inside.

 

[2XtremeENFP]

some of the ESFPs I know (which may be unhealthy ones) but their actions seem to be with such impulse that they never check in with their Fi (like I would as an ENFP), is it because their immature? or do they feel regret deep down and dont let others see it?

 

[teslashock]

Fi helps the SFP understand the complexities of human emotion/feeling and put merit into the individual's and/or the self's emotions. Fi is manifest in SFPs by their ability to derive emotional meaning from environmental cues and/or relay emotional meaning through bodily cues. They utilize body language to express their emotions, they mimic emotions through body language, they express emotions through creative imagery, etc. This is why SFPs can often make such good artists/performers; Fi understands emotional undertones and Se makes them understandable to other people via some physical/visual medium.

Additionally, ESPs in general have a daredevil, carefree attitude towards life, and this is due in part to Ji's tendency to go against the principles of the surrounding environment. This is why ESPs push the envelope in their mannerisms and/or physical undertakings; Ji doesn't care about staying inside any objectively built box.

 

[INTPness]

some of the ESFPs I know (which may be unhealthy ones) but their actions seem to be with such impulse that they never check in with their Fi (like I would as an ENFP), is it because their immature? or do they feel regret deep down and dont let others see it?

To answer this, I have come to believe that S's (mostly SP's, IMO) do not "look into the future" as much as N's do. There's a lot of that being discussed in the "Ti constructs" thread. ISTP's, as an example, just think (Ti) about the "right now", whereas, INTP's are probably better at seeing what effect an action will have on the future (i.e. what consequences may come out of it). My ESFP brother has done some things that really made the rest of the family scratch our head in disbelief - things where he totally acted on impulse and clearly did not give any thought to what would result from his actions. He has shown some amount of regret, but not in the way most people would. His approach is basically, "it seemed like the right thing to do at the time. Besides, we were having fun. It was awesome!"

If something is really enticing to the senses and to his impulses, it's almost as if "the sheer awesomeness of the moment" is all that he considers. He just dives in and goes for it. And if it doesn't turn out well, then he just deals with the consequences later. He digs himself out of it then. But, he's still going to enjoy the awesomeness of the moment.

I've said things to him like, "You put others in danger and what I really don't understand is you put your own life at risk. You could have died doing that!" He'll just say, "If it's my time, it's my time. But at least I enjoyed my life to the fullest."

That really seems to be the mindset of the SP's.

 

[sculpting]

To answer this, I have come to believe that S's (mostly SP's, IMO) do not "look into the future" as much as N's do. There's a lot of that being discussed in the "Ti constructs" thread. ISTP's, as an example, just think (Ti) about the "right now", whereas, INTP's are probably better at seeing what effect an action will have on the future (i.e. what consequences may come out of it). My ESFP brother has done some things that really made the rest of the family scratch our head in disbelief - things where he totally acted on impulse and clearly did not give any thought to what would result from his actions. He has shown some amount of regret, but not in the way most people would. His approach is basically, "it seemed like the right thing to do at the time. Besides, we were having fun. It was awesome!"

If something is really enticing to the senses and to his impulses, it's almost as if "the sheer awesomeness of the moment" is all that he considers. He just dives in and goes for it. And if it doesn't turn out well, then he just deals with the consequences later. He digs himself out of it then. But, he's still going to enjoy the awesomeness of the moment.

I've said things to him like, "You put others in danger and what I really don't understand is you put your own life at risk. You could have died doing that!" He'll just say, "If it's my time, it's my time. But at least I enjoyed my life to the fullest."

That really seems to be the mindset of the SP's.

INTPness, Do you sometimes see him view history from his own, somehwt skewed persepctive? a bit like the bold bits above? For me, Si renders a "processed snapshot" of the emotions/feelings/textures of my Fi judgments-thus if it hurt, I very clearly remember the pain, and dont repeat.

But I have seen ESFPs sometimes rewrite history form a perspective that favors them-mostly like the bolded bits above, but for my sister, it can be almost outright lies at times. I'd suggest this is inferior Ni allowing a context shift.

 

[INTPness]

INTPness, Do you sometimes see him view history from his own, somehwt skewed persepctive? a bit like the bold bits above? For me, Si renders a "processed snapshot" of the emotions/feelings/textures of my Fi judgments-thus if it hurt, I very clearly remember the pain, and dont repeat.

But I have seen ESFPs sometimes rewrite history form a perspective that favors them-mostly like the bolded bits above, but for my sister, it can be almost outright lies at times. I'd suggest this is inferior Ni allowing a context shift.

I've wondered the same thing myself about him. It's hard to say because he's still a young adult. I guess I need to see more to be able to answer that fully. He definitely does remember things differently than the rest of us. Like if he does something really bad that gets him into trouble and causes grief for the rest of the family and then 3 years goes by. We'll be sitting down as a family discussing what happened 3 years ago and we're all saying stuff like, "Yeah, that was a HORRIBLE experience. We still can't believe you did that. You were so lucky that something worse didn't happen." And he'll just smile and say something like, "That was one of the most fun times I've ever had in my life!"

I guess he just remembers the "fun" of it. To him, the consequences and the grief were just an unfortunate side show.

The part of your question that I can't really answer for sure is whether he thinks, "that caused a lot of pain last time, so I shouldn't repeat that." Sometimes I think he doesn't think like that because he seemingly repeats his mistakes. But, like I said, he's young and his repeat mistakes could just be a result of immaturity. I'm hoping he does learn from his mistakes. He messed up one time REALLY bad and he told the family, "I'm so sorry. I will NEVER put you guys through that again!" And he hasn't done it again, but when you ask him about it, he'll still grin as if to say, "That was FUN!" LOL.