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  1. #1
    ReflecTcelfeR
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    Default An Experiment on Learning How to Feel

    I've been thinking about the descriptions given to entp's and the apparent lack of Fi within them. I briefly read the description of Fi and it's correlation on deciding what we believe is important or not. First of all I would like to pose the statement that Fi is unavoidable. It is always used, and always works at it's fullest. I would say this without stating the fact that you could be mentally ill, and I do this because even having the cognitive changes that take place within a mentally ill patient they still have values (though sociopaths may differ, but that's a different subject) it's only what the values change into that has actually changed. That was off topic.

    Anyway, I had another thought linked to the fact that T's don't need to show their emotions, or that the actions we make aren't based upon them, as well as the fact that we don't understand at times how you can make a decision solely on emotion. Because of this I began pondering on ways to develop, for what some people may feel, the F-ness that they feel they lack. I would say that this approach works better for E's than I's though just because the implementation does require spending most of your time around other people. It also hopes if you have the endless thirst for knowledge that NT's are I'm sure stereotypically thought of having, and most of the time I'd say that it is correct.

    It's quite simple really. Use that big ole' T function too learn how the other person explains their own emotions. How they describe them, the movements they make. Analyze how to feel by observation. I think my ability to understand and express emotions has grown leaps and bounds just because I listened to others describe their own. I found that what they felt I feel too and so describing them similiarly works for me, and though this technique doesn't necessarily speak to the independent streak that NT's have, I think getting over miscommunications between thought processes is more important in the long run, but that's just me.

  2. #2
    morose bourgeoisie
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    'F' does not equal emotion. Do a search.

  3. #3
    ReflecTcelfeR
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    This was written in a rush, without a lot of research. Though I would say emotion is a rather large chunk don't you think?

  4. #4
    morose bourgeoisie
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    I didn't mean to derail. Sorry. I'm a little drunk.
    I don't see it as terribly emotional. More like a global judging fuction. Think 'gut feeling' rather than emotion...

  5. #5
    ReflecTcelfeR
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    Hahaha, no problem. That is a better way to describe it.

  6. #6
    A passer by yvonne's Avatar
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    i like the way healthy, balanced thinkers go about life, though. they don't worry too much. they're funny. they make sense. they're not clingy. they don't get defensive easily... oh, wait, maybe i'm just talking about healthy individuals, not only thinkers.
    Enneagram 5w4.

  7. #7
    Member Johnfloyd6675's Avatar
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    I think that iNtuition and Sensation are more strongly bound up in emotions than Feeling is. Emotions are bodily functions in response to stimuli, such as winning the lottery or falling into the zoo's tiger pit. The happiness and fear that our brains make our bodies feel is yet more data for our minds to perceive.

    Feeling is, of course, tied to emotion. But it's probably more accurate to say that Feeling functions according to sentiment, rather than emotion. We are after all talking about a judging function here.
    "The human body must be something other than an animal organism." - Martin Heidegger

  8. #8
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReflecttcelfeR View Post
    I've been thinking about the descriptions given to entp's and the apparent lack of Fi within them. I briefly read the description of Fi and it's correlation on deciding what we believe is important or not. First of all I would like to pose the statement that Fi is unavoidable. It is always used, and always works at it's fullest. I would say this without stating the fact that you could be mentally ill, and I do this because even having the cognitive changes that take place within a mentally ill patient they still have values (though sociopaths may differ, but that's a different subject) it's only what the values change into that has actually changed. That was off topic.

    Anyway, I had another thought linked to the fact that T's don't need to show their emotions, or that the actions we make aren't based upon them, as well as the fact that we don't understand at times how you can make a decision solely on emotion. Because of this I began pondering on ways to develop, for what some people may feel, the F-ness that they feel they lack. I would say that this approach works better for E's than I's though just because the implementation does require spending most of your time around other people. It also hopes if you have the endless thirst for knowledge that NT's are I'm sure stereotypically thought of having, and most of the time I'd say that it is correct.

    It's quite simple really. Use that big ole' T function too learn how the other person explains their own emotions. How they describe them, the movements they make. Analyze how to feel by observation. I think my ability to understand and express emotions has grown leaps and bounds just because I listened to others describe their own. I found that what they felt I feel too and so describing them similiarly works for me, and though this technique doesn't necessarily speak to the independent streak that NT's have, I think getting over miscommunications between thought processes is more important in the long run, but that's just me.
    Emotions do not equal Fi. Fi is more a tool to analyze them.

    My ENTP best friend and I have had many discussions (aka intense debates with loud raised voices in restaurants) about Fi and Ti and how ENXPs use them.

    My end conclusion-entps and enfps totally go to war over this shit. It doesnt seem to matter who or where we meet up-it just seems like battle ensues. I think Fi is almost offensive to Ti. I say this as both are based upon internal rule sets which are subjective and self consistent.

    For some reason two Fi users will quickly back off if we realize we have stumbled across someone else's Fi value that doesnt quite match with our own. "oh, uh, sorry, my bad"

    Two Ti users seem to be able to debate/discuss until they have mapped out or modified there own Ti rulesets to be consistent, or at least understand why there is a difference.

    But Ti and Fi?

    First the Fi screws up and stomps on an Fe rule. This prompts Ti to take a closer look. But Ti looks at Fi and goes WTF? "That shit makes no sense." My entp says it feels like she tries to logically mirror/map the Fi user and just ends up with none of it making sense-thus generating an internal sense of frustration and annoyance for her. She becomes logically offended".

    Then the Ti poking begins. She says that for Ti, the Fi seems illogical, so it is almost obligated to dig holes in it, poke it and identify why it is different-because this is what Ti would do to another Ti user where there was a Ti mismatch between them. Ti needs to clarify its own internal rules, and make sure they are correct.

    Which hurts like hell to an Fi user as it questions the authenticity of an Fi judgment or displayed emotion via the intense questioning-This is the heart of Fi-it must be authentic. Then the Fi user gets very defensive and in an enfp you might get your ass bitchslapped. Cause we are cuddly like that.

    Interestingly it was Ti which was defensive first, then responded via going on an offensive probe which provokes a defensive response in the Fi user.

    Fi in ENTPs:
    A few entps have mentioned the sensation of "mirroring" the physiological pain of another-which perhaps might be a very unconscious Fi at work. But they only do this for people they are exceptionally close to and it is rare.

    My entp found this nlp excercise below and used it in an attempt to feel Fi and Ti at the same time. She said it is disabling and terrifying to do this as she had to totally let go of Ti-logic. I modified it to work with Te and Fi at the same time, which is much more natural for enfps.

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...xperiment.html

  9. #9
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    I never express my emotions, but I have a hyperdeveloped Fi. It's really weird and I hate it sometimes that I have so much emotion but can't express it (social anxiety).

  10. #10
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    ENTJs aren't known for being emotional, but we can't hide them well from those who really know us. One of my ESFP friends pulls me back down to earth by having to listen to whats going on with her because it's one of those situations where sticking up for someone would make it worse, if you're the type that can't just pretend things never happened its not easy but it seems to be working cause she has started to tell people that walk all over her that they are. I hate to have to tell trusting people that they're being used because I remember how I felt when I found out others I admired weren't
    so wonderful after all, sometimes you have to turn off those feelings of what was best
    for you in some situations because it's not always the same for someone else.

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