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Thread: ENTP: Ti (and a little ENTJ question)

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by visaisahero View Post
    Here's an analogy:

    It often feels like I'm trying to assemble an elegant arc structure from multiple large stones. "Focus on one thing at a time" doesn't really work for me- it's impossible to build the arc by dealing with one stone at a time, because you need all the stones to be in place simultaneously for the arc to stand without support. It's a delicate, risky and ambitious process which can sometimes result in epic failure.

    Alternatively, you need to put all sorts of support structures in place before loading the stones- and these "support structures" represent the seemingly endless blabber that Ne is so capable of spouting.

    Following the arc of stones analogy, Ti acts as an agent of efficiency, and is deeply concerned with structural integrity. While Ne is the idealistic architect, Ti is the rational engineer. In the first scenario, it ensures that the stones selected are the ideal stones for the job. It notices when any of the stones are out of place, and ensures that they are kept neatly in perfect alignment. This minimizes the possibility of structural failure, or collapse. In the second scenario, it gets rid of the "support structures" that would otherwise ruin the beauty of the arc for the casual observer.

    Architect is responsible for ideas, engineer does the actualizing and everything else

  2. #22


    so it logically follows that an obsessive Ti without any Ne is too grounded to get anything groundbreaking done, whereas an obsessive Ne without any Ti comes up with castles-in-the-sky pipe-dream ideas that make no sense
    Call me Visa, please!

  3. #23


    lol, during the day I'm all over the place and want to do a little bit of everything, at nights my best time to focus for long lengths of time and stumble on ideas to learn new skills by
    letting my imagination wander.


  4. #24


    Quote Originally Posted by VitaB View Post
    I have realized that my full potential lies in my auxilary Ti and I am looking for ways to develop this function. What would you recommend?

    Other ENTPs: how developed is your Ti function? do you think this is a crucial part of your personality? is it helpful?
    I have a MS in mathematics. That developed my Ti pretty well. So my advice to develop Ti would be to find an activity (or subject) that you enjoy and makes heavy use of Ti. Then do that as much as you can.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)

  5. #25
    psicobolche Array tcda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    It is absolutely crucial to escaping the dreaded Ne+Fe loop.
    out of interest, what does that look like? genuine question.
    "Of course we spent our money in the good times. That's what you're supposed to do in good times! You can't save money in the good times. Then they wouldn't be good times, they'd be 'preparation for the bad times' times."

    "Every country in the world owes money. Everyone. So heere's what I dont get: who do they all owe it to, and why don't we just kill the bastard and relax?"

    -Tommy Tiernan, Irish comedian.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcda View Post
    out of interest, what does that look like? genuine question.
    I was wondering the same thing.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.

    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcda View Post
    out of interest, what does that look like? genuine question.
    If I'm not mistaken, it is my experience that it turns into a very shallow popularity act.

  8. #28
    wants Mifune clone minion Array Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Aug 2009
    5w4 sx/sp


    Quote Originally Posted by tcda View Post
    out of interest, what does that look like? genuine question.
    I tried starting a thread about this awhile back, because I wanted to hear people describe any experience they may have had with it. This is a generic description from Thompson’s book:

    When ENPs resist their Introverted Judgment, Introverted Sensation gets too far from their conscious self-experience, and they have a hard time resisting its influence on them. Such types ultimately turn to Extraverted Judgment, their tertiary function, attempting to keep their Intuitive self-understanding intact.

    Like ESPs, Intuitives use their tertiary function to Judge others, to discriminate between people who support them and people who don’t. ENFPs, for example, whose tertiary is Extraverted Thinking, become increasingly critical of people who disapprove of their Intuitive behaviors, judging them to be negative, controlling, or threatened by their choices.

    Like all tertiary defenses, this one contains a general truth. Extreme ENFPs are too dependent on others’ approval and expectations, and they’re right to seek their own way. But Extraverted Thinking can’t help them do this. It gives them no experience with their own views and beliefs. It simply convinces them that others’ values and beliefs are unreasonable.

    ENTPs, whose tertiary function is Extaverted Feeling, handle things differently. They gear all their efforts to collective expectations- but for tactical advantage. They strive for others’ support by displaying more relatedness. Such types are badly offended if their gestures don’t have the intended effect. Their feeling function suggests that their efforts are not being appreciated and they find it difficult to forgive the insult.

    Again, this tertiary viewpoint contains a grain of truth. Without a strong, internal code of honor, extreme ENTP types lack self-discipline, and their competitive drive keeps them striving for outward control. They’re right to put more emphasis on human relationship. But Extraverted Feeling doesn’t help them in this effort. It encourages them to disarm people rather than to recognize their responsibility to them.
    So Ti provides a "strong, internal code of honor" that stops y'all from needing to control people in order to feel loved? I don't mean 'control' in a sadistic sense so much as 'be in charge of social situations' in order to feel accepted by other people in those social situations. Does that description seem too harsh, or does it seem inaccurate?

    edit: within quoted area, choice to bold and underline certain areas is mine- but italicized words were originally italicized in Thompson's text. I also clarified what I meant by 'control'.
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari

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