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Thread: Te's uhh

  1. #11
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    In my experience (based on the ENTP's I've known), once they reach a conclusion they stick with it regardless of the introduction of refuting/superior evidence, and in fact, may become offended by arguments that oppose their own. So...I guess I can see how types like mine, which explore every possibility (hypothetically), could cause you problems.

    To compare, it would be like how we only care about something to the extent that it is usable, which probably annoys INTPs.
    I find it's quite generally the opposite, it just doesn't look that way.

    If I reach a conclusion, I'm fully open to changing it, but yeu're going to have to fight for every inch of the way and prove yeurself fully. Yeu can't just go "I think yeu're wrong" and expect me to change my mind when yeu don't even know why I should. I will pull apart every piece of evidence given and make sure yeu know whot it is yeu're talking about. If yeu do, great, I'll change my mind once I know the alternative is closer to correct. I just don't change my mind on a whim is all.

    Most likely, most other entp's are similar. Explore a ton of options in rapid succession, compare each, pick the one that makes the most sense at the time. Once they think they're right, yeu need to seriously know yeur stuff to change their minds.

    As such, hardly "set in our way", just... don't want to change without a good reason to. If there's a good reason, then sure. Yeu just need a very good reason is all; chances are if yeu find an entp not changing, yeu're just explaining things poorly or they're finding too many gaps in yeur logic. If yeu can persevere and take on the seemingly endless stream of challenges they'll put yeur idea through, and make it to the end, then yeu can change our mind =3

    If yeu give up halfway through, or hit a few loopholes or gaps in yeur argument, and can't fully fix them, then it'll be written off as just another mistake to be ignored.

  2. #12
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    What I meant by this was, I tend to like only my own N, or N that is on my level. For instance I will sometimes bat around the typical "hypothetical" idea, or out there possibilities and notions. However when in the presence of extremely hypothetical people, I get annoyed to death by the redundancy of spaced out thought. If I am not in the mood for hypothetical, it tends to not only seem, from my perspective, both obsessive and at times crazy.

    Mostly I get this way around INFJs and INTPs. Anyway was just wondering if this was a Te thing, or more S trait in general.
    Oh. That.

    That's Ti/Ne (and Ne/Ti). With respect to INFJs, it's kind of the same deal, when you start invoking their objective side, you get Ti, which as often as not will invoke Ne (not Se).

    What's going on is that you as an xNTJ have a particular end or purpose in mind when involved in an objective discussion. You want to solve a problem, or figure out how to organize something, and so on. (Te stuff.)

    Ti, especially Ti plus iNtuition, wants to explore the problem, not "solve" it. It's a totally different perspective. Ti folks seem to assume that you want to explore the problem, too. After all, if you don't "really" understand the problem, any solution you might derive might be wrong. Right?

    Ni/Te and Te/Ni want to "explore" only insofar as to reach a conclusion in a reasonable amount of time, and then execute a plan. Ti will wonder what's the rush? What about this other piece of your problem, you know, where if this one really weird improbable thing happens, then your plan will fail?

    Te weighs probabilities, and then executes. Ti explores possibilities. (I'm mostly assuming as combined with Ni/Ne ... I'm not as familiar with the S versions.)

  3. #13

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    Redundantly excessive anything is a pain in the ass. You almost always would be better off with a little bit of everything, to keep things interesting. </ENTP>

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    In my experience (based on the ENTP's I've known), once they reach a conclusion they stick with it regardless of the introduction of refuting/superior evidence, and in fact, may become offended by arguments that oppose their own. So...I guess I can see how types like mine, which explore every possibility (hypothetically), could cause you problems.

    To compare, it would be like how we only care about something to the extent that it is usable, which probably annoys INTPs.
    That's very strange. As an ENTP myself, I seldom (if ever) stick with any of my conclusions for very long- I'm always looking to refine them, and sometimes I even disregard them entirely when I find a better explanation.

    Did you mean to say ENTJ?

  5. #15
    ThatGirl
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Oh. That.

    That's Ti/Ne (and Ne/Ti). With respect to INFJs, it's kind of the same deal, when you start invoking their objective side, you get Ti, which as often as not will invoke Ne (not Se).

    What's going on is that you as an xNTJ have a particular end or purpose in mind when involved in an objective discussion. You want to solve a problem, or figure out how to organize something, and so on. (Te stuff.)

    Ti, especially Ti plus iNtuition, wants to explore the problem, not "solve" it. It's a totally different perspective. Ti folks seem to assume that you want to explore the problem, too. After all, if you don't "really" understand the problem, any solution you might derive might be wrong. Right?

    Ni/Te and Te/Ni want to "explore" only insofar as to reach a conclusion in a reasonable amount of time, and then execute a plan. Ti will wonder what's the rush? What about this other piece of your problem, you know, where if this one really weird improbable thing happens, then your plan will fail?

    Te weighs probabilities, and then executes. Ti explores possibilities. (I'm mostly assuming as combined with Ni/Ne ... I'm not as familiar with the S versions.)
    This one, especially the bolded parts. Thank you, informative post.

  6. #16
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katsuni View Post
    I find it's quite generally the opposite, it just doesn't look that way.

    If I reach a conclusion, I'm fully open to changing it, but yeu're going to have to fight for every inch of the way and prove yeurself fully. Yeu can't just go "I think yeu're wrong" and expect me to change my mind when yeu don't even know why I should. I will pull apart every piece of evidence given and make sure yeu know whot it is yeu're talking about. If yeu do, great, I'll change my mind once I know the alternative is closer to correct. I just don't change my mind on a whim is all.

    Most likely, most other entp's are similar. Explore a ton of options in rapid succession, compare each, pick the one that makes the most sense at the time. Once they think they're right, yeu need to seriously know yeur stuff to change their minds.

    As such, hardly "set in our way", just... don't want to change without a good reason to. If there's a good reason, then sure. Yeu just need a very good reason is all; chances are if yeu find an entp not changing, yeu're just explaining things poorly or they're finding too many gaps in yeur logic. If yeu can persevere and take on the seemingly endless stream of challenges they'll put yeur idea through, and make it to the end, then yeu can change our mind =3

    If yeu give up halfway through, or hit a few loopholes or gaps in yeur argument, and can't fully fix them, then it'll be written off as just another mistake to be ignored.
    It's possible that it's a matter of maturity. I haven't really known any really mature ENTP's irl. It's highly unlikely that they were finding gaps in my logic or I was explaining it poorly. I could see more mature ENTPs being as you describe, though.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  7. #17
    *hmmms* theadoor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by visaisahero View Post
    Hypotheses serve their purpose, but are pointless on their own. Good ones enrich and enlighten. Bad ones you can learn from. In both cases, to follow your scientific method analogy, you need to follow up with concrete experimentation, analysis and conclusion.
    Oh yeah?

  8. #18
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    What I meant by this was, I tend to like only my own N, or N that is on my level. For instance I will sometimes bat around the typical "hypothetical" idea, or out there possibilities and notions. However when in the presence of extremely hypothetical people, I get annoyed to death by the redundancy of spaced out thought. If I am not in the mood for hypothetical, it tends to not only seem, from my perspective, both obsessive and at times crazy.

    Mostly I get this way around INFJs and INTPs. Anyway was just wondering if this was a Te thing, or more S trait in general.
    It makes sense that it would be Te. It's very Te to go "Why are you SPECULATING when you could be GETTING THE JOB DONE???" I definitely do that.

    But I don't think it's S if the only reason you get frustrated by it is because it's, as you said, "redundant", "obsessive" and "crazy". As an S, the words I would use would be "obnoxious", "pointless", and, depending on my mood, "full of sh*t".

    But it makes sense that ESTJs would be a lot more annoyed by excessive hypotheticals than ENTJs would be.
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  9. #19
    Senior Member milkyway2's Avatar
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    You sound like my boyfriend. He's an ESTJ and I'm INTP and he gets pissed off if we ever enter into theoretical conversations. Our ways of thinking about things really clash when that happens.

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