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  1. #11
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    So, I seem to be getting a pattern that we INT's seem to have be very slow learners when it comes to practical stuff, which is mostly the kind of thing I'm talking about. It seems like we really want to do it right, or we tend to overthink things. Is this because of Ti, or is this related to being intuitive?

    I'm also pretty curious to know what non-NT's think about this.
    I think it's both Ti and N. Neither Si nor Se is one of our first 2 functions and those are the functions that do well with this kind of stuff.

    As most in this thread are saying, I am able catch on really quickly to most things and reach a pretty good level of competence in short fashion. But, there have been things that people have tried to show me how to do and it's just a complete mess. Stuff that is very "common sense" for most S's. In these instances, my Ti wants to analyze the process and break it down into smaller pieces so I can understand it better and blah blah blah - there are a lot of things in life where this level of analyzing just isn't necessary at all. My old ESTJ boss would see the wheels starting to spin in my head after he explained something and he would say, "Stop. You're thinking again. Just do it. Dumb yourself down, make like a monkey, and just do it. It's really SUPER easy. It doesn't require much thought at all." One example that comes to mind is when he showed me how to use a jackhammer to break-up a concrete porch. He demonstrated how to do it, then handed it to me. I held it in my hands, tried to get a feel for how heavy it was, thought about what the best way to hold it was, then started thinking about what part of the porch I should attack first (I was strategizing which is normal for us). He saw all these wheels spinning and he said, "This is demolition. Don't think about it. Just bust up the concrete as quickly as you can. A monkey could do it. Just pull the trigger and go." That goes against the grain for me. I always want to understand something thoroughly first.

    The other way I make mistakes is due to being N. Most S's, while operating the jackhammer, are able to stay focused on exactly what they are doing. Their full attention is on that jackhammer and what they are doing. With my Ne, after 30 minutes of doing something, my mind starts to wander to other things, ideas, brainstorming, etc. Things just start popping into my head, and before I know it, I've made a mistake because I lost my focus on what I'm doing. Ne wants to see the "big picture". While I'm operating that jackhammer, maybe a dog walks into the backyard or a gust of wind comes up and blows over a trash can, etc, etc. Ne sees all of that, wants to take all of that in and process it, instead of focusing on the very small task of "just simply operating the jackhammer".

  2. #12
    Junior Member matthew86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    for me its about that i try to understand the principles about the thing im learning, so at start it might look like im learning slowly, but i think i understand how the whole thing works faster than many others(if its something complicated) and when i learn how it works i master it better than many others. so in the long run i dont think im a slow learner. if its something i really dont care about i dont try to learn the principles, so not only do i learn it slowly, but i wont learn it very well. but that doesent bother me since i dont care about learning it.

    sometimes when something is actually pretty easy to learn i might try to understand its principles too deeply and try to think it as more complicated thing that it actually is, then i might learn it bit slower than many others. but in those cases it wont be anything too complex so it wont take me weeks to learn something that other learn in a minute..
    Quote Originally Posted by Ace_ View Post
    INTPs are the fastest learners of all the types when something is abstract, complex and it interests them. They are often retarded at practical sensing stuff though.
    I think the guys above hit the nail on the head pretty well.

    From my experience I don't learn slowly I tend to have 2 problems:
    1) I tend to look at all problems from EVERY possible angle concievable to man, machine, and god. This means that I have to spend more time with problems but most people tell me I see things that they or others are/have failed to see (that is whenever I decide to come out of my own world and tell someone).

    2) I tend to care less about what someone else wants for results and instead tend to try and find the true understanding of the situation or problem. sometimes this comes across from others as me not understanding their problems when its actually me just considering their problems insignificant and write them off as nuances.

    So in the long run my issue is honestly a lack of the concerns to societial precepts of how things in generality are to be done and my habitual nature of forgeting to interact with the rest of the human populace.

    (Fortunately my major is Theoretical Mathematics so these nuances are only slight).
    Jean-Luc Picard: So, five-card stud, nothing wild... and the sky's the limit.
    [Final line of the series, spoken while playing poker with the senior staff for the first time.]

  3. #13
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    I'm slow to learn things but quick to figure them out. Do you relate to that?
    "When a resolute young fellow steps up the great bully, the world, and takes him boldly by the beard, he is often surprised to find that it comes off in his hand, and that it was only tied on to scare away the timid adventurers." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

  4. #14
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    I'm a pretty slow and deliberate reader. It takes me time to thoroughly understand things- and that's really the key word..."thorough." Also, people have commented on how slowly I speak, which is usually the result of me analyzing what I say before and as I say it.

    As to concrete or physical tasks, I also suffer from over-analysis. For instance, when I worked in a television station, there was one instance where I had to fill in for technical director. I had to operate the switchboard while monitoring three different screens (which corresponded to three different cameras), and I was very close to panicking because I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing. I asked the director, of course, but all he said was "it's easy, all you have to do is watch for the right times to switch cameras during the recording. And remember not to leave it on any one camera for too long." This was not helpful at all. I wanted to know what basic principles operated behind the idea of "the right time" and what constituted "too long." Not having any idea of what those operating principles were, I was all over the place. Oh well. No television technical direction for me.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  5. #15
    Senior Member Nighthawk's Avatar
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    I can only reiterate what others have already written. I'm slow when it comes to picking up sensorish things and motor skills. Takes me a while to pick up dance steps or sports moves, if ever, for example. In dealing with abstract concepts or systems however, or pattern recongnition, I'm generally pretty quick. In working with software development I seem to have little or no problem catching on to what is going on fairly quickly ... and crafting solutions.

  6. #16
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
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    Being a "slow learner" doesn't mean much, honestly. That's just learning style.

    If yeu're very detail oriented and work out all the little kinks in a concept methodically one at a time, then yeu'll learn slowly, but thoroughly, which's more important.

    Most of the "quick learners" catch onto basic points and concepts quickly but lack full understanding as a whole.




    It's like... say a spider's web, we'll use this as an example:



    The "quick learners" tend to grasp the key lines, like the outward support structures very fast, but are oblivious to the inner rings, leaving them with only really half an idea of whot is going on, and no true comprehension.

    The 'slow learners' often are slow because they're being methodical, going through each ring one step at a time, carefully analyzing the patterns and how things work together. It takes them longer to get to the outer edges, but they generally have a better idea of the idea as a whole when they get there.

    Problem is less in learning style, and moreso in issues with our society's obsessive compulsive need for speed.

    Everything has to be fast. Now. Instant. Immediate. No time to pause and think, if yeu don't get something on the first pass yeu're a failure at life.

    Obviously not the case... remember, einstein failed math class.



    There's other 'learning disabilities' as well, which usually aren't even really disabilities to be honest... things like learning things in a particular way best, such as actively doing something. Showing someone a diagram of a car may be meaningless to them; let them under the hood and they'll learn twice as fast as anyone else. Yet that's deemed to be a disability because it doesn't match with how the current teaching process does things.

    Honestly, I wouldn't worry about it too much, but if yeu really ARE concerned with being considered "slow", I'd suggest actively stressing understanding basic ideas and building on those, rather than trying to absorb all the information at once and then attempting to see the big picture from the start. That'll generally make yeu look like a faster learner, though chances are yeu won't have learned as much in the process so it's kind of a tradeoff.

    The 'best' learners, really are just those who can switch back and forth and learn both the basics, and the things around them in turn quickly. If yeu stress too much on the details or the big picture, yeu'll get lost either way.

    Unable to see the forest through the trees is as bad as being unable to see the trees through the forest type dealie.

    But honestly, as long as yeu get there in the end, and it MAKES SENSE, then that's all that matters.

    As far as I'm concerned, at least, someone who learns slowly but is able to grasp really high end complex concepts like theoretical physics, is smarter than someone who learned to tie their shoes a year sooner. Just because yeu learn 'faster', it doesn't mean yeu learned as much in the process.

    There's exceptions of course, but I wouldn't worry about it too much.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
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    My INTP ex, and now a friend, is extremely slow (learner, too). We used to fight about it a lot, because I wasnt aware it's just the way he is, I thought he is depressed or something . He is really brilliant mathematician (even went to Olympics), but failed 3 years in Ph.D. in Math, which is very often here, but he shouldnt fail cos of his talent and it's much easier to him than for an average student. He practicaly washes the dishes like 3-4x times slower than I do, and eats slow. His day passes and he does nothing.
    I do nothing too, but it's cos I am lazy.. when I work, I work. He works at very slow pace. And studies extremely slow and in details.

  8. #18
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    I think INTPs can understand things quite quickly, but in terms of STJ-style practical application, we're probably pretty slow. I know I am.

  9. #19
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chloee View Post
    My INTP ex, and now a friend, is extremely slow (learner, too). We used to fight about it a lot, because I wasnt aware it's just the way he is, I thought he is depressed or something . He is really brilliant mathematician (even went to Olympics), but failed 3 years in Ph.D. in Math, which is very often here, but he shouldnt fail cos of his talent and it's much easier to him than for an average student. He practicaly washes the dishes like 3-4x times slower than I do, and eats slow. His day passes and he does nothing.
    I do nothing too, but it's cos I am lazy.. when I work, I work. He works at very slow pace. And studies extremely slow and in details.
    Sounds like he may have had certain concentration issues, perhaps even a disorder? *shrug*
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  10. #20
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucrativeSid View Post
    I'm slow to learn things but quick to figure them out. Do you relate to that?
    Nah
    I refuse to learn things when asked to. So I wouldn't know!
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

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    ... In theory.

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