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  1. #151
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    ugh... I hate how every discussion on gender differences always boils down to babies

    the fucking idea that I'm expected to reproduce, as a sexually active 20-something female in a stable relationship is something that's thrown in my face all of the time by people ranging from doctors to friends to family members... I feel no connection to children and we've agreed that neither of us wants children! :steam:

    seriously- that's an example on its own of how society treats the genders differently- I'm not a fucking baby factory like I get thrown at me all of the time

    and I don't see why I always got in more trouble for the same misbehavior as they boys when I was a kid just because it wasn't ladylike behavior... seriously, that line was used on me! you might not run across it, but as a particularly rambunctious ExTP child I got reminded that it's ok for boys to do dangerous things but not girls all of the time
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  2. #152
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antimony View Post
    You seem more like an ENFP to me.
    No, tink definitely seems ENTP to me. I've noticed that a lot of the ENTPs hate on her. Which surprises me because I always get a kick out of her. Never know what she is going to say next. Right or wrong, that girl is going to let loose no matter how unpopular her sentiments may be.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlahBlahNounBlah View Post
    I think it might be enneagram more than gender. I don't care about arguing some pointless bull.


    Fluxkom, King-of-Despair, and Synarch are guys, but I relate to a lot of what they say. Not as much with a lot of the other guys.

    The women I relate to the most are probably Trinity, Jenocyde, and you (Whatever).
    I could have written this, substituting my name for yours, of course. And adding OMT and Gamine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    I think I come off more like the guy ENTPs than the girls, online. Because, I don't come here to avoid conflict and make nice. I come here to play, shoot the (bull)shit, and call it like it is. And, I argue.

    And, keep at it, because, well, what else is there to do? That's all we have here, written responses to each other, it's not like my arguing is taking up valuable time for us to go and get coffee together or some shit. I also don't think I just pick disagreements with any random person. It's either because I see glaring inconsistency in a thought, or that someone is thinking themselves on some kind of pedestal (which becomes a call for a challenge ), or, something about their online personality, some twist in the facade, beckons me to poke at it.

    Of the ENTPs here, I think I'm closest to this weirdo:




    Except, in arguments, I'm less obscure and explain my points while he just moves on to the next (cuz if you don't get it, whateves!)

    Edit: I actually identify with Jeno a lot too, when I'm not being silly.



    +1


    I don't think any of us come on here to make nice. I just pick and choose what I respond to since I don't like getting into pointless debates. But when I start, it's on.

    I also identify with you strongly.

    We are similar in the fact that we will tell people exactly what we think. Where we differ is that I only say it once. You are very persistent, for sure. I get a little amazed how some arguments span multiple threads over the course of days or weeks. I just can't be bothered.

    But I still don't think you come off as an ENTP guy. In my opinion, a lot of the younger ENTP males come off as arrogant pricks who blow a lot of hot air. You always seem to know what you are talking about, so I don't get that impression from you.

    Just my 2 cents.


    Also, I couldn't get past page 3 of all this silly bickering, so my (fake) apologies for not posting anything relevant to anyone else's posts.

  3. #153
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    That all being said, I also relate strongly to the INTP women, as well.
    The men? Not so much, but sometimes.

  4. #154
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    wow... I sound militant above... probably carry-over from another thread...

    just a bit annoyed at restrictions based on demographics I guess

    any demographics really
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  5. #155
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    IMO, I've found the NTP m/f split to be nearly night and day. Both women seem to be far more well rounded. The men tend to fall into extreme ends of certain spectra. BlueMonday had good thoughts about this, forget where it was she wrote them though.



  6. #156
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    IMO, I've found the NTP m/f split to be nearly night and day. Both women seem to be far more well rounded. The men tend to fall into extreme ends of certain spectra. BlueMonday had good thoughts about this, forget where it was she wrote them though.
    Exactly, this is what I mean.

  7. #157
    Senior Member tinkerbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    No, tink definitely seems ENTP to me. I've noticed that a lot of the ENTPs hate on her. Which surprises me because I always get a kick out of her. Never know what she is going to say next. Right or wrong, that girl is going to let loose no matter how unpopular her sentiments may be.
    .
    Ah bless I feel so validated... SPARKLE....

    Actually the ribbing toned down when I changed my avatar... weird really the avatar was a caracture of me... LOL hmmm not sure what to make of that.

    I consider out-there options, way beyond what other NT's and I'm just not 20 years old. LOL

    So ought I to start the discussion on why hooking up functional analysis and MBTI is flawed I wonder... hum ho....

    oopps

    I did also want to contribute to the OP's

    I ran a thread on ENTP org site on that ENTP men often seem more F than other men, not in an effeminate way, just gentler in some respect.... so it's not just that ENTP women are different from men generaly but ENTP men are different from other men. ENTP men tend to be more cultured, rounder education, more likely to be into art, and the likes ie not football and boxing types....

    I think ENTP changes dramatically with age. as young kids they are joyous in discovery, teen years are harsh where they migrate often from a gawkiness, socialy uncomfortable to be more outgoing, migrating to late teens early 20s over doing it... late 20's thorugh mid 30's drifting through experiences, not really hearnesing their abilites until the get near their 40s etc.... (actually I see that type of path with lots of NTs)

  8. #158
    Member Liquid and Flammable's Avatar
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    Interesting, do you think we evolve out MBTI from reacting to life or are we born wiht it.
    Ah, tinker. Sometimes I have problems understanding the english you use Let me try to give an answer to what I understand as not-native english-speaker. Yes, I think, we are fixed in type, and we develop some little aspects in our younger years. You wrote about the biography of ENTPs here

    I think ENTP changes dramatically with age. as young kids they are joyous in discovery, teen years are harsh where they migrate often from a gawkiness, socialy uncomfortable to be more outgoing, migrating to late teens early 20s over doing it . . .
    and I find myself in your words. I believe, if you can type a child, and type it 15 years after again, then you get a consistent picture.

    I took an enneagram about 6 weeks ago I came 5, I took it last week I came out 7, I beleive the first site wasn't a good test, I'm not really convienced about enneagrams but I don't know a huge amount about it (and don't get me started on functional anaysis - I may have to start a - how to make your own MBTI segmentation to show case why I don't by it).
    I don't work just with tests. My first test gave me 6, and first I really believed, that was right based on the description. But I read the descriptions of the neighbored types, and found out, that this mistyping was because of a very strong wing. On another site I recognized, that 6 was really impossible. The test gave me 7 as really "unlikely", but 7 was correct.

    So I am sceptical about the correctness of tests. The best test is to evaluate the test-output for yourself. The rest I don't understand in this context

    ________________

    I think there is a difference between men and women, and it's more than type-correlation. But I cannot describe it. I heard about different "ranking systems" (different factors) in male and female sub-societys. Maybe we can work with this thought, if we want to discuss it. Other arguments are coming from biology (it is clear, that different bodys, different neurological structures and different hormonal balance must build different personalities).

    @Whatever:
    You had spoken strictly against having children. I wonder about that. Can you explain your reasons? I thought, there is an subconscious signal to women, which forces them to think about this. Maybe in the later years?

    I ran a thread on ENTP org site on that ENTP men often seem more F than other men, not in an effeminate way, just gentler in some respect.... so it's not just that ENTP women are different from men generaly but ENTP men are different from other men. ENTP men tend to be more cultured, rounder education, more likely to be into art, and the likes ie not football and boxing types....
    Yep, this can be right. If I compare myself with other males, I could think, I am F. Long time I thought I am ENFP, just functional analysis brought the difference.

    All in all my experiences with ENTPs brought: One ENTP-woman, very direct and a sort of gentle aggressiveness. And much ENTP-males, more introverted, but strong when you engage them in some task.
    ** Upgrading my english **
    Corrections for my language are willingly seen


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  9. #159
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liquid and Flammable View Post
    @Whatever:
    You had spoken strictly against having children. I wonder about that. Can you explain your reasons? I thought, there is an subconscious signal to women, which forces them to think about this. Maybe in the later years?

    I really just think that they are pretty annoying and don't like to have to spend so much time on them- I'll admit it- I'm selfish

    I have enough going on with the man and the dog really- and I really don't beleive that its necissary that everyone SHOULD reproduce- so I'm quite willing to remove myself from the gene pool!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  10. #160
    Senior Member tinkerbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liquid and Flammable View Post
    Ah, tinker. Sometimes I have problems understanding the english you use Let me try to give an answer to what I understand as not-native english-speaker. Yes, I think, we are fixed in type, and we develop some little aspects in our younger years. You wrote about the biography of ENTPs here



    and I find myself in your words. I believe, if you can type a child, and type it 15 years after again, then you get a consistent picture.



    I don't work just with tests. My first test gave me 6, and first I really believed, that was right based on the description. But I read the descriptions of the neighbored types, and found out, that this mistyping was because of a very strong wing. On another site I recognized, that 6 was really impossible. The test gave me 7 as really "unlikely", but 7 was correct.

    So I am sceptical about the correctness of tests. The best test is to evaluate the test-output for yourself. The rest I don't understand in this context

    ________________

    I think there is a difference between men and women, and it's more than type-correlation. But I cannot describe it. I heard about different "ranking systems" (different factors) in male and female sub-societys. Maybe we can work with this thought, if we want to discuss it. Other arguments are coming from biology (it is clear, that different bodys, different neurological structures and different hormonal balance must build different personalities).

    @Whatever:
    You had spoken strictly against having children. I wonder about that. Can you explain your reasons? I thought, there is an subconscious signal to women, which forces them to think about this. Maybe in the later years?



    Yep, this can be right. If I compare myself with other males, I could think, I am F. Long time I thought I am ENFP, just functional analysis brought the difference.

    All in all my experiences with ENTPs brought: One ENTP-woman, very direct and a sort of gentle aggressiveness. And much ENTP-males, more introverted, but strong when you engage them in some task.

    I always enjoy your posts....

    I am dyslexic, which makes my English harder, but also I use bad grammer and other stuff... which probably adds even more difficulty, but you do well.

    Ok I see what you mean about the nature nurture thing, I do think peoples types are laid down very early on but there is a development curve... I beleive I was ENTP at 4 but that was a 4 year old ENTP... which is different from an 14 year old one (much less inhibited). I do have a gut feeling that 14-20 people choose to be E or I.... depending on how they choose to develop. A lot of my ENTP people seem pretty artifically E.... like they are I's trying to hard.. that in natural repose they act like chatty I's... (I know t's MBTI E not regular extroversion, and they are totally E really)

    LOL I like your views of Enngrame tests, it sounds about right, I will look at the types and see what fits.... I am skeptical.


    ENTP men are just gentler... difficult to describe, I wouldn't say F, but I really don't know many ENFP's

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