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  1. #161
    Oberon
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    I'm disappointed with my fellow ENTPs for not behaving true to type.

    Who wants a beer?

  2. #162
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    What have you done to refute that?
    Oh jesus...

    For starters,
    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    How does commonality make it any stronger or better? If an ENTP breaks something down into the simplest parts and forms them into a logical framework, the INTP can do no better.

    There IS such a thing as objective truth - a point at which no more information can be gathered, or deduced into a smaller system. I don't see how having a stronger preference for thinking makes the INTP any more capable of it. He might get there first, but that's equally as unlikely because the ENTP seeks information at a higher rate.

    Objectivity is, in all fairness, the culmination of perception and logic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Thank you. Good to see that someone else sees that taking in information doesn't taint objectivity and somehow make it personal. I don't think that makes us more objective necessarily. The fact that we take in more information only matters as long as we use our Ti to break it down and systemize it.


    Disagree. Making inferences doesn't by any means count as a point towards bias. It only serves to give an idea as to what should be searched for. It helps for future perceiving.
    Check the rest of my post history in the thread.

  3. #163
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Oh jesus...

    For starters,




    Check the rest of my post history in the thread.
    Back to square one. What do you understand for objectivity to be. We cant get anywhere until we settle this point.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  4. #164
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    You still dont understand. If I asked you what your intuitions are like, you'd have no way of knowing. Whatever you'd pass off as your answer would be the product of your Ti.
    I can describe my intuitions, and my Thinking isn't likely to be strong enough to impact my description, so what you're reading is from my Ni function. If Fe were part of it, it would likely be more focused on the underlying emotion.

    I begin by interpreting symbols as ideas/concepts, and then looking at what the interrelationships of the ideas to other ideas are. I then select the one that it seems to have the "strongest" connection to, and look where it leads. If I want to be more certain, I carefully examine the interrelationships for "flaws" that could sever them, and then after I've severed the ones with flaws, I follow the strongest one that remains.

    You may well need to use Ti to become conscious of your perceptions, but I believe a dominant Percieiving type such as an ENTP wouldn't necessarily, because their minds are structured differently.

  5. #165
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    You still dont understand. If I asked you what your intuitions are like, you'd have no way of knowing.
    Yes I would.

    Whatever you'd pass off as your answer would be the product of your Ti.
    Fair enough, but that still doesn't make the intuition any less objective.

  6. #166
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Yes I would.

    Fair enough, but that still doesn't make the intuition any less objective.
    Intuition is basically a non-substance. Converted into substance after conscious analysis. However objective you'd be will depend on how well you use your Ti. Since INTPs use Ti better, they'd edge ahead.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  7. #167
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Back to square one. What do you understand for objectivity to be. We cant get anywhere until we settle this point.
    I understand objectivity to be what it is: Not holding personal opinion; being bound to the factual evidence, and gathering as much of it as is necessary to come to an argument which explains, logically why things are the way they are.

    I could elaborate further, but I think if you've got any perceptive ability at all, you'll get it.

  8. #168
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by athenian200 View Post
    I can describe my intuitions, and my Thinking isn't likely to be strong enough to impact my description, so what you're reading is from my Ni function. If Fe were part of it, it would likely be more focused on the underlying emotion.

    I begin by interpreting symbols as ideas/concepts, and then looking at what the interrelationships of the ideas to other ideas are. I then select the one that it seems to have the "strongest" connection to, and look where it leads. If I want to be more certain, I carefully examine the interrelationships for "flaws" that could sever them, and then after I've severed the ones with flaws, I follow the strongest one that remains.

    You may well need to use Ti to become conscious of your perceptions, but I believe a dominant Percieiving type such as an ENTP wouldn't necessarily, because their minds are structured differently.
    You can use Fe to make sense of intuitions because it is a conscious function.

    The more you withdraw into Ni, the less of Fe you have, and therefore the more difficult it will be for you to explain your perceptions to others.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  9. #169
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Intuition is basically a non-substance. Converted into substance after conscious analysis. However objective you'd be will depend on how well you use your Ti. Since INTPs use Ti better, they'd edge ahead.
    That's ridiculous. The Ti doesn't do anything without perception. If you Ti something to death, but have bad information, or not enough of it, you're not objective.

  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    I understand objectivity to be what it is: Not holding personal opinion; being bound to the factual evidence, and gathering as much of it as is necessary to come to an argument which explains, logically why things are the way they are.

    I could elaborate further, but I think if you've got any perceptive ability at all, you'll get it.

    Still not clear enough. We cant depend on Intuition to establish our terms because they will be too ambiguous. And again, we will be using the same words to depict different, if not incompatible ideas.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

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