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  1. #81
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    So it's just the results you're interested in, ok.



    Not saying anything, just proding for motive. Some INTJs will use information like this to help those they care about and often gets misinterperated as condemnation. Or is it the females that do this more often?
    1. Yes the final outcome is something very important in my philosophy.

    2. I don't know about the females to be honest. But yes I come as judgemental quite often if I don't control what I say. What was one of the main reasons why I became so unsponatneous. I simply censor myself more than it is normal.

  2. #82
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I will give a picturesquely example of my behaviour.
    A baby is born and people are happy. Except me, since I keep my head cool. So Instead of being happy I calculate.


    Like this.

    Born 3.12.2005

    Gender female

    Current average life-span of females - 76 years.
    (if it stays the same)

    Estimated time of death 3.12.2081.

    Size of possible error 10%


    Meaning- she will die somewhere between 2076 and 2086.
    I can see where you are coming from, but this assumes you are using a current mortality table. It is pretty unlikely that this table will be accurate 70+ years from now. Changing mortality tables are the reason why pensions are no longer popular, and in the US our Social Security benefits are gradually being reduced. This projection you are making is only as good as the model it is based upon, and all models which make future projects have to be refined and modified over time.

    In essence what I am saying is that the future actually is unpredictable. I agree with you to some extent that life is not totally random and most people will have predictable characteristics, but you go to far in the other direction by putting too much confidence in an arbitrary model.


    EDIT: Just looked through the rest of this thread. Sorry I misinterpreted the original post.


    Here is my $.02. I have noticed that N-dominant thinkers are often less emotional than the T-dominant ones. (Depending on the situation.) This is because sometimes emotions have to do with how "connected" you are to the moment at hand. This "disconnection" can be weird or unnerving to a lot of people. On the other hand I really like to associate with other N-dominants. It's nice to know that you are not the only weirdo in the world. So while typical people may not relate to you, some of the atypical people will really enjoy your company.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
    http://www.revoltingvegetables.com

  3. #83
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    I can see where you are coming from, but this assumes you are using a current mortality table. It is pretty unlikely that this table will be accurate 70+ years from now. Changing mortality tables are the reason why pensions are no longer popular, and in the US our Social Security benefits are gradually being reduced. This projection you are making is only as good as the model it is based upon, and all models which make future projects have to be refined and modified over time.

    In essence what I am saying is that the future actually is unpredictable. I agree with you to some extent that life is not totally random and most people will have predictable characteristics, but you go to far in the other direction by putting too much confidence in an arbitrary model.

    This is why I said that if I would do this for real I would add more variables.
    And the first one would be exactly this one. However if I do that my argument becomes debating of the future and this is not about this thread is about.

  4. #84
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Yeah I just edited my post above. Sorry about the misinterpretation.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
    http://www.revoltingvegetables.com

  5. #85
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post

    Here is my $.02. I have noticed that N-dominant thinkers are often less emotional than the T-dominant ones. (Depending on the situation.) This is because sometimes emotions have to do with how "connected" you are to the moment at hand. This "disconnection" can be weird or unnerving to a lot of people. On the other hand I really like to associate with other N-dominants. It's nice to know that you are not the only weirdo in the world. So while typical people may not relate to you, some of the atypical people will really enjoy your company.

    I agree with this. However I have a problem with N dominant people as well.
    What is due to a fact that I have a very strong Te in the background.
    So I can come as closed-minded or arrogant to them. Basicly you can call this "the problem of my life".

  6. #86
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I agree with this. However I have a problem with N dominant people as well.
    What is due to a fact that I have a very strong Te in the background.
    So I can come as closed-minded or arrogant to them. Basicly you can call this "the problem of my life".
    This is one of those problems that gets worked out with time and effort. As long as you keep trying to connect with people you'll learn how to understand each other. Even if you mess up a current relationship, there will be future ones where you can try again.

    Don't get me wrong. There will always be a lot of people who won't really appreciate an INTJ, but also there will always be people who will. Just have to keep at it.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
    http://www.revoltingvegetables.com

  7. #87
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    This is one of those problems that gets worked out with time and effort. As long as you keep trying to connect with people you'll learn how to understand each other. Even if you mess up a current relationship, there will be future ones where you can try again.

    Don't get me wrong. There will always be a lot of people who won't really appreciate an INTJ, but also there will always be people who will. Just have to keep at it.

    Somehow I doubt that will happen. (unless some deal braker shows up)


    As far as I remember I have never phylosophically klicked with someone as well I did with her. (other guys included)
    It is just that my Te and directness are giving her headaches sometimes.

  8. #88
    brat Mitzy's Avatar
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    try having a baby or getting a pup. maybe that will make you squishier
    She talks pretty but says mean things

  9. #89
    Senior Member Lightyear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    As a person I place almost no value on "the" journey. The only thing that matters to me in is the final outcome and everything else is technically irrelevant.
    However my tendency to go after a defintive outcome scares other people and it makes them uncomfortable quite a bit.
    So this thread will probably look like a joke but I am dead serious about this


    I will give a picturesquely example of my behaviour.
    A baby is born and people are happy. Except me, since I keep my head cool. So Instead of being happy I calculate.


    Like this.

    Born 3.12.2005

    Gender female

    Current average life-span of females - 76 years.
    (if it stays the same)

    Estimated time of death 3.12.2081.

    Size of possible error 10%


    Meaning- she will die somewhere between 2076 and 2086.
    The chances that she will die a violent or somehow tragic death are less than 1% and should not be takes as a likely outcome. Even if probablility exists. Which is further reducing the a fact that she is from a stabile family.
    If something special does not happen her first day at school will be in september of of 2010 or 2011.
    Since childern don't usually fair at this stage of lofe it is likely that she will enter a highschool 8 years later form her first day in school.


    Statistically the chances are that she will be of average intelligence and skills. Or at least somewhere near the average.
    If enought time is invested it can be calculated how much money she can possibly earn in life. Also it is would be advisable to calculate possible minimum and maximum to add flexibility the calculation. The chances of strong deviations from standard are possbible but statistical observations of current population shows that they don't happen to that many individuals.


    Education and talents - unkown at this stage
    However it is unlikely that they will make the child to be that much special that the child wil be much more succesful than children of her age. Gender suggests that it is more likely that she will take a more people oriented carrer.

    Sexual pertners during life -time between 3 and 6
    Number of childern 2 plus 1or2 aborted if current social trends continue.
    Maximum number of childern that she can give birth - Unknown.



    This is where i will stop since I think that everybody got my point. In realty I would be much more concrete since I would have a concrete person to analyse. Also I would place much more variables which I didn't place here since I don't want my example to be too complicated. Plus I would make a few "simulations" as well.


    Basicly I define all major traits and variables at the start. So the journey is something that siimply has to happen to prove me right or wrong. (and nothing more). But generally speaking I am often quite correct about things.
    Since most things are nothing more than a continuation of events from past mixed with statistical odds.



    NPs usually have the bigges problems with this since they can comprehend my logic. But they have a huge need to explore and need to wonder. I basicly kill them when I show them some barrier in their life that is like 10 years ahead. (especially NFPs) Since I place their entire exploring thing in the context of space and time and show them how much time they have left. (or something)

    SJs - either think you are rude or feel uncomfortabe since they can see your J logic which they like at work. But they feel so naked around you. I tend to think that NFJ are similar to SJs when it comes to this.


    While SPs just say "cool" and walk away or they will try to convince that you need profesional help.


    I could say much more but I will leave that for a thread. Instead I will just get to the point.


    Why my thought process / approach makes people so uncomfortabe ?
    I mean because of this I often don't show people who I am. Since people seem to be uncomfortable with idea that things can be that well summarized.

    Basicly this is not about being correct or not this is about approach towards reality.



    More info at post 29.
    Okay, my first thought was that this approach seems too impersonal/cold, like others have said you sound like a cyborg not like a human. I look after kids for a living and if you would analyze the kids I am looking after like this ("human, female, 19 months old,...") I wouldn't want to be around you because your analysis would be factually correct but you would still completely miss the point.

    I think what freaks me out about your approach is that a certain sense of wonder and magic is missing. I remember going to a talk by Stephen Fry and he said that the seemingly unnecessary things in life (like poetry, art, dance, music etc.) are actually the things that make a life worth living. In the same way there is also something special about a child, its spirit, its innocence that makes the child worth far more than the sum of its parts, I suppose all the metaphysical things that you can't measure rationally.

    Or to use a metaphor: Let's imagine we are building a house. Your analysis is like the naked structure of the house, the concrete, the bricks, the empty walls. It's necessary that someone builds these foundations, someone who has a very rational approach. But no one wants to live in such an empty, unwelcoming building, they want to make it beautiful and decorate it, paint the walls in lovely colours, hang art in the living room, put pictures of their loved ones above the fireplace.

    In the same way a person doesn't just want to be seen as a thing to be analysed, because with that you are completely missing the point, their individual beauty and humanity. The same goes for their dreams and hopes, they don't just want them to be analysed coldly because that takes away all hope and wonder. I know there is a time and place to be rational and logical but with this kind of approach you can also completely miss the point. Dreaming and inspiring and encouraging someone instead of looking at the cold facts of their life can birth something great in another human being; hope, a new inspiration, vision, creative expression etc. I think that is one of the gifts of Fe+Ni, it gives the ability to birth hope and inspire in the middle of nothingness and coldness. (That whole explanation reminds me of Obama, I guess he is a major Fe user and he gave people hope again by using it, so now we have to see how his plans translate into reality but he worked as the fuel that got the engine running again by blowing away cynicism.)

  10. #90
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightyear View Post
    Okay, my first thought was that this approach seems too impersonal/cold, like others have said you sound like a cyborg not like a human. I look after kids for a living and if you would analyze the kids I am looking after like this ("human, female, 19 months old,...") I wouldn't want to be around you because your analysis would be factually correct but you would still completely miss the point.

    I think what freaks me out about your approach is that a certain sense of wonder and magic is missing. I remember going to a talk by Stephen Fry and he said that the seemingly unnecessary things in life (like poetry, art, dance, music etc.) are actually the things that make a life worth living. In the same way there is also something special about a child, its spirit, its innocence that makes the child worth far more than the sum of its parts, I suppose all the metaphysical things that you can't measure rationally.

    Or to use a metaphor: Let's imagine we are building a house. Your analysis is like the naked structure of the house, the concrete, the bricks, the empty walls. It's necessary that someone builds these foundations, someone who has a very rational approach. But no one wants to live in such an empty, unwelcoming building, they want to make it beautiful and decorate it, paint the walls in lovely colours, hang art in the living room, put pictures of their loved ones above the fireplace.

    In the same way a person doesn't just want to be seen as a thing to be analysed, because with that you are completely missing the point, their individual beauty and humanity. The same goes for their dreams and hopes, they don't just want them to be analysed coldly because that takes away all hope and wonder. I know there is a time and place to be rational and logical but with this kind of approach you can also completely miss the point. Dreaming and inspiring and encouraging someone instead of looking at the cold facts of their life can birth something great in another human being; hope, a new inspiration, vision, creative expression etc. I think that is one of the gifts of Fe+Ni, it gives the ability to birth hope and inspire in the middle of nothingness and coldness. (That whole explanation reminds me of Obama, I guess he is a major Fe user and he gave people hope again by using it, so now we have to see how his plans translate into reality but he worked as the fuel that got the engine running again by blowing away cynicism.)

    Finally a replay I was looking for .


    People usually think/feel like this about me in real life when I show who I am beneath the skin. I mean I am sorry but this is who I am and I can't be much more different than I am. Of course I have a little bit warmer side but most of the time this is how I operated.


    Just tell me one thing, could ever imagine me as good person if you know all of this about me ?

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