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  1. #11
    Senior Member Nescio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post

    As an example, think about a situation where you've got an ESTJ riding you and picking apart everything you do. He's quick on his toes with his comments, has a quick, common-sense comeback to dispute everything you say. Basically, he's getting the best of you in the verbal back-and-forth and, in turn, he's establishing (in his mind and in others who are listening) that he can out-think you and he has better answers/solutions than you do. These situations aren't everything in life, but they are a part of reality - they do happen, especially in the workplace or in areas of business.
    I can see that. I also think that Ti doesn't necessarily put you at any disadvantage. Rather than defending, I would say make the situation so it isn't a back and forth comment battle.

    before you answer take a nice pause, and take a very "proud" pace while you're speaking, that way any inturuption in your answer will look extremely rude, and it makes you look a lot more inteligent and well thought out. This "proud" also will allow for a little extra thinking time as you speak. (Which is nice and makes for a better thought out answer... one you can't pick apart as easily)

    Also, I'm sure you find a lot of small flaws with the other person's argument. Pick whatever seems most obvious and don't necessarily be critical of it, rather think of a resolution, or two, or three. (I'm sure you can)

    This gives you serious brownie points.
    For cereal yo. (that would be delicous)

    I've noticed that I get frustrated with Ti in these situations because, although I have a very logical answer in my head, I can't always articulate it as quickly as the ESTJ/ENTJ. So, it seems to him and others that he's out-thinking me. But, there comes a breaking point where the frustration builds up and I just let the "filter" go out the window. My thoughts start to fly freely right back at him and there is a good and bad side to this.
    I have a natural tendency to speak as fast as I think If I let go. Even to the point that I might mean to say one word and say another that I'm thinking of as my brain jets off at light speed. Also, stutering. Embarassing.

    If I slow the heck down, I'll beat you to a pulp.

    But that's my problem.


    The bad side of this is that when I turn my Ti into Te it can be very "biting". It can come off extremely harsh, to the point to where people look at you like "Whoa...what the heck did he eat for breakfast this morning?" It can offend, it can burn bridges, it can cause people to say, "I don't see that person as someone I'd want to be friends with" (although there is still some level of respect because they know that you don't take any crap off people).
    "sorry about..."
    goes a long way, if you're worried about people.



    Opinions? I was thinking about resolutions for 2010 (I don't really do the resolution thing), but I thought that maybe I need to work on letting my thoughts fly a little more often. Learning to let myself get to that place where I speak my mind more often (surely it can be accessed in other ways besides being angry) - and trying to tame it a little bit so as to not alienate people, but to still command the respect of those I do business with. I don't put a ton of stock in "getting people's respect", but I bring this up for business purposes. In these kinds of settings, you really have to play hardball sometimes or you end up getting walked on.

    Thoughts from INTP's and others who are familiar with us as to whether or not this is a good strategy or not and why you feel that way?
    If it's going to make life easier for you, there's no question about it.

    My ENTJ brother totally tought me how to deal.
    (he even gives me pointers sometimes)

  2. #12
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    I have a work mode in which my thinking much more resembles dominant Te, but it's not.

    It's more that I turn down my Ne input, and focus more without allowing myself to get too distracted. Making my behaviour seem much more judging, as opposed to perceiving.

    So that's:

    Turning down Ne -> Ti becomes more focused and appears Te, but not really! -> Seemingly become a judger, as opposed to a perceiver, but not really!

    I'm not sure that's really how my 'workmode' works. But it's the best explanation I've got so far.

    Can be very effective to get things done. But I don't really enjoy doing it. I only do this out of neccesity.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  3. #13
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    I have a work mode in which my thinking much more resembles dominant Te, but it's not.

    It's more that I turn down my Ne input, and focus more without allowing myself to get too distracted. Making my behaviour seem much more judging, as opposed to perceiving.

    So that's:

    Turning down Ne -> Ti becomes more focused and appears Te, but not really! -> Seemingly become a judger, as opposed to a perceiver, but not really!

    I'm not sure that's really how my 'workmode' works. But it's the best explanation I've got so far.

    Can be very effective to get things done. But I don't really enjoy doing it. I only do this out of neccesity.
    Yeah, I can relate to this. For me, it's kind of a "get out of my way, I've got stuff to do" mode.

  4. #14
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    First of all, I don't believe there are many/any INTPs running around with great use of Te that developed either naturally or consciously. Te is a function that is far away from our big 4, and rarely gets used/developed because we really don't have to rely on it. However, Te would be extremely useful in some situations if one were able to somehow unearth it and use it effectively. If one takes a cognitive functions test, however, I'm sure that they will find that Te is a highly underused and underdeveloped function sitting far back in the lineup. This presents a GREAT challenge to anyone who would wish to actually use the function consciously in place of Ti. In fact, it's so unlikely that I can only surmise the vast majority of times you believe yourself to be using Te, you are instead using a Ti process, perhaps in conjunction with the other functions to better mimic the use of Te or simply serve the same purpose as Te.

  5. #15
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    First of all, I don't believe there are many/any INTPs running around with great use of Te that developed either naturally or consciously. Te is a function that is far away from our big 4, and rarely gets used/developed because we really don't have to rely on it. However, Te would be extremely useful in some situations if one were able to somehow unearth it and use it effectively. If one takes a cognitive functions test, however, I'm sure that they will find that Te is a highly underused and underdeveloped function sitting far back in lineup. This presents a GREAT challenge to anyone who would wish to actually use the function consciously in place of Ti. In fact, it's so unlikely that I can only surmise the vast majority of times you believe yourself to be using Te, you are instead using a Ti process, perhaps in conjunction with the other functions to better mimic the use of Te.
    I agree! I think that works both ways too. Te->Ti and Ti-Te. You basicly have one, and can attempt to mimic the other. It definatly seems far more likely than being able to use both.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  6. #16
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    I had an experience today with an estj that reminded me of this thread.

    Him: We can just load the software here and export the values.
    Me: I dont think it will work.
    Him (more loudly): Of course it will
    Me (more loudly): No, it doesnt work that way, that's ridiculous
    Him(even more loudly): Hold on look, Ill show you
    Me (even more loudly): Fine, you can try, but it doesnt work and you are wasting time. Just do what I told you before.

    About this point I look up and all of the NTPs are staring at us. My favorite intp says "what are you guys fighting about now?"

    We werent fighting actually at all. We were just having a Te chat.

    So the take home-Te is really blunt, can be loud with an EXTJ, and can sound aggressive, combative, pedantic and rude. However Te users seem to welcome getting this shoved right back at them and expect it. It's how they reshape the idea.

    I'd suggest always confronting any ENTJ if they are wrong. They will respect you greatly for having the balls to stand up.

    I'd suggest confronting an ESTJ on your managerial level bluntly. They will respect and appreciate the direct criticism.

    I'd be wary of confronting estjs above you in front of other people-especially estj women. Give them a chance to save face in private over the incorrect decision. However bluntess still is the way to go.

  7. #17
    Tier 1 Member LunaLuminosity's Avatar
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    Methinks the Te+Ne combination would lead to explosions...

    Also, Ti is way too helpful (and awesome) to replace it. Simply strengthening Te to 3rd or 4th place, as I have done, seems to work a lot better.

  8. #18
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    First of all, Te is anything BUT articulate.

    but yeaah...Te is very directed in it's actions in achieving an end. sometimes i think Te users believe that 'end justifies the means' and that, to me, is scary

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by LunaLuminosity View Post
    Methinks the Te+Ne combination would lead to explosions...

    Also, Ti is way too helpful (and awesome) to replace it. Simply strengthening Te to 3rd or 4th place, as I have done, seems to works a lot better.

    very true

    althoug im not sure if you can call it 'strengthening' the Te. i have found that when people 'strengthen' one of the lower 4 functions, the are usually using a combination of their top 4 functions in a different way. so its possible that its not Te that has strengthened but your 4th function Fe has learnt to listen to Ti

    then again, its just a theory. its based on the premise on what happens when under pressure when your "true" self comes out. if you have multiple functions with the same degree of usability, your gonna be so screwed cuz you won't know which one to use. since this does not happen (far as we know), i think it would be advisable to assume that only thing that changes is the way you use your strong (first 4) functions and not the degree of usability of the lower 4 functions. thats prolly also what happens when people mature

  10. #20
    . Blank's Avatar
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    I'd just like to point out to the naysayers that Te is my second strongest function on my cognitive function analysis test. (It's tied with Ne!) Whenever I'm able to talk about something academically, I can't ever shut the fuck up. I use TeNe to test the waters, and I may occasionally slip in some Ti if I deem the circumstances right.

    Then again, my Enneagram is 5w6, so I wonder if it has anything to do with that.

    Back to the OP: The tiger-snake analogy made me laf.
    Ti = 19 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Te = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ne = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fi = 15 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Si = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ni = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Se = 11[][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fe = 0

    -----------------
    Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
    Man got to sit and wonder why, why, why;
    Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
    Man got to tell himself he understand

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